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Sept 26 : Budget Day 2022

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PariaMan
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Re: Sept 26 : Budget Day 2022

Postby PariaMan » September 30th, 2022, 8:05 am

timelapse wrote:Paria, what would you say about those leaches on society that never worked a day in their life?
There is a test of means for the retirees pension

I have no problem with homemakers and people in non traditional jobs like taxi drivers and subsistence farmers getting a pension at 65

I have no issue with part of my tax burden going towards these people

I do not want to see a stay at home mom getting trouble to get food in her old age

That's my personal position

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hover11
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Re: Sept 26 : Budget Day 2022

Postby hover11 » September 30th, 2022, 8:08 am

What means test , once you not getting anything from nis or private pension you will get the 3500 payable for life.
PariaMan wrote:
timelapse wrote:Paria, what would you say about those leaches on society that never worked a day in their life?
There is a test of means for the retirees pension

I have no problem with homemakers and people in non traditional jobs like taxi drivers and subsistence farmers getting a pension at 65

I have no issue with part of my tax burden going towards these people

I do not want to see a stay at home mom getting trouble to get food in her old age

That's my personal position

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PariaMan
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Re: Sept 26 : Budget Day 2022

Postby PariaMan » September 30th, 2022, 8:12 am

hover11 wrote:What means test , once you not getting anything from nis or private pension you will get the 3500 payable for life.
PariaMan wrote:
timelapse wrote:Paria, what would you say about those leaches on society that never worked a day in their life?
There is a test of means for the retirees pension

I have no problem with homemakers and people in non traditional jobs like taxi drivers and subsistence farmers getting a pension at 65

I have no issue with part of my tax burden going towards these people

I do not want to see a stay at home mom getting trouble to get food in her old age

That's my personal position
Actually no if you have have property or private means if income you can be rejected

Do your research pal

I know people who have been rejected

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hover11
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Re: Sept 26 : Budget Day 2022

Postby hover11 » September 30th, 2022, 8:20 am

No.....you are wrong. Clearly you don't know or forget what country you live in. My dad owned property never worked in the formal economy and collects his 3500 every month try again
PariaMan wrote:
hover11 wrote:What means test , once you not getting anything from nis or private pension you will get the 3500 payable for life.
PariaMan wrote:
timelapse wrote:Paria, what would you say about those leaches on society that never worked a day in their life?
There is a test of means for the retirees pension

I have no problem with homemakers and people in non traditional jobs like taxi drivers and subsistence farmers getting a pension at 65

I have no issue with part of my tax burden going towards these people

I do not want to see a stay at home mom getting trouble to get food in her old age

That's my personal position
Actually no if you have have property or private means if income you can be rejected

Do your research pal

I know people who have been rejected

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Re: Sept 26 : Budget Day 2022

Postby sMASH » September 30th, 2022, 8:47 am

I know people got rejected cause they had other sources of income and it was over the 3500

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Re: Sept 26 : Budget Day 2022

Postby Dizzy28 » September 30th, 2022, 9:25 am

hover11 wrote:No.....you are wrong. Clearly you don't know or forget what country you live in. My dad owned property never worked in the formal economy and collects his 3500 every month try again
PariaMan wrote:
hover11 wrote:What means test , once you not getting anything from nis or private pension you will get the 3500 payable for life.
PariaMan wrote:
timelapse wrote:Paria, what would you say about those leaches on society that never worked a day in their life?
There is a test of means for the retirees pension

I have no problem with homemakers and people in non traditional jobs like taxi drivers and subsistence farmers getting a pension at 65

I have no issue with part of my tax burden going towards these people

I do not want to see a stay at home mom getting trouble to get food in her old age

That's my personal position
Actually no if you have have property or private means if income you can be rejected

Do your research pal

I know people who have been rejected


Both my mother and father in law became eligible for Pensions in 2018 and 2019 respectively.
Apart from the usual paper work there were home visits, they asked to see passports for evidence of foreign travel to determine you actually living TT etc.
It was a multi stage due diligence and certainly was no walk in the park. It took over 6 months for my mother's pension to be approved so she received a nice lump sum sized cheque in December of that year.

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Re: Sept 26 : Budget Day 2022

Postby timelapse » September 30th, 2022, 9:33 am

PariaMan wrote:
timelapse wrote:Paria, what would you say about those leaches on society that never worked a day in their life?
There is a test of means for the retirees pension

I have no problem with homemakers and people in non traditional jobs like taxi drivers and subsistence farmers getting a pension at 65

I have no issue with part of my tax burden going towards these people

I do not want to see a stay at home mom getting trouble to get food in her old age

That's my personal position
Guntas in Sealots too?Retire from a life of being a ole tief and collect a pension?

