The Religion Discussion

[d spike]

i am a die hard roman catholic solider

...and this is the material you have to offer here, as a "die hard roman catholic"?

Adam and eve made Kane and Abel.Kane being the older son.
but eve eat of the forbidding fruit .which opened her mine.
so lets say if she did have sex with the snake (Satan) then introduce Adam to the fruit because she was still horny .well u no what happened after god kicked them out and eve was given the last gift of reproduction (yes it was a gift not a curse)
so with all that said .
her first son Kane can b a blood line of Satan.

i shoot at u all because it can b a possibility
Kane was the first killer in d bible who was granted a gift the mark of Kane

Satan can change forms into anything
Zeus also changed form to subdue women

I wonder how many "die-hard Roman Catholics" would approve of (or agree with) this sort of nonsense?
The R.C. Church is very clear on its teachings regarding the first part of Genesis. I would strongly advise you to locate a Catholic who is better informed, and find out what this story is about.

nah i am not taking 4 Greek mythology or any other inferior religions

So then, what was this in aid of?

so if i told u Greek Mythology was worshiped b4 the acknowledgement of the divine god in d bible ,

Like I said

...but don't unload... and pretend that it is an attempt at an intellectual discussion.

i just no alot about different religions

It is most tempting to say that I agree with your use of the word "no"...
...but all you have shown is a remarkable lack of knowledge about your own religion.
The Catholic Church has stated quite clearly that it understands that the early part of Genesis are Mesopotamian stories that were assimilated into early Judaism during the time that the Babylonian culture was flexing its superiority.
Before the second Vatican Council, the Catholic Church expected all Catholics to believe in a more literal interpretation. Your supposition would therefore be better understood in the light of the R.C. Church's earlier interpretation... but even in this light, your misconception of sex being the "forbidden fruit" is still quite wrong - both in interpretation and dogma.
There were early cults that taught a similar error, but even these never went as far as you did, as the interpretation could never even be twisted to represent what you wish it to be.
These cults taught that the "flesh" (things of this world) was basically evil, and only the spiritual was good. Therefore, anything that was part of this world and its life (including sex) was evil, and to be abhorred. (One reason why these cults didn't last very long was that new members weren't born into it - as babies are a direct result of an "evil" act! ) This error grew out of a Greek belief... and as scholars studied the Greek literature, this thinking would reappear over time - Greek culture was considered "the" culture of all time, and so the reason for Greek studies.

Let us look instead at your offered concept using logic:

so lets say if she did have sex with the snake (Satan) then introduce Adam to the fruit because she was still horny .well u no what happened after god kicked them out and eve was given the last gift of reproduction (yes it was a gift not a curse)

Yes, let's say she did have sex with the snake - and for the moment ignore sMASH's appeal to logic that "humans and snakes cannot interbreed" - was this an error on her part? If it is to be understood as you wish it to mean, that the sex act was the "fruit", then as you yourself said, such a thing was a gift... and if it is a gift, then it cannot be a sin - and Eve did no wrong, therefore God acted in error. (Do I HAVE to point out what is wrong here?)
If it is to be understood, however, that the sex act was separate from the "eating of the fruit", and God's decision was justified, then where did you get such an idea from? Eve having sex with the snake? What on earth are you basing such an interpretation on?
In my studies, I have come across quite a variety of interpretations, but never such a heap of cowmuck such as this - and a very sick cow, I might add.

So the question of

i was just asking what if

Could not possibly apply here.
"What if" must be based on an accepted fact or facts - something that is quite lacking in any of your posts.

but some religions do that some events that are similar to accounts recorded in the bible u no

Which religions?
The ones that based their beliefs (and therefore "their" scriptures) on the Bible?
Or the early ones that the authors of Genesis "borrowed" their first stories from?

