Super unleaded and my 4AGE 20v

[Swifted]

yuh NOT willing to pay the $4/L, but you willing to stand by de pumps and play see-saw with 50/50 super/prem. AND throw in an additive that's costing you $$$'s?? i doh understand Trinis yes!! pay de Forking $4/L and hush yuh mout! you know how MUCH gas is in the US/England?? and we still using TT$'s 6.3:$1US!

[smokey1275]

Are you guys maddd. the 20v is supposed to be running on 100 octane so even with premium u running on the knock sensor. the ecu can only retard the ignition so much. it will only take one reel hot day and one to many heavy foot and u will be in the bamboo lookin for a new engine. please im pissed with the hike in gas too but its still cheeper than an engine, and further more my research has shown what is shown as 95 for premium is actually an average and its realy 92 making super realy 89, so unless u never pass half throttle at 4000 rpm please dont run super in yah 20v or yah 2zz or any of the newer engines that supposed to run on 100 octane. bless.

dawg , i hear you there , but realistically speaking , there are many st 's and bt's running on the lower than japansese average > the performance we are seeing is just the mapped average based on feedback from as your correctly stated , al al knock sensor.In america there are guys running on worse gas than us and still doing good enough .Remember the states run 87-91 some places 87-89 . On some international forums i've not seen many engines destroyed , due to the knock sensor's job of saving the engine from detonation.

You comparing US and JDM.

Wonder why US engine specs always lower than JDM? Sure environmental pollution has most to do with it but...

Maybe but we're the middle gorund at so called 92-95, difference we at 1013 mb of pressure and the mean air temps are hot here which affect input values to our computers.

[Terran]

i throw in a $25 bottle of 0-60 octane booster and most of the band players gone home.......

Some guys are arguing that it is more costly to use gas treatment PLUS super than to run straight premium alone.

So my question was this:

If 50 litres of super costs $135.00

and 50 litres of premium costs $200.00

then what gas treatment are they using that costs upwards of $65.00 per tank of gas? The cost of the gas treatment has to be more then $65.00 per tank if the cost if super PLUS gas treatment costs more than running premium alone.

[Strauss]

yuh NOT willing to pay the $4/L, but you willing to stand by de pumps and play see-saw with 50/50 super/prem. AND throw in an additive that's costing you $$$'s?? i doh understand Trinis yes!! pay de Forking $4/L and hush yuh mout! you know how MUCH gas is in the US/England?? and we still using TT$'s 6.3:$1US!

I using Premium.

BTW England CONSUMES more petroleum than it produces. Same for the United States (more than twice the amount).

Is this the same for Trinidad?

Don't be fooled by PNM bullsh!t.

[pyromaniak]

I'll be using premium and driving more responsibly, I sometimes get knock with premium and all so I throw in an octane boost every once in a while. Super is a no-no with 11:1 compression

[Swifted]

Don't be fooled by PNM bullsh!t.

PNM BS, pffft!!

...never even crossed my mind! I didn't Vote them back in power!

[Terran]

Guys, I know this is late notice, but here's how it goes:

I am inviting you all to a live concert over the next 2 nights or so.

NEAL & MASSY ALL STARS, LIVE IN CONCERT...

I will pick you all up, and take you all for the live show!

The venue: MY CAR.
Time: any time you can make it, once I'm driving somewhere.

The acoustics are GREAT! Air condition comfort, you don't need to wind down the windows!

This is for a limited time only, folks! Book advanced seating right HERE! Accommodation will be for two passengers only because I need to change springs (still). Safety is still a priority, so I will not be exceeding 60km/h. Even my exhaust will not dampen the sound!

Like I said, I know this is late notice, but it is for a limited time only. After the next couple of showings, the band will not be trying anything "super" ANYMORE.

[Terran]

Yes, the MOFO is pinging... BIG TIME!

Like Hook, the engine pings on premium too, but NOT THIS BAD.

I done. Super my ass!

[Sully]

If there is so much of a concern with the fuel cost, then get rid of the 20V and put in a 5AFE or something like that. As someone mentioned earlier, the recommended RON for a BT 20V is 101. We're already far from it, so why even bother considering super.

It all comes down to You can't have your cake and eat it too.

[Hook]

water injection anyone?

