The *Official* LOCAL Election Thread (2013)

[desifemlove]

If you and the PM dont understand democracy and having the mandate of the people then you don't understand why Manning called early elections.

I never said Price Plaza was gov't owned.

PNM publicly articulated its plan to diversity the economy through the use of natural gas as a cheap initial energy source for aluminium smelting which would produce downstream manufacturing (machine parts, tools, ships, etc.). The UNC objected and proposed that they had a plan to diversity the economy. Three years later, 4 deficit budgets and no diversification in sight, only promises of foreign investment that pull out when they realise what this gov't is capable of.

You truly have a right to lol...Moonilal, Suruj and Anand

So why did he call election? He played RIGHT into Kamla's hands.

and smelter? irradiate the country and give we cancer? as for budget deficit, learn some economics nah man. who says a budget deficit per se is bad? the growth we had under Manning was energy-based anyhow.

And whehter Dr. Roody, Dr. Suruj, Anand, whoever, so many people tink that Rowley would right so many wrongs, but if he doh succeed UNC will be back. and PNM/UNC are two sides of the same coin.

[desifemlove]

Chaguanas will just remain a shithole

eh No, chaguanas was saved from the evils of the PNM, under PNM chag would have become the next beetham

Chag centre is still mash up, even under a UNC Mayor for 3 years.

I doh see why I have to dodge vagrants, litter, and dirty pavements whilst i shopping dey..

[desifemlove]

Tbh, pp is in a better position than the pnm for 2015 elections. If ilp joins the coalition and cop remains, all dogs ded. Pp will more than likely get re-elected. And kamla et al know that.

so how come PP lose much of North in LGEs?

PP has to keep about 11 seats in North, and remember these are PNM areas.

I ent no PNM, doh get me wrong (I detest them, but that's a side point). But if these elections are played out, Mrs. Kamla would only have her seats in South/Central, and Prakass would get wiped out..

I did a rough check a while back based on a two 'party' election race; a full pp (unc, cop, ilp) vs pnm and assumptions on marginal seat voting patterns. When i finish wacker this stretch of grass here i go drop some monkey maths (not related to new species' monkey logic) in le ched

Even with Jack/ILP (which WILL happen IMO, politicians word means sheit lol..), PP would not have won Arima, Diego, Sando. they may have won Grande and Tunapuna/Piarco, and of course Chag outright and as we all know that's immaterial now. So technically two new councils ent much, is it?

[rfari]

Tbh, pp is in a better position than the pnm for 2015 elections. If ilp joins the coalition and cop remains, all dogs ded. Pp will more than likely get re-elected. And kamla et al know that.

so how come PP lose much of North in LGEs?

PP has to keep about 11 seats in North, and remember these are PNM areas.

I ent no PNM, doh get me wrong (I detest them, but that's a side point). But if these elections are played out, Mrs. Kamla would only have her seats in South/Central, and Prakass would get wiped out..

I did a rough check a while back based on a two 'party' election race; a full pp (unc, cop, ilp) vs pnm and assumptions on marginal seat voting patterns. When i finish wacker this stretch of grass here i go drop some monkey maths (not related to new species' monkey logic) in le ched

Even with Jack/ILP (which WILL happen IMO, politicians word means sheit lol..), PP would not have won Arima, Diego, Sando. they may have won Grande and Tunapuna/Piarco, and of course Chag outright and as we all know that's immaterial now. So technically two new councils ent much, is it?

Rephrase pls. I eh unnastan what u are saying

[desifemlove]

but I guess for some it is win at any costs.

That.

becoming disillusioned by local politics, because of that fact.

Whether the dumbass racist/tribalists (on BOTH sides) who don't get that "their" party doesn't give a hot sh!t about them (all those WITH money get along just fine.) Or!... the sycophants who too busy brown-nosing/profiteering, to put country before themselves.... this place fcuking doomed. People seem to think getting this right, is not as important as playing games. Especially when you read the drivel from an alarming number of tuners.

No wonder the Ministry for National Security had to put out that new ad urging supporters of various parties to get along. Things bleak.

Yuh unnahstan! Ollour had ollour time, let mammoo eat ah food now!

eat ah food? breds, people eating ah food so much that i wonder why dey ent obese....