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Re: Sept 26 : Budget Day 2022

Postby eliteauto » September 30th, 2022, 9:37 am

If allyuh feel the only measure of a positive (economic/social) contribution to the country and society is a job allyuh woefully misguided

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Re: Sept 26 : Budget Day 2022

Postby Dizzy28 » September 30th, 2022, 9:45 am

eliteauto wrote:If allyuh feel the only measure of a positive (economic/social) contribution to the country and society is a job allyuh woefully misguided


Kids and old people see about themselves Dan!!!

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Re: Sept 26 : Budget Day 2022

Postby Kickstart » September 30th, 2022, 9:47 am

eliteauto wrote:If allyuh feel the only measure of a positive (economic/social) contribution to the country and society is a job allyuh woefully misguided
Volunteer work?

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Re: Sept 26 : Budget Day 2022

Postby eliteauto » September 30th, 2022, 10:12 am

Kickstart wrote:
eliteauto wrote:If allyuh feel the only measure of a positive (economic/social) contribution to the country and society is a job allyuh woefully misguided
Volunteer work?


No bro, there are a lot of persons who make both social and economic contributions to the country that fall outside the traditional taxable brackets, those persons who do daycare and babysitting in communities, farmers, vendors, taxi drivers, in fact most self-employed micro businesses. There is no framework (except for domestic workers) for those persons to pay NIS even if they wanted to, their net earnings may not exceed the income tax allowance. So whilst I agree that people in that group should make preparations for their retirement, to say that they are underserving of the social assistance grant aka old age pension on the basis of non-contribution is simply youthful arrogance speaking under the guise of pragmatism

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PariaMan
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Re: Sept 26 : Budget Day 2022

Postby PariaMan » September 30th, 2022, 10:22 am

Well said .Endorsed x1000

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Re: Sept 26 : Budget Day 2022

Postby rollingstock » September 30th, 2022, 10:23 am

hover11 wrote:No.....you are wrong. Clearly you don't know or forget what country you live in. My dad owned property never worked in the formal economy and collects his 3500 every month try again
PariaMan wrote:
hover11 wrote:What means test , once you not getting anything from nis or private pension you will get the 3500 payable for life.
PariaMan wrote:
timelapse wrote:Paria, what would you say about those leaches on society that never worked a day in their life?
There is a test of means for the retirees pension

I have no problem with homemakers and people in non traditional jobs like taxi drivers and subsistence farmers getting a pension at 65

I have no issue with part of my tax burden going towards these people

I do not want to see a stay at home mom getting trouble to get food in her old age

That's my personal position
Actually no if you have have property or private means if income you can be rejected

Do your research pal

I know people who have been rejected


Same person that admonishing persons receiving a pension have a mooch for a father.

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Re: Sept 26 : Budget Day 2022

Postby adnj » September 30th, 2022, 10:31 am

Combined duty and VAT collections are greater than combined social and income tax collections. Everyone is paying, everyone is contributing. Everyday.

https://stats.oecd.org/Index.aspx?DataSetCode=REVTTO

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Re: Sept 26 : Budget Day 2022

Postby hover11 » September 30th, 2022, 11:06 am

Elite,

What happens in 2025 if rowley says vote for him and he will increase everyone's pension to 5000 just asking? We both know politicians will do ANYTHING for votes, so who pays that, where is the new pension amount coming from? You have to admit this senior citizens grant has become a political football.
eliteauto wrote:
Kickstart wrote:
eliteauto wrote:If allyuh feel the only measure of a positive (economic/social) contribution to the country and society is a job allyuh woefully misguided
Volunteer work?


No bro, there are a lot of persons who make both social and economic contributions to the country that fall outside the traditional taxable brackets, those persons who do daycare and babysitting in communities, farmers, vendors, taxi drivers, in fact most self-employed micro businesses. There is no framework (except for domestic workers) for those persons to pay NIS even if they wanted to, their net earnings may not exceed the income tax allowance. So whilst I agree that people in that group should make preparations for their retirement, to say that they are underserving of the social assistance grant aka old age pension on the basis of non-contribution is simply youthful arrogance speaking under the guise of pragmatism

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Re: Sept 26 : Budget Day 2022

Postby Dizzy28 » September 30th, 2022, 11:17 am

Looking after the most under privileged is a sign of a proper country.

