End of ICE (Internal Combustion Engines)

[Supra GT-FOUR]

hydrogen fuel is an option, but what killing it is the lack of technology to make it attractive as an alternative.
Most using tanks you will fill at a station. That can get expensive, and inconvenient.
But let's say that there was an efficient way to provide all the hydrogen one might need by way of an on-board process of electrolysis. If that were possible, hydrogen fueled vehicles would become an extremely attractive product.

Not sure about tank sizes since they don't carry it onboard as fuel like CNG. It's actually a chemical reaction in a cell where a by product is electricty for an electric vehicle. How efficient the process is will determine tank sizes.

Those you mentioned using hydrogen fuel cells are what's being developed today. They aren't very efficient, and are rather expensive.
But I wonder why not just develop an engine to run efficiently on hydrogen gas?

https://youtu.be/DGL5g91KwLA?si=THUsecZweJ_bLYVK
Toyota has developed a liquid hydrogen combustion engine.
They are working on the technology.

[88sins]

Yes, but liquid H isn't a viable solution, mainly because of the general lack of available infrastructure wrt refueling.
I meant, why not develop a system that contains an efficient electrolysis setup that can produce H gas on-board the vehicle?

[maj. tom]

Toyota is working on a hydrogen internal combustion engine. Japan automakers like Suzuki, Yamaha, Toyota and Honda have all been doing a lot of R&D in the past decade on hydrogen power. And it's also a matter of laying the infrastructure for the public like hydrogen production stations in a region, which Toyota has done a bit in California. After 2035 with the end of gasoline cars in Europe I think hydrogen will become the sustainable energy economy.

The reality is that the current model of electric cars based on the Tesla is simply not sustainable very long term for us or the earth. The price of the vehicles, charging times, limited mileage and additional grid electricity consumption, most of which is wasted as heat, to the pollution created through mining, transport and manufacturing of those power cells, very dirty stuff.

[adnj]

.....

[nervewrecker]

Toyota is working on a hydrogen internal combustion engine. Japan automakers like Suzuki, Yamaha, Toyota and Honda have all been doing a lot of R&D in the past decade on hydrogen power. And it's also a matter of laying the infrastructure for the public like hydrogen production stations in a region, which Toyota has done a bit in California. After 2035 with the end of gasoline cars in Europe I think hydrogen will become the sustainable energy economy.

The reality is that the current model of electric cars based on the Tesla is simply not sustainable very long term for us or the earth. The price of the vehicles, charging times, limited mileage and additional grid electricity consumption, most of which is wasted as heat, to the pollution created through mining, transport and manufacturing of those power cells, very dirty stuff.

Battery technology is also evolving rapidly. There is the Graphene ion produced by skeleton technologies in germany, sodium ion (can't remember who) and nuclear diamond that Toyota was supposed to run trails on with the new hybrids.

They have faster charging rates, larger energy density and longer lifespans. The nuclear diamond esp is a solution to nuclear waste disposal so we may see nuclear energy becoming a cleaner more viable option in the future.

[maj. tom]

A new survey from Consumer Reports has troubling news concerning electric vehicles (EVs) as owners say they are less reliable than gas powered cars. https://www.consumerreports.org/cars/car-reliability-owner-satisfaction/who-makes-the-most-reliable-cars-a7824554938/

While EVs are growing in popularity, owners of electric vehicles experience 79 per cent more problems with their EVs compared to gas-powered cars.

[zoom rader]

The electric con job continues

Fools and their money are soon parted

[Les Bain]

Still taking this in. I wouldn't mind an EV as a 2nd daily driver car but I'm not a fan of how motor journalists harping on power and straight line performance. In daily driving conditions it's still a single gear vehicle of tomblike silence.

[88sins]

Still trying to understand, why no car manufacturer has decided to make an ev and cover the roof, hood and trunk lid of with solar panels. Car will charge itself while parked, even while in use, and save the owner some money on the electric bill.

[zoom rader]

Still trying to understand, why no car manufacturer has decided to make an ev and cover the roof, hood and trunk lid of with solar panels. Car will charge itself while parked, even while in use, and save the owner some money on the electric bill.

Don't get duped into the EV con

[Supra GT-FOUR]

Still trying to understand, why no car manufacturer has decided to make an ev and cover the roof, hood and trunk lid of with solar panels. Car will charge itself while parked, even while in use, and save the owner some money on the electric bill.

https://www.motortrend.com/features/the-2023-toyota-prius-primes-battery-could-take-three-weeks-to-recharge/

[kamakazi]

Still trying to understand, why no car manufacturer has decided to make an ev and cover the roof, hood and trunk lid of with solar panels. Car will charge itself while parked, even while in use, and save the owner some money on the electric bill.

Because generating approximately 8Kwh in one day given ideal conditions) while having to motor around the additional weight and some of the most toxic chemicals known to mankind. Add in the additional cost.

