election wish list...

[Habit7]

Bike a man say? When rainy season hit you going to cycle through flood and rain?

[supercharged turbo]

more emphasis on renewable energy and agriculture

once we have that, everything else will fall in place

This guy gets it.More incentives for hybrid/bi-fuel vehicles and the introduction of more alternatives.Also,stricter regulation for vehicles to be road worthy.Fed up see diesel vehicles pulling off and you hadda keep 5 car lengths behind

[desifemlove]

rain? lil rain never hut nobody...

[88sins]

Bike a man say? When rainy season hit you going to cycle through flood and rain?

I eh tink yuh make outta salt, so i seriously doubt yuh go melt if yuh get wet.

[88sins]

Rapid Rail ... Bike in my a$$

No one wants to park their bike in your ass. tho we all know there's more than enough room that a few could fit


this is 'the election wish list' thread
illegals like you can't vote here, thus have no voice or reason to be here
so what you really should do is

[Habit7]

Bikes are great for metropolises in temperate climates. But in Panama City, Santo Domingo and Caracas they use mass transit.

[88sins]

& all those countries have significantly higher populations & land mass than T&T
it all boils back down to the cost/benefit ratio regardless

[RASC]

Build the highway across the Gulf.
Build the bridge to Tobago.

[Habit7]

& all those countries have significantly higher populations & land mass than T&T
it all boils back down to the cost/benefit ratio regardless

Panama City and Santo Domingo metros have daily boardings of 150,000. POS has 200,000 to 300,000 entering and exiting, not counting those who travel between towns.

[orangefox]

Build the highway across the Gulf.
Build the bridge to Tobago.

Yes bridge to Tobago ..

Bike to Tobago

Now you is are talking ..

[88sins]

& where did you find those stats for transit in/out of POS?

even if we went with a median of 250,000 persons going through POS/day, with T&T's current population being an avg of 1.3 million that's approx. 19% of the population passing through POS daily. And I dare say at most 50% of those would be commuters using public & for hire transportation via taxi, maxi & buses.

These ppl are coming from all over the place, north south, east & west. To develop a rail system that would facilitate even just the majority in the more densely populated areas would, namely east west corridor & central-south, be more than a little difficult from a logistics viewpoint. Some potential passengers along the route would have to either travel great or short distances to a hub.
Rapid rail doh do short drops. So if you live in tunapuna & the nearest hub is in arima & there are no closer hubs, you hadda either go arima before you can go to POS, or take a taxi or drive to POS, negating the purpose of the rail system to begin with.
Rail systems are more efficient when utilized with longer distances between stations & with maximum passengers to use the facility at least during peak transit times

One more thing. When these things cease to function or become unreliable eventually for what ever reason, its the same commuters that bawling for railway systems that will have to face the taxis. & the taxis in turn will increase their fares to capitalize on the opportunity. Fares would make a drastic leap upwards, & is john public will have to pay the price.

I admit an ease up in the traffic situ would be nice, but that rail system idea isn't the way to do it. imho all that would successfully accomplish is to provide them theivin bastards another means to siphon a couple more billion from the treasury.


but if is trax allyuh want, go & tell dem allyuh want trax. then wait & see the end result

[Habit7]

T&T needs commuter railway system

Rowley’s response to Howai’s $61b budget…

Published: 

Monday, September 16, 2013




Opposition Leader Dr Keith Rowley on Friday responded to Finance Minister Larry Howai’s $61.3 billion budget, which was presented last Monday. Today, we conclude the reproduction of extracts from his speaking notes, which were released by the Office of the Opposition Leader. We have absolutely no doubt that the next Government of Trinidad and Tobago will be a PNM Government and we do not seek office and then proceed to practise on stage when the lights go on. We come ready!…and we ready now!!!!


It is with this confidence that we can now begin to outline some of our policies and commitments to filled the people of Trinidad and Tobago with real hope. Despite the misguided attitude and indifference of those on the other side, many transport studies over the years have identified the need for the introduction of a commuter railway system in Trinidad, going as far back as the 1967 National Transportation Plan for Trinidad and Tobago.