[Habit7]

and smelter? irradiate the country and give we cancer? as for budget deficit, learn some economics nah man. who says a budget deficit per se is bad? the growth we had under Manning was energy-based anyhow.

Bahrain, the country we played in 2005 and the winner of which would be the smallest World Cup country ever (Bahrain is 5x smaller than T&T), has one of the world's largest aluminium smelters and it is run with above world standard environmental friendliness. That cancer talk was the same rubbish that the literature lecturer is now talking with the highway re-route.

Deficit budget is not bad if we were taking the borrowed money and investing it into new industries that would reap rewards later. That is not happening. Borrowed money is going into infrastructure which is needed but the returns are only viable with new industries in tandem.

[bluefete]

PNM/UNC are two sides of the same coin.

The most accurate, succinct comment in this entire thread!!!!!!

[desifemlove]

jus how it seems to me lol.. I doh get how people say Rowley will be/is better than Kamla, Prakass and the crew. but they have their opinions, i have mine hehe..

[rfari]

And i ask prolly for the umpteen time. What indication has growley ever given to hint tht he is cut from the sane cloth as kamla?

[desifemlove]

What indication has he given that he WILL be better?

Remember Mrs. kamla was saying "we will rise! no more corruption!" yet look how we "rose" lol...

All politicians are the same IMO. Rowley's intentions are simply words at this moment, as were Mrs. Kamla's in 2010.

should Rowley become PM, I'd only deem him good if we see PROPER economic diversification as well as a better transportation system (I does want a train from town to Sando!). If not, then he WILL be of the same cloth.

[bluefete]

And i ask prolly for the umpteen time. What indication has growley ever given to hint tht he is cut from the sane cloth as kamla?

Kamla or Manning. Still de same. I had dealing with Rowley before and as PM he will ride roughshod over the country.

[rfari]

What indication has he given that he WILL be better?

Remember Mrs. kamla was saying "we will rise! no more corruption!" yet look how we "rose" lol...

All politicians are the same IMO. Rowley's intentions are simply words at this moment, as were Mrs. Kamla's in 2010.

should Rowley become PM, I'd only deem him good if we see PROPER economic diversification as well as a better transportation system (I does want a train from town to Sando!). If not, then he WILL be of the same cloth.

Look at growley and kamla decisions made over the years

[bluefete]

What indication has he given that he WILL be better?

Remember Mrs. kamla was saying "we will rise! no more corruption!" yet look how we "rose" lol...

All politicians are the same IMO. Rowley's intentions are simply words at this moment, as were Mrs. Kamla's in 2010.

should Rowley become PM, I'd only deem him good if we see PROPER economic diversification as well as a better transportation system (I does want a train from town to Sando!). If not, then he WILL be of the same cloth.

Look at growley and kamla decisions made over the years

It is true that Rowley moved away from Manning when the corruption got too much for him. But what new ideas has he put forward? How has he shown that he is any different from what went before?

[desifemlove]

What indication has he given that he WILL be better?

Remember Mrs. kamla was saying "we will rise! no more corruption!" yet look how we "rose" lol...

All politicians are the same IMO. Rowley's intentions are simply words at this moment, as were Mrs. Kamla's in 2010.

should Rowley become PM, I'd only deem him good if we see PROPER economic diversification as well as a better transportation system (I does want a train from town to Sando!). If not, then he WILL be of the same cloth.

Look at growley and kamla decisions made over the years

Kamla spent much of the past decade as an opposition MP, and even under Panday was a junior minister. What "decisions" could or can an opposition MP make? Are they included in Cabinet meetings or hold Ministries?

[rfari]

What indication has he given that he WILL be better?

Remember Mrs. kamla was saying "we will rise! no more corruption!" yet look how we "rose" lol...

All politicians are the same IMO. Rowley's intentions are simply words at this moment, as were Mrs. Kamla's in 2010.

should Rowley become PM, I'd only deem him good if we see PROPER economic diversification as well as a better transportation system (I does want a train from town to Sando!). If not, then he WILL be of the same cloth.

