Local Covid Anti-Vaxxers vs Studies Spammers

[De Dragon]

whats the point of calling a chemical a vax if u have to take it every 4 months? thats not a vax, that a medicine, a treatment.

and with chicken pox,, u should read up on how that vaccine was discovered. it ties in with ur post there, rather swimingly

It is a vaccine whether you like it or not. Multiple vaccines have boosters. That's not new.

If you have to be persuaded, reminded, bullied, pressured, bribed, incentivized, lied to, guilt tripped, coerced, socially shamed, censored, threatened, paid, punished and criminalized, to gain your compliance... You can be absolutely certain what is being promoted is NOT in your best interest.

No, it just means that you're stupid and misinformed.

[De Dragon]

Biden,Fauci and the whole parang band was saying that the virus will be stopped by the vaxx.

They then changed the tune.

Science changes.

Another dummy. When did they use the word "stop"
Has influenza, been "stopped"? Has chicken pox? MMR? Polio?

[sMASH]

^^ and alive.. no 5th shot in 2 years.

[De Dragon]

Of course you didn't reference the deaths, you wouldn't-the numbers in the control group occured at an exponentially higher rate.

Exponentially more.people from the control group ended up on mechanical ventilation.

So you run here and plaster a headline,of of a study of 500 odd people in a Malaysian study,take the result of an aspect of the study and broad brush it.

You're ignoring the summation of the tests on the fan boy site, to cherry pick the studies that you agree with.Nothing new.

Of course ON THE SITE there are multiple linked peer reviewed studies that are in support of the use of ivermectin and several against.

So any one here can and should do some digging and come to their own conclusion.

I highlighted one thing: the fanboy website of all things Ivermectin DOES NOT track all of the peer reviewed clinical studies. The few that exist don't support the website's position and even though mentioned, they are apparently glossed over.

I don't have a problem with being proven wrong. I just don't see anything that would help me to believe that Ivermectin is an effective COVID treatment. And you haven't shown anything.

You brought a study that results in the ivermectin group having significant reductions in death and ventilation vs the control group that received standard hospital care.

You pelt out the headline because it lines up with your view.
You choose not to mention the 70% reduction in death experienced by those that recieved Ivermectin.

You complaining about the website glossing over negative studies ...while ignoring 70% reduction in death and 50%+ ventilations.

You right you see very little.

I saw this. Did you?

I read the study. I didn't write it. Feel free to argue with the study authors. Maybe they will change their study results based on your input. Right now? You're just barking.

Red Colostomy Bag ever win an argument on 2NR?
He dotish on all topics!

[Redman]

You should read slower ed.

You asked which study I used to make up my mind....the answer is NONE....my mind was made up by first hand, front line, hands on experience from someone I trust.

Same thing with the vaxx-frontline Doc says take it... I took it

The studies are informative but like everything else-can be manipulated.
If that qualifies as bunk in your mind then ok, you need to pick what you want to use and deal with it.

Whatever I posted would have been in response to your or others questions.

You said there are no studies-well the site links studies that were done world wide.

Saying:
"Studies say what whoever paid for them say."

and
"The studies are informative but like everything else-can be manipulated."

Are two different things, dude.

Only if you want to be.pedantic.

Look at data ,get your info....pick your poison.

I am attempting to be straight up with you - so none of my forum bullshitt. I have read the entire study. I have seen the data you are quoting. I have read some of the rebuttals to the data.

The study in question has a certain design with a certain population that (in this case) gives a 95% confidence level that there are no significant errors. That sounds pretty good.

Now, the study DOES show that deaths and mechanical ventilation ARE significant. The raw data is there and the p-values indicate it.

The problem with drawing those conclusions from this study is that, in general, the population for a less likely primary outcome (like death) requires a larger population to test to the same 95% level of confidence. This study has about 500 participants. Based on the population death rate of Malaysia that was stated by the authors of the paper, a similarly well-designed study would need a population of about 10,000 participants. If you stick with the population size of 500 participants, you get ~1% level of confidence. That indicates errors are very likely (but not necessarily certain) with the number of deaths in the study.

So, this particular study only indicates that something may need to be tested further by yet another significantly larger study. Without the larger study, the number deaths as primary outcomes is indeterminant.

Dont attempt to be straight up-just be straight up.
My interests begin and end with what gets me and mine out on the other side of this in full health.
I believe that matches your interests for you and yours.
And to be clear-its great to discuss this sans BS.


I stated earlier that the study was narrow and any conclusions at best are weak.
Underpowered is the term Ive seen used for small studies.