More recently, 16 years ago, in 1996, a study by international consultants, Cansult, justified the need for a rapid rail system. Specialist consultants from India came to the same conclusion some years later. 

 

In studying traffic along our main east-west and north-south corridors, Cansult found that the number of people travelling along the East-West Corridor alone was 21,000 per hour in each direction and predicted an increase to 28,000 by 2015. However, an update by Cansult found that the traffic had increased to 30,000 people per hour by 2007. In other words, the traffic on our main roads had increased at many times the rate predicted earlier. 

 

Although hundreds of thousands of our citizens face the daily grind and maddening frustration of traffic log jams, every day, and face hours  in cars to and from work and school, the other side appears unaware that the international benchmark for the introduction of a mass transit system is 10,000 persons per hour.

 

 Further, once traffic reaches 20,000 persons per hour, it is well established that a railway is the only effective mass transit solution because buses simply can’t handle these traffic volumes, nor do roadways exist in Trinidad to accommodate the thousands of buses that would be required to move people quickly and efficiently. 

 

Traffic congestion is negatively affecting the country’s productivity and Trinidad and Tobago has the highest level of traffic in the region. It is a clear indication of the inability of our country’s infrastructure to meet new and growing transportation demands. Fifteen years ago, we crossed the traffic threshold for the introduction of a railway, and five years ago we had gone past this threshold by 50 per cent.

 

It is even worse now, and it is reasonable to conclude that in 2013 that we have more than twice the volume of traffic at which any sensible country would seek to implement a mass transit system. Somebody on the other side must tell the parents and children who wake up at weird hours all over the country to face, twice daily, the certain traffic jams in an ever tightening gridlock on virtually every route, the day  or year when this problem will come to an end. 

 

In June 2008, a contract was awarded to the Trinitrain Consortium for the first phase of a project to design and construct a rail system for Trinidad. Phase 1 involved planning, identification of feasible alternatives, conceptual design and preliminary engineering of the preferred solution. Phase 2 of the project involved detailed design and construction and the final phase involved commissioning and operation of the system.

 

The cost of Phase 1, the engineering phase, was approximately TT$500 million, with the final cost of the railway project, when fully implemented, estimated at approximately TT$10 billion. To put these costs into perspective, the cost for planning and engineering of our critically needed railway project was five per cent of the cost of construction, well within the international benchmark of ten per cent for similar projects. 

 

Compare this to the cost of consultancy fees and other non-construction costs for the billion-dollar Couva Hospital, now being implemented by the present Government, which, at almost $500 million, are estimated at almost 50 per cent of the construction cost of that project, or ten times the percentage for engineering work on the proposed railway project. Similar outrageous non-construction costs are expected for the dubious Penal Hospital project, earmarked to be given on a platter without tender to the infamous SNC-Lavalin company, which has been banned by the World Bank, among other scandalous contract awards by this discredited regime. 

 

Compare the $10 billion cost for a nationwide mass transit rail system with the $ 7.0 billion Highway which may not reach Pt Fortin from Debe. 

 

By May 2010, most of Phase 1 of the railway project had been completed.

 
The route alignment for both the east-west line from Diego Martin to Sangre Grande and the north-south line from Port of Spain to San Fernando had been selected and designed; the station locations had been identified, the preliminary design of the railway stations and depots completed; the land acquisition requirements had been established; the legal framework for the new railway authority had been prepared; the required rolling stock had been identified; the staffing and organizational structure of the railway had been  formulated; contract documentation was well advanced; the maintenance requirements for the railway had been determined, and so on.

 

What did the UNC Government do?  Bad mouth it and throw it out. What did they replace it with? A sneaky attempt at inviting proposals for a rail system from Port-of- Spain to Arima to give one of their friends a contract . When caught and exposed, they abandoned the idea.  What has the country achieved to solve the traffic problem so far ..zilch, nada, absolutely nothing as the problem gets worse every day.