Look at growley and kamla decisions made over the years

It is true that Rowley moved away from Manning when the corruption got too much for him. But what new ideas has he put forward? How has he shown that he is any different from what went before?

what new ideas we need again. tnt is full to the brim with ideas. the real issue is implementation and fine-tuning
time and time again we see govts especially this latest regime taking advantage of the inefficiencies of govt offices and other state enterprises giving the impression that they are working for the ppl. yes its true that ppl benefit but its still short term solutions to the problems we face.

[Dizzy28]

Very interesting analysis

Tribal voting alive and well in St Joseph
Published: Monday, November 11, 2013
This article was written by Nigel Henry of Solution by Simulation, a private firm that uses computer modelling to provide insight into political contexts.

The winning candidate in last week’s St Joseph by-election won with just under 45 per cent of the vote, and only five per cent separated the two leading candidates. Given how close the results were, one might expect that neighbours in similar circumstances considered their options and narrowly decided between two roughly equally preferable candidates. However, the reality is that the constituency was extremely polarised. In 40 out of the 43 polling divisions (PDs) either the UNC or PNM candidate bested the other by a wide two-to-one margin.

To illustrate the point using the extremes: One PD in Petit Bourg voted 127-7-5 for the PNM, ILP, and UNC respectively, and one polling station in Aranguez voted 329-43-7 for the UNC, ILP and PNM respectively. Conversely, the PNM won “PNM” PDs 3,885 to 672, and the UNC won “UNC” PDs 5,685 to 1,692. This is a very different picture from the close 45 per cent-39 per cent result overall.

The numbers therefore do support analysts’ readings that we have “returned to tribal voting.”


Was St Joseph a run-off?
One week ago, while reviewing the local government election, I discussed strategic voting in cases where a run-off election is not available.
The by-election, coming just two weeks after the local government elections, mirrors a hypothetical run-off election and comparing the results of the two elections in identical PDs is a rare case of what we call a “natural experiment” in the social sciences.



If every voter voted, or didn’t vote, the same way that they voted in the local government election, the PNM would have won with 46 per cent, followed by 30 per cent for the PP, and 23 per cent for the ILP.
Indeed, whether influenced by the message of the campaigns or by independent consideration, the results of the St Joseph by-election resembled that of a run-off election in which voters coalesced around the two major candidates. In particular, the gap between the two major candidates closed with many voters who voted for the ILP now voting for the UNC. We can be certain that the tightening of the race came because about half of the very same electors who voted for ILP candidates in the local government election voted for Mr Alleyne two weeks later by examining the results by PD in a reasonably high turnout election (53 per cent).



Although more people voted for the PNM in the by-election, vis-a-vis the local government elections, the share of votes that the PNM received was almost identical across all 43 PDs between the two elections. The majority of the swing in the results came in “UNC PDs”, and the ILP vote in the “PNM PDs” was largely unaffected.

Strategic voting in St Joseph
The numbers simply don’t allow the possibility that half of ILP voters stayed at home last Monday and that the UNC found 50 per cent more voters that did not vote two weeks before.
Voters who had “gone green” changed their minds.
What this means is that:
1. There is evidence of strategic voting, with voters in the Aranguez/Warner Village district casting ballots for the ILP candidate when the PNM had little chance of winning but voting for the UNC when their vote “mattered.”

2. If we continue the assumption that the by-election was akin to a second-ballot, then the ILP “split” the vote in San Juan East and Valsayn/St Joseph.

The PNM won in both districts although a majority of the district would have compromised with the UNC and COP candidates respectively as their first or second choice.

I suggested in an article last week that vote-splitting by the ILP did not change the overall results of the election but I singled out San Juan East and Valsayn/St Joseph as two of the few possible exceptions. Such a change in allegiance between the two elections suggests that voters in these districts voted more strategically in the second election because they had more information about the consequences of their vote.

An examination of the results also show that the ILP share of the vote was roughly equally spread throughout the very polarised constituency. This suggests, as Sunday Guardian columnist Mark Wilson wrote this week, that the ILP represents the post-tribal, or non-tribal vote, and that vote is not 23 per cent as interim party leader Jack Warner first claimed, but 14 per cent.