[dutyspeed]

i have a 20 v in my car and from day 1 i'm usin super wit no complaints

[katurbobeast]

hmmm

[corolladude]

well well well, silver top 20v inside, when i put in my engine 3 + years ago i start using super, still have the spark plugs fron japan, never serviced the fuel system, except change fuel filter, cut the filter open and saw nothing much,usal shet, the car was parked up for 6 months to do body job and was never started, when started, drive for about 4 days until put gas, and all that was a year ago, i drive every day , an who knows me, know i dont pet my enging....no problemo up to now.........time for a service.....

[katurbobeast]

yuh should of smelt your gas after those 6mths, gas begines to go stale after i believe...something like 15days...and if u have never smelt bad gas before yuh should, so u will know what stale gas smells like...

i see it all the time working on all diffferent types of engines......and ppl wanna know y there engines not performing properly or engine hard starting,etc.....
i have seen carburetors gummed up and varnished to the point where its like glue....premium or super gas....doesnt matter

[dmitc]

Same engine type and a whole lot of different results wrt gas.
i think i'm going to have to play it safe and stay with premium, especially since the price of importing car parts are going up by next month according to a parts dealer i was talking to.

[droppa]

plugs, timing and compression have alot to do with the differences experiencing across similar engine types

[Terran]

I experienced highly favourable results initially with the super. But by the third tank, things started to go... wrong. Engine knock, stuttering on take-off and throughout the mid-range, big loss in torque and HP - I think even a stock B14 would beat me!

I eventually ran down my last tank of super to within 10 litres, and refilled on premium. I didn't add any additive this time. Performance is returning, albeit slowly, and the engine seems to be coming around once more. Engine knock has reduced considerably, torque and HP are improving, stuttering has reduced, and I can hardly wait to swing to 8500 rpm once more!

[Strauss]

i have a 20 v in my car and from day 1 i'm usin super wit no complaints

So therefore you don't know what it's like to run it with premium for a while to compare the difference?

No wonder so much of you men is get eat up.

[Hook]

^^^

[cinco]

how many of you guys have opened up your 20v's to see what the inside looks like or the ecu?
the differences in everyones experience may just be where the engine came from what year or if the previous owner messed with it i mean it is a used engine you running.

and bad gas smells worse than a$$ mixed with rotten eggs

[trdboy]

well well well, silver top 20v inside, when i put in my engine 3 + years ago i start using super, still have the spark plugs fron japan, never serviced the fuel system, except change fuel filter, cut the filter open and saw nothing much,usal shet, the car was parked up for 6 months to do body job and was never started, when started, drive for about 4 days until put gas, and all that was a year ago, i drive every day , an who knows me, know i dont pet my enging....no problemo up to now.........time for a service.....

corolladude shits u not!!! this man does run his car to the max, just go on the cross on a saturday and u go see he eating up some some hondas and even some blacktop 20v, one of the fastest silvertop 20v i know and i now find out he running super!!! hmmmm....... reali makes u wonder yes...

[trdboy]

i throw in a $25 bottle of 0-60 octane booster and most of the band players gone home.......

Some guys are arguing that it is more costly to use gas treatment PLUS super than to run straight premium alone.

So my question was this:

If 50 litres of super costs $135.00

and 50 litres of premium costs $200.00

then what gas treatment are they using that costs upwards of $65.00 per tank of gas? The cost of the gas treatment has to be more then $65.00 per tank if the cost if super PLUS gas treatment costs more than running premium alone.

ok guys where is the chemistry behind all these claims, adding a fuel treatment to super doesnt make the increment of the research octane number linear but but insignificantly incremental. These hypotheses needs to be tested and i more than willing to make my services available, so give me a premium sample, a super sample and a super blended with a treatment sample and i will have these analyzed under and exteded analysis of chromatography and then post the results....but please keep in mind octanes are not the oly factor invloved.......

Octane rating

The most important characteristic of gasoline is its Research Octane Number (RON) or octane rating, which is a measure of how resistant gasoline is to premature detonation ( knocking). It is measured relative to a mixture of 2,2,4-trimethylpentane (an octane) and n- heptane. So an 87-octane gasoline has the same knock resistance as a mixture of 87% isooctane and 13% n-heptane.

There is another type of Octane, called "Motor Octane Number" (MON), which is a better measure of how the fuel behaves when under load. Its definition is also based on the mixture of isooctane and n-heptane that has the same performance. Depending on the composition of the fuel, the MON of a modern gasoline will be about 10 points lower than the RON. Normally fuel specifications require both a minimum RON and a minimum MON.