[dtp]

nah i am not taking 4 Greek mythology or any other inferior religions
i am a die hard roman catholic solider

but some religions do that some events that are similar to accounts recorded in the bible u no

i am not trying to upload any horseshit here i just no alot about different religions

pray tell, friend..........what is an inferior religion???????

their are many but i don't want to step on anyone toes on this forum

what i mean by almost the same story lines as the bible
yes their are
god flood the earth
zeus flood the earth

Heracles
Sampson

but the stories are not complete the same thing but is similar
and i an not comparing anything

and their some many stories in other religion
almost the same as the virgin Mary.(and well their was not named the Mary)

well that's just a few now i ent saying i don't believe the bible


i am spirituality very strong
and honestly reading the bible would not open the gate to heaven
opening your heart to the divine god
be more like Abraham and Moses
trust him pray to him
never pray selfishly ask god to help others b humble .
do good and spread the wonders of god"s work and word
d a vessel of his word

this is the key

an meditation gives your soul strength

[dtp]

ok look at this
Abraham and Moses
never had an bible and their both communicated with god very well

it cum from d heart and soul b pure

if u want to connect with god u must learn to meditate

someone post a story of john d baptist born please

[dtp]

[imgwh][/imgwh]

^^^ 'what if'........ u just THINK you know alot about other religions?

kasey yes i do no
honesty yes

[Kasey]

^^Do you know that Colombus's friends 'knew' that the world was flat? Do you know that Megaduck knows he is right in his beliefs?

'Knowing' and believing are two different concepts my friend.

You only believe you know alot bout other religions. This is blatantly obvious.

[dtp]

^^Do you know that Colombus's friends 'knew' that the world was flat? Do you know that Megaduck knows he is right in his beliefs?

'Knowing' and believing are two different concepts my friend.

You only believe you know alot bout other religions. This is blatantly obvious.

i know about other religions
but believe or worship in them no. i don't .
yes i understand their ways and structure and histories of most religions.

u understand better now

[dtp]

nah i am not taking 4 Greek mythology or any other inferior religions
i am a die hard roman catholic solider

but some religions do that some events that are similar to accounts recorded in the bible u no

i am not trying to upload any horseshit here i just no alot about different religions

pray tell, friend..........what is an inferior religion???????

yes i can tell

i consider inferior religions 2 b cults. again i will not use no local religions because i don't want to upset my trini friends.
this is just a few
1-Heaven's Gate
2-Aum Shinrikyo
3-Branch Davidian
4-Aghouri
5-Maradonian Church
and their is many more

[d spike]

Somebody give that man a dictionary PLEASE!!!!

[Kasey]

^^I think it will be pointless. 'Logic' will be the first word he will have to look up anyway.

I dont think he understands anything, any of us is trying to say.

[d spike]

^^I think it will be pointless. 'Logic' will be the first word he will have to look up anyway.

I dont think he understands anything, any of us is trying to say.

He certainly has read about (and hopefully understands) Greek mythology...
As to understanding what we are saying, I think that he (in true Trini style) is not interested/concerned in what our responses are, but only concerned with getting his point across - an attitude these "religious" threads are only too familiar with.

Precisely "what" his point is, is what deludes me. Perhaps instead of yammering in poor English about how he knows a lot (forgive me, I mean "no alot") about different religions, he could try to expand on the point he was trying to make.

i consider inferior religions 2 b cults. again i will not use no local religions because i don't want to upset my trini friends.
this is just a few
1-Heaven's Gate
2-Aum Shinrikyo
3-Branch Davidian
4-Aghouri
5-Maradonian Church
and their is many more

Just as diction is important if you want folks to understand what you are saying, in a written debate one's use of the language can make your points easily understood - or alienate or bore the reader, causing disinterest and a lack of comprehension.
As I have said here before, if you really want to be understood then you should pay attention to your writing. (Of course, sulking about "grammar police" instead of clarifying your written material, simply shows that your priority in posting was NOT being understood.)
"i consider inferior religions 2 b cults" Most people do. I think what you meant in response to MG Man's query was, "I consider cults to be inferior religions." As the definition of a "cult' can change depending on who you ask, precisely what do you mean by a 'cult'?

" i will not use no local religions because i don't want to upset my trini friends" This clearly implies that you DO consider certain local belief systems as inferior, so instead of just "upsetting" some of your "trini friends", you have just annoyed practically all of those here who follow a religion thanks to your vague condescension - and makes the use of the word "friends" seem ironic, if not negating it altogether.
Perhaps an attempt to explain yourself without digging yourself in deeper might help...