Pre-election polling
Finally, Mr Wilson is correct that the pre-election polls failed to predict a close election and all overstated the ILP support. He wrote that either the polls were an accurate “snapshot” of a race that swung dramatically in the last week or the polls all suffered from poor or inadequate methodology in what was a complex race to measure.

I found it interesting that pre-election polls for the gubernatorial election in Virginia, the day after the St Joseph by-election, had a similar deficiency. Most had a wide six- to 12-per cent point spread between the Democrats and Republicans, with the actual result only 2.5 per cent points apart. There was a similar overstatement of support for the third-party candidate, which may have confounded the results.

Given the variety of methodology used locally, it may be indicative that all the polls differed from the final result in roughly the same way. The poll which was by far the closest to the final result was consistent with the story that half of ILP voters “came home” to the UNC, while the other half, “true” ILP voters, half of whom live in strong PNM areas and the other half from strong UNC areas, returned to vote for the ILP a second time.

This article was written by Nigel Henry of Solution by Simulation, a private firm that uses computer modelling to provide insight into political contexts.

[bluefete]

What indication has he given that he WILL be better?

Remember Mrs. kamla was saying "we will rise! no more corruption!" yet look how we "rose" lol...

All politicians are the same IMO. Rowley's intentions are simply words at this moment, as were Mrs. Kamla's in 2010.

should Rowley become PM, I'd only deem him good if we see PROPER economic diversification as well as a better transportation system (I does want a train from town to Sando!). If not, then he WILL be of the same cloth.

Look at growley and kamla decisions made over the years

It is true that Rowley moved away from Manning when the corruption got too much for him. But what new ideas has he put forward? How has he shown that he is any different from what went before?

what new ideas we need again. tnt is full to the brim with ideas. the real issue is implementation and fine-tuning
time and time again we see govts especially this latest regime taking advantage of the inefficiencies of govt offices and other state enterprises giving the impression that they are working for the ppl. yes its true that ppl benefit but its still short term solutions to the problems we face.

So who is going to fix it then????

Correction. Who is willing to fix it then?

[rfari]

@bluefete, look at what we voted against in 2010 and u would understand where some of these 'fixes' originated and how unwilling we are to accept them

[desifemlove]

manning lost his way. I contend it was a grave for HIM not PNM or the country, since had he resigned and we even had 2 years of PM Rowley, Kamla may still have won in 2015 but not so handsomely IMO.

[rfari]

Tbh, pp is in a better position than the pnm for 2015 elections. If ilp joins the coalition and cop remains, all dogs ded. Pp will more than likely get re-elected. And kamla et al know that.

so how come PP lose much of North in LGEs?

PP has to keep about 11 seats in North, and remember these are PNM areas.

I ent no PNM, doh get me wrong (I detest them, but that's a side point). But if these elections are played out, Mrs. Kamla would only have her seats in South/Central, and Prakass would get wiped out..

I did a rough check a while back based on a two 'party' election race; a full pp (unc, cop, ilp) vs pnm and assumptions on marginal seat voting patterns. When i finish wacker this stretch of grass here i go drop some monkey maths (not related to new species' monkey logic) in le ched

21-UNC, 20-PNM. being conservative here
Arima PNM
Arouca/Maloney PNM
Barataria/San Juan UNC
Caroni Central UNC
Caroni East UNC
Chaguanas East UNC
Chaguanas West UNC
Couva North UNC
Couva South UNC
Cumuto/Manzanilla UNC
D’Abadie/O’Meara PNM
Diego Martin Central PNM
Diego Martin North/East PNM
Diego Martin West PNM
Fyzabad UNC
La Brea PNM
La Horquetta/Talparo PNM
Laventille East/Morvant PNM
Laventille West PNM
Lopinot/Bon Air West PNM
Mayaro UNC
Moruga/Tableland UNC
Naparima UNC
Oropouche East UNC
Oropouche West UNC
Pt Fortin PNM
Pointe-à-Pierre UNC
Port-of-Spain North/St Ann's West PNM
Port-of-Spain South PNM
Princes Town UNC
San Fernando East PNM
San Fernando West PNM
Siparia UNC
St Ann's East PNM
St Augustine UNC
St Joseph UNC
Tabaquite UNC
Tobago East PNM
Tobago West PNM
Toco/ Sangre Grande PNM
Tunapuna UNC

[Dizzy28]

At 21/20 nothing will get done in Trinidad. The opposition will have enough of a margin to oppose and block lots of legislation.