In most countries (including all of Europe and Australia) the 'headline' octane that would be shown on the pump is the RON: but in the United States and some other countries the headline number is the average of the RON and the MON, sometimes called the "roaD Octane Number" or DON, or (R+M)/2. Because of the 10 point difference noted above this means that the octane in the United States will be about 5 points lower than the same fuel elsewhere: 87 octane fuel, the "normal" gasoline in the US and Canada, would be 92 in Europe.

Romania is a supplier of "light-sweet" crude oil, which, when distilled, resulted in a gasoline with an 87 rating (DON).

It is possible for a fuel to have a RON greater than 100, because isooctane is not the most knock-resistant substance available. Racing fuels, Avgas and LPG typically have octane ratings of 110 or significantly higher.

It might seem odd that fuels with higher octane ratings burn less easily, yet are popularly thought of as more powerful. Using a fuel with a higher octane lets an engine be run at a higher compression ratio without having problems with knock. Compression is directly related to power, so engines that require higher octane usually deliver more power. Some high-performance engines are designed to operate with a compression ratio associated with high octane numbers, and thus demand high-octane gasoline. It should be noted that the power output of an engine also depends on the energy content of its fuel, which bears no simple relationship to the octane rating. Some people believe that adding a higher octane fuel to their engine will increase its performance or lessen its fuel consumption; this is false - engines perform best when using fuel with the octane rating they were designed for.

The octane rating was developed by the chemist Russell Marker. The selection of n- heptane as the zero point of the scale was due to the availability of very high purity n-heptane, not mixed with other isomers of heptane or octane, distilled from the resin of Jeffrey Pine. Other sources of heptane produced from crude oil contain a mixture of different isomers with greatly differing ratings, which would not give a precise zero point.

[TESTED performance]

whew thanks nigel i thought i was going to have to type that. lol
TTE sums up the problem in a nutshell. anyone who punishes the 20V everyday on the highway at high RPM the way i do from POS to Sando everyday will get probably less than half the mileage they should out of the engine before needing to replace piston rings if the correct fuel octane requirements are not met.
Nobody says that the engine will suddenly go up in flames if you let a drop of super trickle into your EFI. If you are a "round the town" user of the 20V you could probably fill up with diesel and never notice a difference. corolladude, what you dont realize is that as great as you think your engine was working with super in it if it was properly dialed in with a higher octane fuel you could have ran more spark advance with less knock retard and get significantly more power to the wheels. i'm not saying this by guess as i remember pulling up behind your car one evening at the pleasantville traffic lights and after you pulled off i followed you and almost ran into the back of your car by the time my car hit 7000 RPM.
the 20V blacktop engine has been dubbed by some as toyota's CLOSEST TO RACE SPEC engine. IT WAS AND IS AND NEVER WILL BE AN ECCONOMY ORIENTED ENGINE. The reason why we get away with the lower octane fuel choice is because of how strong the engine components actually are and the fail safe measures implemented from the factory to prolong the life of the engine. point is super may work for you for the rest of your life with no problem. but if you ever have the privilege that i did to have a mechanic trained by toyota in japan on these engines to tune up the car with 100 octane unleaded premium fuel (check sherrif in sando) THEN and only THEN you would really appreciate what an insanely awesome unit that 20V engine actually is.

[sadique]

well said Mr. smokey..but i'v used both types of gas in my 20v and i'v notice a lil difference in performance! but they killin we wit dat $4.00... bastards!

[Terran]

Ah boy... good thread to resurrect.

[droppa]

yuh kno, man was bawling @4, now 575, sure most of us have done away by now tho........ever hear

that dotish sub way song......

my fav line is...

"i love my diesel engine, boomdiyada"

[Hook]

^^^ relevance ????

[Zeriam]

i have a job i will pay my $5.75 a liter and look like a boss with my white pump in my white car...yeah i rich i'm in that 6% my "audi" 5v non turbo

[Terran]

So let me ask a question.

Some people ducked from paying $4 per litre back then (I tried it with poor results and resumed using premium).

Did anyone switch to super and tried to compensate for lower octane by using octane boosters? How is that working out?

[Hook]

I did... It's a WOFT