The proclivity of the people to be smart men and game the system is the problem.
Just last week a woman was on a social media post of Donna Cox boasting she had 3 food cards when the system was operational.

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Re: Sept 26 : Budget Day 2022

Postby Kickstart » September 30th, 2022, 11:38 am

eliteauto wrote:
Kickstart wrote:
eliteauto wrote:If allyuh feel the only measure of a positive (economic/social) contribution to the country and society is a job allyuh woefully misguided
Volunteer work?


No bro, there are a lot of persons who make both social and economic contributions to the country that fall outside the traditional taxable brackets, those persons who do daycare and babysitting in communities, farmers, vendors, taxi drivers, in fact most self-employed micro businesses. There is no framework (except for domestic workers) for those persons to pay NIS even if they wanted to, their net earnings may not exceed the income tax allowance. So whilst I agree that people in that group should make preparations for their retirement, to say that they are underserving of the social assistance grant aka old age pension on the basis of non-contribution is simply youthful arrogance speaking under the guise of pragmatism


I know lots that fall in that bracket

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Re: Sept 26 : Budget Day 2022

Postby Duane 3NE 2NR » September 30th, 2022, 11:44 am

Everyone pays VAT, Duties and many pay OPT

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Re: Sept 26 : Budget Day 2022

Postby pugboy » September 30th, 2022, 1:07 pm

they will cut back the official nib one and say the actuaries say that is all the fund capable of.
excuse is the investment porfolio not making due to world markets

hover11 wrote:Soon a tough decision must be made to only have one pension in this country I hope people know which one they keeping

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Re: Sept 26 : Budget Day 2022

Postby hover11 » September 30th, 2022, 1:09 pm

Lol this is true...the people will accept such.
pugboy wrote:they will cut back the official nib one and say the actuaries say that is all the fund capable of.
excuse is the investment porfolio not making due to world markets

hover11 wrote:Soon a tough decision must be made to only have one pension in this country I hope people know which one they keeping

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Re: Sept 26 : Budget Day 2022

Postby Dizzy28 » September 30th, 2022, 1:11 pm

pugboy wrote:they will cut back the official nib one and say the actuaries say that is all the fund capable of.
excuse is the investment porfolio not making due to world markets

hover11 wrote:Soon a tough decision must be made to only have one pension in this country I hope people know which one they keeping


There is only one pension.
The one at 65 is a grant.

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Re: Sept 26 : Budget Day 2022

Postby pugboy » September 30th, 2022, 1:16 pm

so why when you go asking for the grant they tell you that you already collecting an nib pension ?

Dizzy28 wrote:
pugboy wrote:they will cut back the official nib one and say the actuaries say that is all the fund capable of.
excuse is the investment porfolio not making due to world markets

hover11 wrote:Soon a tough decision must be made to only have one pension in this country I hope people know which one they keeping


There is only one pension.
The one at 65 is a grant.

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Dizzy28
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Re: Sept 26 : Budget Day 2022

Postby Dizzy28 » September 30th, 2022, 1:23 pm

pugboy wrote:so why when you go asking for the grant they tell you that you already collecting an nib pension ?

Dizzy28 wrote:
pugboy wrote:they will cut back the official nib one and say the actuaries say that is all the fund capable of.
excuse is the investment porfolio not making due to world markets

hover11 wrote:Soon a tough decision must be made to only have one pension in this country I hope people know which one they keeping


There is only one pension.
The one at 65 is a grant.


You can define the parameters of any grant.
They have the sliding scale for this one.

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Re: Sept 26 : Budget Day 2022

Postby hover11 » September 30th, 2022, 1:32 pm

Remember a grant can be taken away at any point in time, pension cannot
Dizzy28 wrote:
pugboy wrote:so why when you go asking for the grant they tell you that you already collecting an nib pension ?

Dizzy28 wrote:
pugboy wrote:they will cut back the official nib one and say the actuaries say that is all the fund capable of.
excuse is the investment porfolio not making due to world markets

hover11 wrote:Soon a tough decision must be made to only have one pension in this country I hope people know which one they keeping


There is only one pension.
The one at 65 is a grant.


You can define the parameters of any grant.
They have the sliding scale for this one.

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Re: Sept 26 : Budget Day 2022

Postby adnj » September 30th, 2022, 1:34 pm

Dizzy28 wrote:
pugboy wrote:so why when you go asking for the grant they tell you that you already collecting an nib pension ?