[rfari]

At 21/20 nothing will get done in Trinidad.

Nothing new from the ppg there.

[D music 4 life]

UNC not getting no Tunapuna & St. Joseph this is inaccurate. Lucky if they get Pointe-à-Pierre.

[rfari]

UNC not getting no Tunapuna & St. Joseph this is inaccurate. Lucky if they get Pointe-à-Pierre.

so wha u saying is that i should fill out meh pnm membership application form all now so den?

[zoom rader]

UNC not getting no Tunapuna & St. Joseph this is inaccurate. Lucky if they get Pointe-à-Pierre.

so wha u saying is that i should fill out meh pnm membership application form all now so den?

huh? u cant refill out something that you alreay have

[rfari]

UNC not getting no Tunapuna & St. Joseph this is inaccurate. Lucky if they get Pointe-à-Pierre.

so wha u saying is that i should fill out meh pnm membership application form all now so den?

huh? u cant refill out something that you alreay have

one of the many things that you imagine in ur head and believe to be the truth. im putting this in the box with all the unc propaganda u been pushing

[SiR8081]

Kamla gets international award
PM : “There is not a morning that I wake up when I do not think about what is in the best interest of the citizens of Trinidad and Tobago. It is their will that guides me in every decision that I make"

By Multimedia Desk
Story Created: Nov 12, 2013 at 1:30 PM ECT
Story Updated: Nov 12, 2013 at 1:33 PM ECT
The Office of the Prime Minister today issued a statement regarding an award received by Prime Minister Kamla Persad-Bissessar. The following is the statement -

Trinidad and Tobago’s Prime Minister, Honourable Kamla Persad-Bissessar, SC, MP has been awarded the 2013 “Democracy Medal” by the 46th World Conference of the International Association of Political Consultants during an event in Antigua. The Prime Minister who did not attend the award ceremony due to a heavy work schedule at home; instead sent a written letter of thanks which was read to the participants attending the gala event.


The IAPC awards its Democracy Medal to an individual or organisation who, in the judgement of its membership, has worked courageously to foster, promote and sustain the democratic process anywhere in the world. Past recipients of this prestigious award include Lech Walesa, Nelson Mandela, and more recently, Viktor Yushchenko of Ukraine.


The IAPC has two primary goals. First and foremost the organisation is committed to fostering democracy and the democratic process throughout the world. Secondly, the organisation has remained true to its original mission of fostering the growing and diverse profession of political consulting as well as the practical aspects of democratic elections.


Conference chairman, Mathew McMillan said “Mrs. Persad-Bissessar is a true trail-blazer in the Caribbean region. The IPAC believes that her rise to power in Trinidad and Tobago is a testament to the progress of women both here in the region and around the world. Her policy initiatives have been revolutionising and her commitment to the development of her country and the Caribbean has been uncompromising.”


In her acceptance letter which was read to the membership of the IAPC, the Prime Minister sent greetings to the conference on behalf of the citizens of Trinidad and Tobago and stated that she was honoured to have been recognised by the conference.


“Perhaps at no time has the democratic tradition been more evident than this year, 2013, when our country witnessed (4) four separate elections; all of which were conducted without incident and within the time frames specified in our constitution and with the avid participatory of our citizens.”


The Prime Minister continued “There is not a morning that I wake up when I do not think about what is in the best interest of the citizens of Trinidad and Tobago. It is their will that guides me in every decision that I make. It is the gift of Independence that ensures our freedom to be empowered to make choices and decisions that benefit ourselves.”
Mrs. Persad-Bissessar said that she looked forward to continuing to work with world leaders and with all Caribbean stakeholders, to forge solutions in the interest of the global community, regardless of size or income.