[dtp]

i no my English is not so hot
i don't read back what i type sorry i am bad

so what are your questions
if i can i will try to answer 4u

and i do believe their are aliens out their

[Kasey]

i no my English is not so hot
i don't read back what i type sorry i am bad

so what are your questions
if i can i will try to answer 4u

and i do believe their are aliens out their

Translation:
"I know my English is very poor. I also do not re-read anything I type, but I do apologise as I am not good at English.

Can you tell me what your questions are? If I can, I will answer them for you."

dtp, can you state your points in number format? This is my question. Please do not put 'what if's', please give a factual description of what your purpose in this thread is.

[d spike]

Thanks for the translation, Kasey.

so what are your questions
if i can i will try to answer 4u

Perhaps... he could try to expand on the point he was trying to make.

...precisely what do you mean by a 'cult'?

" i will not use no local religions because i don't want to upset my trini friends" This clearly implies that you DO consider certain local belief systems as inferior, so instead of just "upsetting" some of your "trini friends", you have just annoyed practically all of those here who follow a religion thanks to your vague condescension - and makes the use of the word "friends" seem ironic, if not negating it altogether.
Perhaps an attempt to explain yourself without digging yourself in deeper might help...

and i do believe their are aliens out their

What on earth does this have to do with the discussion? Please attempt to stick to one topic... deal with one topic at a time.
I certainly can't see what aliens have to do with religion, anyway - unless your concept of religion is so rigid and narrow that the awareness of ET life will disturb/negate it.

[dtp]

As the definition of a "cult' can change depending on who you ask, precisely what do you mean by a 'cult'?

.

this statement you made is very true.


from my view
Christians /roman Catholics / Islamic and others Jesus base churches or congregations
are very similar
their share almost d same concepts.
i have no problems with them

but idol worshipers
in my book are cults or occults

i can say this
their are some pundits who claim to be doing prays to their good gods
but really taking your money and doing offerings to pishacha and vetala spirits and their are some dread demons .
and putting your hands in that black work will hut your seeds for d future.(your kids /new born)

some spiritual baptist do offering to congo zandor and also abiku
(a handsome black Rooster is put to rest)

[dtp]

i am spirituality very strong
and honestly reading the bible would not open the gate to heaven
opening your heart to the divine god
be more like Abraham and Moses
trust him pray to him
never pray selfishly ask god to help others b humble .
do good and spread the wonders of god"s work and word
d a vessel of his word

this is the key

an meditation gives your soul strength

this is really my message

[dtp]

no one post up d story of john d baptist

i have a what to hit u all

[meccalli]

lol zeus isn't the devil, most likely a nephilim.

[dtp]

lol zeus isn't the devil, most likely a nephilim.

zeus killed his father Cronus to free his brothers and Sisters .
to became the leader of gods

so he is not a son of god any more


but if u say Cronus,Rhea,Oceanus and Tethys (the original titans are nephilim)

[d spike]

no one post up d story of john d baptist

i have a what to hit u all

If you have something to say, say it.
Stop this nonsense about asking someone to post up material about a character without being specific about what you wish to discuss - doing this makes you sound like a moron (which I trust you are not).

John D. Baptiste was the only child of an old couple. He did strange things, like eating insects. He exhibited a fondness for water, and splashed folks in the river. The poor lad lost his head and insulted a bigwah's wife. She then ensured that he really lost his head.

There! Now someone has posted the story... now go ahead and spit out what's eating you.
(By the way, you don't hit people with a what... that doesn't do much. You hit them with a fuckit. That is generally about two to three feet long, made of wood, and has a few old nails embedded in the end furthest from the grip.)

but idol worshipers
in my book are cults or occults

The fact that you are lumping cults with the occult means your "knowledge" of religion is minimal at best... or your grasp of the English language is what is minimal - and if your language skills are lacking, then what technique did you use to acquire the "knowledge" you were boasting about? Leave the telling of stories half-heard and badly told for the presumptuous fundamentalist...