 

The original project was split into segments, to allow easy implementation and to spread the cost over several  years. All this hapless Government had to do was to properly invite tenders for the detailed design and construction of the initial railway segments, and to move full speed ahead. If they had done so, by now, the initial east-west line from Port of Spain to St Augustine and the initial north-south line to Chaguanas would have been completed by now, and thousands of commuters would be travelling to work and school in comfort on a modern rapid railway, getting to work in minutes rather than hours.

 

This project would have truly brought Trinidad and Tobago into the 21st century and created the stimulus for economic growth and diversification, with new commercial and industrial developments and new employment opportunities springing up to serve the new transit system. That would have been real welcomed economic growth rather than having to cheat with random numbers.

 

But like everything else it was a PNM initiative it had to be bad-mouthed, lied about and discarded in the same way they did with the OPVs, Sautt, and the Wallerfield Industrial Park. They almost wrecked UTT. They abandoned the railway project and wasted all of the important pre-construction and planning work that had been done. They wasted 3 years blaming the PNM for every evil under the sun, whilst twiddling their thumbs. They have proposed no viable alternative solution to our traffic and transportation woes. 

 

After all, if the present Government could spend billions of dollars in the Prime Minister’s constituency and elsewhere on every manner of grandiose and unnecessary mega project, designed primarily to benefit friends and family, we can certainly do better by implementing a much-needed infrastructure project that will benefit every single person in Trinidad. 

 

Up on our return to office we will immediately approach the IDB for a review of the current situation; all existing data and engineering work done to date. Once the word is a go, then the PNM commits to giving the highest priority to building a mass transportation rail system to feature service on a backbone from Diego Martin to Sangre Grande with a southern component to La Romaine. 

 

We will seek to obtain IDB long-term concesionary funding to finance this project which will positively change the face and circumstances of Trinidad and Tobago for the next century. The PNM, the party of development of this country, will once again shoulder the responsibility for developing this country and its people. 

 

 

We eagerly look forward also to the many economic benefits of the high local input into the building of the route ways over a period of several years and the phased reduction of the intractable billion dollar fuel subsidy  on completion. 

http://www.guardian.co.tt/news/2013-09- ... way-system

[AbstractPoetic]

Build the bridge to Tobago.

There is roughly 53 miles between the two isles. The longest bridge to date is 24 miles. The construction alone will be impossible. You're talking about driving on a bridge for a a good hour at 70 mph. What of the time differentials if there is traffic? How about reception or if an accident occurs? Could you imagine the disaster that would be to wait for emergency personnel and police officers to even get to an accident site to clear the roadway? Who would want to be waiting out there, over the ocean, in traffic?

[AbstractPoetic]

I would vote for any party who can:

1. Be transparent with their population
2. Less promises and more action
3. Clean up the garbage and trash that fills the roads of TT. Institute a recycling program where plastic and glass are separated from cardboard and paper trash. Anyone who litters should be heavily fined
4. Stop bribing the people or supporting race politics
5. Doesn't sell the country to foreigners and foreign investors

[Habit7]

Build the bridge to Tobago.

There is roughly 53 miles between the two isles. The longest bridge to date is 24 miles. The construction alone will be impossible. You're talking about driving on a bridge for a a good hour at 70 mph. What of the time differentials if there is traffic? How about reception or if an accident occurs? Could you imagine the disaster that would be to wait for emergency personnel and police officers to even get to an accident site to clear the roadway? Who would want to be waiting out there, over the ocean, in traffic?

Its 22 mi between Trinidad and Tobago. The longest sea bridge is 26 mi.

There is a new options available other than a bridge, like a submerged floating tunnel.

[RASC]

Build the bridge to Tobago.

There is roughly 53 miles between the two isles.

Geography

[RASC]

Build the highway across the Gulf.
Build the bridge to Tobago.

And/Or-Ferry Services from Toco to Tobago.

[desifemlove]

& where did you find those stats for transit in/out of POS?

even if we went with a median of 250,000 persons going through POS/day, with T&T's current population being an avg of 1.3 million that's approx. 19% of the population passing through POS daily. And I dare say at most 50% of those would be commuters using public & for hire transportation via taxi, maxi & buses.