[Rovin]

Still taking this in. I wouldn't mind an EV as a 2nd daily driver car but I'm not a fan of how motor journalists harping on power and straight line performance. In daily driving conditions it's still a single gear vehicle of tomblike silence.

that vid come across my YT last night & i end up watching it

i appreciate all d technology & explanations but basically is rel hyping, salesmanship, marketing & it still looks a car from d days of 16bit video games

like is 1 color too like d delorean or meh samsung fridge , maybe they cuda anodize it to offer some colors

at us100k+ if that was to reach here wud be nearly 1mil ? ... either way too rich for me & i not a pickup kinda guy

[adnj]

.....

[ek4ever]

And what about the infrastructure to charge EVs? To date none of the charging services in the US are profitable so it would be far worse for Trinidad. Not to mention the costs to replace battery packs which no one talking about. An Ioniq 5 owner in Vancouver scratched underside of vehicle including battery pack....cost to replace battery....CAD$60,000, and we all know how great roads in Trinidad maintained. Another Tesla owner drove through some high water and damaged battery pack....voided warranty.....US$ 1000s to replace. I'm sure hours sitting in traffic with AC on gonna kill range, and would you have easy access to chargers where you going

[j.o.e]

And what about the infrastructure to charge EVs? To date none of the charging services in the US are profitable so it would be far worse for Trinidad. Not to mention the costs to replace battery packs which no one talking about. An Ioniq 5 owner in Vancouver scratched underside of vehicle including battery pack....cost to replace battery....CAD$60,000, and we all know how great roads in Trinidad maintained. Another Tesla owner drove through some high water and damaged battery pack....voided warranty.....US$ 1000s to replace. I'm sure hours sitting in traffic with AC on gonna kill range, and would you have easy access to chargers where you going

Pros and cons but also remember trinidad is significantly smaller (no one drives over 400kms a day ) ….. electricity is very cheap in trinidad and most people can get by charging at home. Don’t let bigger countries rustle your jimmies.
Traffic is not unique to trinidad. Even in my ICE cars I’m not driving through floods ….. I much prefer to wait it out.
I don’t own an electric (would consider) once the initial buy in is reasonable.

[Duane 3NE 2NR]

Honda and Nissan sign an agreement to work together to build new electric vehicles

https://www.topgear.com/car-news/electr ... d-new-evs#

“it’s probably happening now because of the pace of electric car development in China.”

[Habit7]

Honda running to Nissan to make EVs after they failed with GM. Nissan makes good EVs and Honda doesn’t. Nissan should leave Honda on their own to fend for themselves. They big and have sense.

[Les Bain]

Looks like the Cybertruck playing 4 dimensional chess with motorists.

https://slate.com/technology/2024/03/te ... ident.html

[Duane 3NE 2NR]

Recycling lithium batteries from electric vehicles, cellphones and power tools

[MG Man]

Still trying to understand, why no car manufacturer has decided to make an ev and cover the roof, hood and trunk lid of with solar panels. Car will charge itself while parked, even while in use, and save the owner some money on the electric bill.

Aptera is trying it
They're building a three wheeled 2 seater shaped like a fish...why 3 wheels? Can't fit 2 rear wheels in the back and still keep the fishy profile
Why fish / teardrop? It needs to be as slippery as possible
Why as slippery as possible? It needs to be as frivolous with battery consumption as possible
Why does it need to be frivolous with power usage? Because even with the whole top covered in solar panels, current efficiency limits how much juice those panels can generate in a day
The Aptera will give about 40 miles of range on a full solar charge....so basically if you have a short commute, it's theoretically possible to run on 100% solar without ever having to plug it in
It does offer plug-in capability and differet range options based on battery size, for longer journeys
But long and short is solar alone can't generate enough power quick enough to run a traditional sedan, far less an SUV or pickup
Too many compromises to make it mainstream-feasible

[Dizzy28]

Still trying to understand, why no car manufacturer has decided to make an ev and cover the roof, hood and trunk lid of with solar panels. Car will charge itself while parked, even while in use, and save the owner some money on the electric bill.

Aptera is trying it
They're building a three wheeled 2 seater shaped like a fish...why 3 wheels? Can't fit 2 rear wheels in the back and still keep the fishy profile
Why fish / teardrop? It needs to be as slippery as possible
Why as slippery as possible? It needs to be as frivolous with battery consumption as possible
Why does it need to be frivolous with power usage? Because even with the whole top covered in solar panels, current efficiency limits how much juice those panels can generate in a day
The Aptera will give about 40 miles of range on a full solar charge....so basically if you have a short commute, it's theoretically possible to run on 100% solar without ever having to plug it in
It does offer plug-in capability and differet range options based on battery size, for longer journeys
But long and short is solar alone can't generate enough power quick enough to run a traditional sedan, far less an SUV or pickup
Too many compromises to make it mainstream-feasible