By your implied reference, it seems your focus here is on Hinduism. I hope it isn't, for true Hinduism is far from "idol-worship". I would STRONGLY advise you to read up on what Catholic theologians have written about Hinduism, and the links that are found between Christianity and Hinduism.

i can say this
their are some pundits who claim to be doing prays

Nonsense and smart-men exist wherever gullible people are. Religion has nothing to do with it.
St. John Chrysostom said: "Don't look for demons, (for then you will see them everywhere) but when you find them, step on them."
By "for then you will see them everywhere" he meant you will become paranoid - not clear-sighted!

[dtp]

i can say this
their are some pundits who claim to be doing prays

Nonsense and smart-men exist wherever gullible people are. Religion has nothing to do with it.
[/quote]


yes religion has everything to do with it.
yes their are gullible people who will be miss guided by others tru their influence mainly because their are weak both spiritually and mentally.
like what happened with d Jim Jones sheit.
it boils down to a group of people lead by one man to their deaths.
the victims believe their was in a strong religion and put heart and soul into the words of Jim Jones.

[dtp]

look at d radical Muslims and their beliefs in jihad

[dtp]

By your implied reference, it seems your focus here is on Hinduism. I hope it isn't, for true Hinduism is far from "idol-worship". I would STRONGLY advise you to read up on what Catholic theologians have written about Hinduism, and the links that are found between Christianity and Hinduism.


i do no about Catholic theologians

just remember the golden calf

whats not of god don't support or give any sympathy
like u want Moses come and hit u with his stick .

the story of Moses have so much more to it than just saving gods people.
fate
truth
strength
and much more teaching u can gasp from it.
even a lil of jihad was their also
Moses had the purge out the people Exodus 32:11 genocide
and the calf was burnt

[d spike]

By your implied reference, it seems your focus here is on Hinduism. I hope it isn't, for true Hinduism is far from "idol-worship". I would STRONGLY advise you to read up on what Catholic theologians have written about Hinduism, and the links that are found between Christianity and Hinduism.

i do no about Catholic theologians

just remember the golden calf

whats not of god don't support or give any sympathy
like u want Moses come and hit u with his stick .

Do me a favour, please. If you wish to respond to stuff I post, then lay off the weed-smoking, or whatever drug it is that you're doing, for it is disabling your ability to focus.
I never asked you if you knew any Catholic theologians. I asked you to

read up on what Catholic theologians have written about Hinduism

whats not of god don't support or give any sympathy

And precisely what leads you to believe that Hinduism is not of God?
Certainly NOT anything the Roman Catholic Church teaches at this time.
Therefore, it is clear to me that you are not really aware of what your religion teaches.
I suspect you are one of those Catholics whose personal religion is more focused along the lines of "televangelist-style" Christianity (which is actually opposed to Catholicism) and whose spirituality is based on the preaching of evangelical-type (but poorly informed) lay-ministers. The history of the Catholic Church is full of well-meaning but quite errant priests and preachers - Arius, for example.
Again I ask you to go and see for yourself what the teachers of your faith have to say about Hinduism.

like u want Moses come and hit u with his stick .

Please do not encourage me to give you the proper answer to this statement.
Moses was quite firm in acknowledging the importance of his faith and its requirements. Perhaps you should take a page out of his book and go find out what your religion actually teaches in this regard, instead of advertising your ignorance.

[d spike]

For dtp (who claims to be a Catholic):
Let me assist in enlightening your darkness regarding what your religion has to say about Hinduism. The following is an excerpt from Nostra Aetate:

From ancient times down to the present, there is found among various peoples a certain perception of that hidden power which hovers over the course of things and over the events of human history; at times some indeed have come to the recognition of a Supreme Being, or even of a Father. This perception and recognition penetrates their lives with a profound religious sense.