Dizzy28 wrote:
pugboy wrote:they will cut back the official nib one and say the actuaries say that is all the fund capable of.
excuse is the investment porfolio not making due to world markets

hover11 wrote:Soon a tough decision must be made to only have one pension in this country I hope people know which one they keeping


There is only one pension.
The one at 65 is a grant.


You can define the parameters of any grant.
They have the sliding scale for this one.


It's a grant that is called a pension.

Senior Citizens’ Pension
This grant provides financial assistance to eligible older persons in Trinidad and Tobago.

https://social.gov.tt/senior-citizens-pension/

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Re: Sept 26 : Budget Day 2022

Postby pugboy » September 30th, 2022, 1:35 pm

commonly known as “old age pension”
the politicians themselves call it that on the platform

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Re: Sept 26 : Budget Day 2022

Postby paid_influencer » September 30th, 2022, 6:11 pm

since we talking pension, the fairest thing we can do is put this NIS class system away and revert to a standard needs-based pension for everybody. "from each according to their ability, to each according to their need"

hear me out eh. if you worked for 40,000 a month, you living a good life and had a chance to enjoy that wealth. if you were desperately poor all your life, you have suffered enough. Your salary was, after all, not how much productivity you created, but how much of that productivity the owners of capital allowed you to keep.

pensions are not drawn from "your contributions", that is rubbish, whatever you paid was already given back as pension to the generation above you while you worked. your pension is paid from "contributions" of the generation underneath -- from the collective taxation of the society you helped build during your life time.

"from each according to their ability, to each according to their need"

https://www.tv6tnt.com/news/7pmnews/eld ... 11365.html

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Re: Sept 26 : Budget Day 2022

Postby adnj » September 30th, 2022, 7:16 pm

paid_influencer wrote:since we talking pension, the fairest thing we can do is put this NIS class system away and revert to a standard needs-based pension for everybody. "from each according to their ability, to each according to their need"

hear me out eh. if you worked for 40,000 a month, you living a good life and had a chance to enjoy that wealth. if you were desperately poor all your life, you have suffered enough. Your salary was, after all, not how much productivity you created, but how much of that productivity the owners of capital allowed you to keep.

pensions are not drawn from "your contributions", that is rubbish, whatever you paid was already given back as pension to the generation above you while you worked. your pension is paid from "contributions" of the generation underneath -- from the collective taxation of the society you helped build during your life time.

"from each according to their ability, to each according to their need"

https://www.tv6tnt.com/news/7pmnews/eld ... 11365.html


This is not true. By definition, a pension is vehicle to invest current receipts to pay for future benefits of the depositors of the receipts along with any employer's matching funds. Poorly managed pensions may rely on current receipts for current benefits because of poor investment of borrowing against the worth of the pension fund. That borrowing is referred to as pension plan raiding.

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Re: Sept 26 : Budget Day 2022

Postby hover11 » September 30th, 2022, 7:36 pm

paid_influencer wrote:since we talking pension, the fairest thing we can do is put this NIS class system away and revert to a standard needs-based pension for everybody. "from each according to their ability, to each according to their need"

hear me out eh. if you worked for 40,000 a month, you living a good life and had a chance to enjoy that wealth. if you were desperately poor all your life, you have suffered enough. Your salary was, after all, not how much productivity you created, but how much of that productivity the owners of capital allowed you to keep.

pensions are not drawn from "your contributions", that is rubbish, whatever you paid was already given back as pension to the generation above you while you worked. your pension is paid from "contributions" of the generation underneath -- from the collective taxation of the society you helped build during your life time.

"from each according to their ability, to each according to their need"

https://www.tv6tnt.com/news/7pmnews/eld ... 11365.html
Can't do that the NIS is a mandatory fund,based on the salary you receive , the more you earn is the more you put into the fund. Something that is mandatory cannot have a needs based assessment, it would be unfair to the persons who excelled or strived to better themselves. Is it fair that a manager and a janitor makes $3000 a month that can't be fair. What you don't know is that there is a difference between an earned pension and subsidized pension. Going back to the janitor, his earned pension a month may have been 1000 a month but because the NIB has a mandate to pay a monthly pension of $3000, the nib subsidizes that pension with 2000 dollars so the janitor would get his 3000 dollars monthly. Similar to how the government subsidizes our gas this too is unstainable.

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Re: Sept 26 : Budget Day 2022

Postby paid_influencer » September 30th, 2022, 8:20 pm

hover any comment on the video

ELDERLY MAN: NIB 'ROBBED' ME OF CONTRIBUTIONS

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