The award features a burnished rendering of Acroplis, etched in relief on the face of a large bronze medal. The backside contains the engraved name of the recipient and the year it was bestowed. Appropriately, the certificate which accompanies the medal includes this universally recognised definition of democracy.

http://www.trinidadexpress.com/news/PM- ... 97221.html

[rfari]

not impressed. seems like it was a pity-party for caribbean women this year. tsk tsk tsk

2013 Prime Ministers Portia Simpson Miller (Jamaica) & Kamla Persad-Bissessar (Trinidad & Tobago)

http://www.iapc.org/about/democracy-award

[skl]

It is true that Rowley moved away from Manning when the corruption got too much for him. But what new ideas has he put forward? How has he shown that he is any different from what went before?

Has Kamla moved away from the corruption of the cabal ?

[wagonrunner]

http://wired868.com/2013/11/12/peeping-anand-ags-extraordinary-attack-on-bikini-clad-reporter/

Attorney General Anand Ramlogan’s quixotic fight with the local media reached a new low on the weekend when he allowed his Facebook page to be used as a platform for a bizarre attack on Trinidad Express reporter Asha Javeed.

The attack video, which was created anonymously and is also on the UNC’s Facebook page, claimed to offer proof that Javeed is “in bed with the PNM.”


Photo: Can someone tell Anand Ramlogan’s mom what he has been up to on Facebook?
Mr Live Wire examined its contents.

There is a recent police report of domestic violence filed by Javeed against “Pierre Paul Phelps”, who is said to be the brother of PNM member Justin Phelps. Therefore, according to the video, Javeed is linked to the PNM.

Presumably, the AG believes that siblings always share each other’s political leanings. It is anyone’s guess what Danny and Robin Montano or Prakash and Kishore Ramadhar might think of that.

A three-year-old photograph of ex-AG John Jeremie with Javeed and her eight-year-old son is said to suggest, incorrectly, that Jeremie fathered the reporter’s child.

Mr Live Wire would like to advise the AG that children are not made retroactively by the snap of a camera. Expect a legal bill for that tip in the mail.

And, finally, a photo of a bikini-clad Javeed was somehow said to have a violent lover’s disagreement between Phelps, Jeremie and the reporter. There is no evidence to support that allegation and, perhaps, the poster simply could not pass on the opportunity to show an attractive young lady in a two-piece.

Or the People’s Partnership wanted to bully reporters of high reputation by attempting to humiliate and intimidate them for merely doing their jobs.

The attacks on Javeed began around the same time as her exclusives on then National Quarries chairman Mitra Ramkhelewan, who was subsequently fired.

And how did Javeed’s own employer, the Express, respond to the blows sustained while she was providing the paper with front page articles?

The Express might have had its lawyers take immediate steps to have the material taken down. It might have demanded an apology from the AG for his role in the malicious cyber-bullying; or sought an explanation from the Police Service as to how a police report ended up being exploited for political gain.

Instead, under the headline “Express stands for fearless journalism”, the Express used six paragraphs to assure readers of its own greatness and just one to defend Javeed. There were 10 references to the Express in the article and just two mentions of “the journalist.”

The Media Association of Trinidad and Tobago (MATT), of which Express editor-in-chief Omatie Lyder is an executive member, said nothing at all.With friends like these, it is little wonder that the media fraternity is not exactly overflowing with reporters who are willing to challenge the status quo.

Thus far, People’s Partnership ministers have claimed knowledge of where reporters live, shop, vacation, what vehicles they drive and their medical histories.

Now they have sunk to allowing photographs of journalists in their bathing suits with accompanying adolescent tongue wagging about their dating records.

Sometime in between, they presumably run the country.

Mr Live Wire only asks, in the interest of fairness, that he gets a few weeks to tone up before he becomes a target of the PP’s photo editors.

And what of an Attorney General who has repeatedly shown grave unsuitability to his lofty position ever since the Section 34 scandal?

Mr Live respectfully asks the Prime Minister to allow Ramlogan to follow his true calling; as a used car salesman.

I don't think ppl here understand what really going on in this country
a website is launched showing evidence of corruption and supporters dismiss it as conjecture
but they will swear on every single holy book that this vid is true
so all those documents are fake or conjecture but a pieced together vid with no definitive time line is correct
I swear in another country we would have had rebellion 20 years ago yes
we continue to justify sheit from every administration as long as is a party we support