These ppl are coming from all over the place, north south, east & west. To develop a rail system that would facilitate even just the majority in the more densely populated areas would, namely east west corridor & central-south, be more than a little difficult from a logistics viewpoint. Some potential passengers along the route would have to either travel great or short distances to a hub.
Rapid rail doh do short drops. So if you live in tunapuna & the nearest hub is in arima & there are no closer hubs, you hadda either go arima before you can go to POS, or take a taxi or drive to POS, negating the purpose of the rail system to begin with.
Rail systems are more efficient when utilized with longer distances between stations & with maximum passengers to use the facility at least during peak transit times

One more thing. When these things cease to function or become unreliable eventually for what ever reason, its the same commuters that bawling for railway systems that will have to face the taxis. & the taxis in turn will increase their fares to capitalize on the opportunity. Fares would make a drastic leap upwards, & is john public will have to pay the price.

I admit an ease up in the traffic situ would be nice, but that rail system idea isn't the way to do it. imho all that would successfully accomplish is to provide them theivin bastards another means to siphon a couple more billion from the treasury.


but if is trax allyuh want, go & tell dem allyuh want trax. then wait & see the end result

entirely plausible. why shouldn't it be? Considering people from all over, even Tobago, go to Town on a daily basis, I doh see why 250,000 is any wild figure. the entire island is a metro area for POS.

and on a Town to Grande line, yuh could have express trains running twice per hour from Grande to POS with few stops, and 4 times an hour in peak times, and de rest stopping at every other stop. Or an initial phase can be tram lines in each major city/town. saying "no demand" for a tram connecting Felicity wit Downtown Chag. through to Montrose, or the Savannah to the Avenue to Movietowne, to Woodford Square to City Gate is..well bull....

Fact is if T&T is to develop economically, we cyah just rely on cars alone. Tram lines CAN work.

[zoom rader]

Tuners saying they want Trams, Trains and bikes. All of those means we all had before and moved on.
Trinis are ignorant ,unhealthy and care less about cyclist.
Day after day cyclist get abuse and cuss from motorist, whom probably never rode a bike.
Cyclist in this day need police escort just to ride their bike and be sheltered from bike hating motorist.
Trains in Trinidad was destroyed by the motor industry and scrap dealers that convinced the then PNM to get rid of them for their gain.
Bring trains and car industry will have an uproar over income from car sales to mango tree mechanic Harrylal and washerman kwame.
A next fool say bridge to Tobago, this time kubs & Garry Aboud will probably go on a real hunger strike to protect turtles and to pander to whom ever in opposition.

Do we need trains, yes. As we know in the case of buses the Trains will get corrupted from building it to maintenance .

[orangefox]

Hmmm ..

a bridge to Venezuela would make more sense ...

it could be financially possible with private investment, government investment and bonds on the open market....the tolls could also help in giving back payback and revenue to the government.

[88sins]

analfox, must you forever display your stupidity in front of persons with a low tolerance for it?
ppl tired of you a long while now yuh kno.

[RASC]

88sins.
Leave him alone and don't call him names.
The thread is semi decent as is, with genuine ideas ... Just ignore or else it'll turn into a sparring match.

Orange fox, just think before you type please.
And even if your idea may sound outlandish-as there really is no wrong answer-explain yourself fully. An idea like that, you would need to sell it to as...as it's beyond feasible.

[88sins]

Build a bridge to a foreign sovereign nation, that has a history of dictator style politics & military belligerence in general to it's own nationals & foreigners?
Build a bridge to a foreign sovereign nation, that is a significant contributor to T&T's illegal immigrant problems.
Build a bridge to a foreign sovereign nation, that would if given the opportunity pilfer T&T's offshore natural resources?


RASC, you may play nicely with others if you so desire, & I applaud you for such conduct.
I however am prone to calling a spade a spade, not a soil relocation engineered apparatus.
If I am in the wrong for being blunt, honest, & intolerant of stupidity then boi what ah go tell yuh. ah go be in d wrong till ah dead. & i cool wid dat


some others may need to find a way to cope with it tho

[orangefox]

88sins.
Leave him alone and don't call him names.
The thread is semi decent as is, with genuine ideas ... Just ignore or else it'll turn into a sparring match.