Last yeart Marquees Brownlee reviewed a Toyota Prius with a solar panel roof (Prius Prime). IIRC being parked all day in the sun added a few kms worth of charge to the battery.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=usqSJ7zbTLQ

[88sins]

Aptera is trying it
They're building a three wheeled 2 seater shaped like a fish...why 3 wheels? Can't fit 2 rear wheels in the back and still keep the fishy profile
Why fish / teardrop? It needs to be as slippery as possible
Why as slippery as possible? It needs to be as frivolous with battery consumption as possible
Why does it need to be frivolous with power usage? Because even with the whole top covered in solar panels, current efficiency limits how much juice those panels can generate in a day
The Aptera will give about 40 miles of range on a full solar charge....so basically if you have a short commute, it's theoretically possible to run on 100% solar without ever having to plug it in
It does offer plug-in capability and differet range options based on battery size, for longer journeys
But long and short is solar alone can't generate enough power quick enough to run a traditional sedan, far less an SUV or pickup
Too many compromises to make it mainstream-feasible

To increase surface area so you can add more panels which would equate to better charging rate, place them double stacked at a 45* angle. But this however will create two new problems, additional weight, and lowered aerodynamics.
Unless they could cut the weight of the panels in less than half.
Or maybe a small, light weight but very powerful wind turbine on the back? So as you drive, turning spins and generates power. But even that must be small enough and light enough to not cause added weight or drag.


It must have a way.

[MG Man]

Aptera is trying it
They're building a three wheeled 2 seater shaped like a fish...why 3 wheels? Can't fit 2 rear wheels in the back and still keep the fishy profile
Why fish / teardrop? It needs to be as slippery as possible
Why as slippery as possible? It needs to be as frivolous with battery consumption as possible
Why does it need to be frivolous with power usage? Because even with the whole top covered in solar panels, current efficiency limits how much juice those panels can generate in a day
The Aptera will give about 40 miles of range on a full solar charge....so basically if you have a short commute, it's theoretically possible to run on 100% solar without ever having to plug it in
It does offer plug-in capability and differet range options based on battery size, for longer journeys
But long and short is solar alone can't generate enough power quick enough to run a traditional sedan, far less an SUV or pickup
Too many compromises to make it mainstream-feasible

To increase surface area so you can add more panels which would equate to better charging rate, place them double stacked at a 45* angle. But this however will create two new problems, additional weight, and lowered aerodynamics.
Unless they could cut the weight of the panels in less than half.
Or maybe a small, light weight but very powerful wind turbine on the back? So as you drive, turning spins and generates power. But even that must be small enough and light enough to not cause added weight or drag.


It must have a way.

check out Aptera's site. They go into a lot of detail on doing a full solar powered car. There's a limit to how much juice solar panels can generate. Basically the whole top of their max-range model is high efficiency solar cells.
Think about it....the best fast-charging stations need a fair amount of time to go from 20% to 10% range on typical EVs. Solar cells can't match that

[88sins]

Charge time efficiency isn't so much the problem. Don't get me wrong, it's a consideration. Just not the sole or primary consideration.
The real issue is can they be made to charge themselves with maximum efficiency and at the same time be as energy efficient as possible to maximize the use of that self efficiency?
In my thinking, the charging doesn't HAVE to be strictly via solar power. Tandem or integrated charging systems may be an option.

[sMASH]

The sun exposed surfaces might get u about 3, 4 0r even 500w of solar power in the right conditions.
But charging the batteries is in the 10's of kilowatts.
The costs outweigh the performance in typical cars.


But on something like a maxi, that might actually do sumting.

[88sins]

The sun exposed surfaces might get u about 3, 4 0r even 500w of solar power in the right conditions.
But charging the batteries is in the 10's of kilowatts.
The costs outweigh the performance in typical cars.


But on something like a maxi, that might actually do sumting.

Might be viable also for light vehicles that basically parked in the sun all day and don't make long runs.
I'm thinking along the lines of San Juan to PoS distances or shorter, and the car parked from say 6 am to 5 pm in the open.
Additionally it should have a charging system for a charging station connection as well, so the solar aspect of charging is really a supplementary thing

[redmanjp]

would 500w be enough to partially directly power the car once it reaches a steady speed (no more acceleration) ? that way u wont even have to charge/recharge as much.

[Habit7]

[sMASH]

would 500w be enough to partially directly power the car once it reaches a steady speed (no more acceleration) ? that way u wont even have to charge/recharge as much.

I don't have experience with ev motors, but a vehicle is quite heavy, so power to accelerate it would be substantial. considering a lil drill might be around 500w, if that could push a car.... I not seeing it.


Above said u might get a km or 2... I assume thats optimistic.



Imo, compact cars better for full plug in ev... For city driving and routine daily commutes where the time available for recharge is significant and regular.

And. Everything else, diesel electric with plug in capability.