Religions, however, that are bound up with an advanced culture have struggled to answer the same questions by means of more refined concepts and a more developed language. Thus in Hinduism, men contemplate the divine mystery and express it through an inexhaustible abundance of myths and through searching philosophical inquiry. They seek freedom from the anguish of our human condition either through ascetical practices or profound meditation or a flight to God with love and trust. Again, Buddhism, in its various forms, realizes the radical insufficiency of this changeable world; it teaches a way by which men, in a devout and confident spirit, may be able either to acquire the state of perfect liberation, or attain, by their own efforts or through higher help, supreme illumination. Likewise, other religions found everywhere try to counter the restlessness of the human heart, each in its own manner, by proposing "ways," comprising teachings, rules of life, and sacred rites. The Catholic Church rejects nothing that is true and holy in these religions. She regards with sincere reverence those ways of conduct and of life, those precepts and teachings which, though differing in many aspects from the ones she holds and sets forth, nonetheless often reflect a ray of that Truth which enlightens all men.

And an earlier writing, Lumen Gentium:

Nor is God far distant from those who in shadows and images seek the unknown God, for it is He who gives to all men life and breath and all things, and as Saviour wills that all men be saved. Those also can attain to salvation who through no fault of their own do not know the Gospel of Christ or His Church, yet sincerely seek God and moved by grace strive by their deeds to do His will as it is known to them through the dictates of conscience. Nor does Divine Providence deny the helps necessary for salvation to those who, without blame on their part, have not yet arrived at an explicit knowledge of God and with His grace strive to live a good life.

Both of these are TEACHINGS of the Catholic Church. I would strongly recommend that you seriously reconsider your stance on the topic, as it does not reflect the view of your Church, but is more aligned to what is preached by itinerant soap-box and street-corner ranters - who are diametrically opposed to your religion anyway.

[dtp]

bro i was baptized as a roman catholic ok
i don't defend the catholic church in any way
10 commandments i uphold

whats wrong is wrong based on what gods laws are

my friend u are trying to bash the roman catholic church because i bash pundit who do offerings to
pishacha
u clown u have any idea how dangerous their are

d spike how spiritually strong are u
have u ever had to deal with an demon much more an legion
pm me if u want to no more

i will never defend an idol worshiper never
i will look at them am just say their no better

u can say all u want about i am on drugs but the difference is that i no what i am saying
i don't put my beliefs in man made handwriting
like your buddy Pope Paul VI about nostra aetate

sheit what do their really no seriously

in my lil life i seen insane sheit some say i am blesses i believe i am cursed
i pray to god to shine his light over me everyday

i never said roman catholic
was d bess thing out

all i did was show some evil that what so called pundits do
and talked about Greek gods

and show how to pray effectively without belonging to any church

[dtp]

like u want Moses come and hit u with his stick .

Please do not encourage me to give you the proper answer to this statement.
Moses was quite firm in acknowledging the importance of his faith and its requirements. Perhaps you should take a page out of his book and go find out what your religion actually teaches in this regard, instead of advertising your ignorance.[/quote]


please tell me
ignorance u say

yes when Mose came down the hill he did beg god the forgive them
but what had to b done was to purge his people

[d spike]

my friend u are trying to bash the roman catholic church

Precisely WHERE did I bash (or try to bash) the RC Church???

bro i was baptized as a roman catholic ok
i don't defend the catholic church in any way

You identified yourself as a Catholic. Either you are a member of that church, or you are not. The Catholic Church has made it very clear over the centuries what is expected of their followers. If you do not agree with its teachings, then you are not a member of it.

i don't put my beliefs in man made handwriting
like your buddy Pope Paul VI about nostra aetate

Clearly you have no idea of what you are talking about. There is a difference between 'teachings' and 'beliefs' - the latter requires faith, while the former requires intellect... perhaps that might explain your misunderstanding.

d spike how spiritually strong are u
have u ever had to deal with an demon much more an legion
pm me if u want to no more

Know more about what, precisely? (or should that be "no more..."?)
I have a very clear memory of all that I have had to deal with, and a good understanding of it as well. I certainly don't need someone to explain it to me, especially someone who could barely read and write, and knows very little about his own faith to which he claimed adherence.

i will never defend an idol worshiper never
i will look at them am just say their no better

And where have you met an idol-worshiper in Trinidad? If you are referring to a Hindu, then either you or he does not understand Hinduism.

all i did was show some evil that what so called pundits do
and talked about Greek gods
and show how to pray effectively without belonging to any church

In your mind, perhaps. What you actually did was make yourself seem quite unlearned, most illiterate, and certainly, rather irrational.
Perhaps if you would talk privately to your class teacher (for you obviously have not left school) you might be able to sort out the misconceptions you seem to have burdened yourself with.