Orange fox, just think before you type please.
And even if your idea may sound outlandish-as there really is no wrong answer-explain yourself fully. An idea like that, you would need to sell it to as...as it's beyond feasible.

Is it not an election "wish list " ?

Some wish BIG and some wish smalley

Fox wishes a direct link via a bridge to South America via Venezuela ..

Fox wish Big ...


Maybe Rapd Rail to South America ?

You ever hear about the Euro Zone in Europe ?

Again a wish ? Ok, move on ... Bridge to Tobago also

Civilization has progressed due to links via Bridges, alternate routes etc.

Just wish and move Hoss !

[zoom rader]

88sins.
Leave him alone and don't call him names.
The thread is semi decent as is, with genuine ideas ... Just ignore or else it'll turn into a sparring match.

Orange fox, just think before you type please.
And even if your idea may sound outlandish-as there really is no wrong answer-explain yourself fully. An idea like that, you would need to sell it to as...as it's beyond feasible.

Is it not an election "wish list " ?

Some wish BIG and some wish smalley

Fox wishes a direct link via a bridge to South America via Venezuela ..

Fox wish Big ...


Maybe Rapd Rail to South America ?

You ever hear about the Euro Zone in Europe ?

Again a wish ? Ok, move on ... Bridge to Tobago also

Civilization has progressed due to links via Bridges, alternate routes etc.

Just wish and move Hoss !

Fox doh study dem hoss cuase meanwhile in the UK

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... paign=1490

[alex jj]

what would be the benefits of building a bridge to tobago, the ferry from toco to tobago sounding better...to build a bridge to tobago a highway would be needed to toco..how about building a highway to toco and have barge type boats where cars drive on top and are carried to tobago and jus drive off... at the same time the people of the north east would benefit but kubs might die.... orangefox the brige to vene makes no sense.. there already is a boat that goes or ppl can fly

[orangefox]

88sins.
Leave him alone and don't call him names.
The thread is semi decent as is, with genuine ideas ... Just ignore or else it'll turn into a sparring match.

Orange fox, just think before you type please.
And even if your idea may sound outlandish-as there really is no wrong answer-explain yourself fully. An idea like that, you would need to sell it to as...as it's beyond feasible.

Is it not an election "wish list " ?

Some wish BIG and some wish smalley

Fox wishes a direct link via a bridge to South America via Venezuela ..

Fox wish Big ...


Maybe Rapd Rail to South America ?

You ever hear about the Euro Zone in Europe ?

Again a wish ? Ok, move on ... Bridge to Tobago also

Civilization has progressed due to links via Bridges, alternate routes etc.

Just wish and move Hoss !

Fox doh study dem hoss cuase meanwhile in the UK

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... paign=1490

Fox know ZR man of vision .. now

Maybe someday you can explain to these "country folks " South of the Macaroni Bridge about the
Panama Canal and Suez Canal ... and Haggis .. and why Beetham Estate Gardens still exist

[Slartibartfast]

Bike a man say? When rainy season hit you going to cycle through flood and rain?

Bike for sunny mornings (which are a mojority) and motorcycle with a rain suit for rainy mornings (which is what I currently use). The trip home doesn't matter since I could change once I reach so I don't mind takin a lil wetting. And before you ask, yes I have ridden my motorcycle in stormy weather where there is 3 inches of water on the highway and you can only see one car length ahead, day and night. Real bike man does ride in all weather.

[matthewmazda]

help the poor and old

[Habit7]

Bike a man say? When rainy season hit you going to cycle through flood and rain?

Bike for sunny mornings (which are a mojority) and motorcycle with a rain suit for rainy mornings (which is what I currently use). The trip home doesn't matter since I could change once I reach so I don't mind takin a lil wetting. And before you ask, yes I have ridden my motorcycle in stormy weather where there is 3 inches of water on the highway and you can only see one car length ahead, day and night. Real bike man does ride in all weather.

But you talking about a bike with a gasoline engine. He is talking about a bike with peddle power.