[sMASH]

dtp, why is idol worship supposed to be bad, or wrong?

[d spike]

dtp, why is idol worship supposed to be bad, or wrong?

Why is it taking so long for this question to be answered?

sMASH, some folks wake up one morning with a massive flashing neon sign in their heads, due to a horrific experience... or unexpected charity in a time of desperate need... or the hopelessness of the situation of a possessed girlfriend (and you know how THAT turned out)... or just too much to drink the night before...
Many mistake this spiritual alarm clock ring for spirituality itself... and decide they "have arrived" and are "called" (we all are "called" to live here as best we can with the gifts we have - it's up to each of us to be as thrifty and grateful as we can)...

Do you remember "Predator"? When the soldiers realized that there was something harmful in their immediate environment, they opened up with all their firepower, not aiming at anything specific, but blasting away in the hope that they would eventually hit something...

It is unfortunate that many "Christians" (especially those with newly-reaffirmed faith) seem to fall into one or both of these categories.


One thing I have always admired about Islam is the stress placed on educating its members. Perhaps if Christianity had stressed such a thing, then discussions such as these might not seem like bashing one's head against a wall.
Perhaps while you wait for the fellow's response, you might explain the following to me:
I appreciate the symbolism of facing Mecca to pray, but when Mohammed started instructing his followers, he had them face Jerusalem, switching to Mecca later - or so I have heard. Why Jerusalem? And why was this switch done?

[dtp]

my friend u are trying to bash the roman catholic church

Precisely WHERE did I bash (or try to bash) the RC Church???

bro i was baptized as a roman catholic ok
i don't defend the catholic church in any way

You identified yourself as a Catholic. Either you are a member of that church, or you are not. The Catholic Church has made it very clear over the centuries what is expected of their followers. If you do not agree with its teachings, then you are not a member of it.

i don't put my beliefs in man made handwriting
like your buddy Pope Paul VI about nostra aetate

Clearly you have no idea of what you are talking about. There is a difference between 'teachings' and 'beliefs' - the latter requires faith, while the former requires intellect... perhaps that might explain your misunderstanding.

d spike how spiritually strong are u
have u ever had to deal with an demon much more an legion
pm me if u want to no more

Know more about what, precisely? (or should that be "no more..."?)
I have a very clear memory of all that I have had to deal with, and a good understanding of it as well. I certainly don't need someone to explain it to me, especially someone who could barely read and write, and knows very little about his own faith to which he claimed adherence.

i will never defend an idol worshiper never
i will look at them am just say their no better

And where have you met an idol-worshiper in Trinidad? If you are referring to a Hindu, then either you or he does not understand Hinduism.

all i did was show some evil that what so called pundits do
and talked about Greek gods
and show how to pray effectively without belonging to any church

In your mind, perhaps. What you actually did was make yourself seem quite unlearned, most illiterate, and certainly, rather irrational.
Perhaps if you would talk privately to your class teacher (for you obviously have not left school) you might be able to sort out the misconceptions you seem to have burdened yourself with.

i went to school i have education
but what i write is 4 u to figure out

all great messages are all coded

good valuable information is never openly seen
u have not pm me


so u believe everything from an educated person
just because i don't type clearly and some sentences don't make sense

remember d devil known how to fool people my friends b on your d look out
and honestly this was not an diss is a message of warning


i have posted some stuff some many not like i am sorry
any question hit me a pm
u have demons hunting u i may or try to help .

i am no a voodoo man who go tell u go an buy albino skin and make mix it with lavender
oils and write what u want on a green candle
and read some psalm and hope d best
or try to help u get back your x girl nope