My simple understanding of the p values within a study is that the lower the p value, the greater the confidence level.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2895822/

Thus a p value is simply a measure of the strength of evidence against H0. A study with a p = 0.531 has much less evidence against H0 than a study with a p = 0.058. However, a study with a p = 0.058 provides similar evidence as a study with a p = 0.049

The p value of the Primary outcome is .25, vs .09 for the mortality, and .17 for the Mech Ventilation (Life Support)
If my read on p values is correct(I am not certain) then the outcome with a p value of .25 has much less evidential strength than an outcome of .09
Is this correct?

So we have the published result being contradicted by two more serious outcomes with lower P values.

Getting away from Lies Damn lies and Statistics,

We have a study that has 3 sets of data that show the Ivm group having lower incidents of death,ICU,and Ventilation.

The Non Ivm group had less incidents of progression -but experienced more ICU,Ventilation and Death.

One can conclude that despite the higher progression in the Ivm group, the candidates handled it better than the non Ivm group.

If you were being admitted to a hospital in Malaysia today-which group would you want to be part of?
I would appreciate an answer.

When you go further and cloud the issue with the age of the participants,their high level of co morbidity, and their somewhat advanced C19 symptoms at the point of entry- How representative of anything is this entire study?

The published conclusion was a stretch and contradicted by the study itself.

[dogg]

Conversations Change with Context... I like this.... even for myself..that you can walk back from a certain position... doesn't make you "right all along" but context....

Regarding the 4 o'clock analogy, Joe wasn't saying "he was right all along", he was saying that we need to be able to discuss things because nothing is set in stone. If anything Joe has always proved himself to be able to 'stand corrected' BECAUSE nothing is set in stone.

Rogan taking a beating tho

3 or so podcasts out of 2000+

Rumble counter offers with 100 million reasons to migrate- Great move...

PBD drooling for a Musk/Rogan JV....Bosss Concept...

Jordan Peterson thinks they would be lunatics to drop him, contrasts CNN being ignorant of what it takes to have 11M followers.
MSM being beaten by a non journalist.

White house says drop him for fake news...but stayed quiet when Biden,Fauci and CNN said vaccines stopped transmission and infection.
DESPITE KNOWING THAT THE VAX DONT WORK. LIKE THAT.
Their doc lied,admitted to it on JRE but that ain't fake.

All of a sudden the C19 fake news is pushed back because he used the N word.

Lines are being drawn.
Main Stream Media is fighting for it's life, no rules and no prisoners.


Take a reacharound dey.

yuh posting sense again Reddo. Stop it.

Clearly you haven't seen Noah's response to the racist podcasts from Joe Rogan, maybe your admiration might drop a tad.

I have. Admiration levels like Bodi. Unaffected. Whats you point exactly tho. I not like dem others in here who does pick sense from your muffler bearing. Spell it out. What. Is. Your. Point?

I can tell you mine. I was never and continue to NOT have a solid stance on the issues being discussed within this thread. If anything i am constantly learning....Difference with you is you does buy the whole Vene apartment complex in Felicity and then when Police/GEB/SORT/Immigration raid does say "BUH I DIDNT KNOW THE OWNER WAS......"

you are Chief cook and bottle washer when it comes to taking other ppls medicine...doh stop!! its entertaining to us!

ok that was reaching ...hahahahahhaahaha but i'll leave you to type some cryptic response...yuh have time tho....Smallies coming fast and furious these days...

Also this. I am 1000% in agreement with this. So do the math.

You're an embarrassment to black people. A white man denigrates black people and your lame arse response is not to criticize it, but to try to denigrate me? Keep not having a solid stance because the last thing needed is a Trini Uncle Tom.

Why are you folks still arguing about irrelevant murikan talking heads??

[adnj]

Deutsche Telekom to build global COVID-19 vaccine verification app for WHO

23 Feb 2022

BERLIN: The World Health Organization has signed a contract with Deutsche Telekom subsidiary T-Systems to build a software solution for global electronic verification of coronavirus vaccination certificates, the telecoms company said.

The QR code-based software solution will be used for other vaccinations as well, such as polio or yellow fever, T-Systems said in a statement on Wednesday (Feb 23), adding that the WHO would support its 194 member states in building national and regional verification technology.

The financial details of the transaction were not disclosed.

"Health is a strategic growth area for T-Systems," said T-Systems Chief Executive Officer Adel Al-Saleh.

T-Systems previously worked with SAP to develop Germany's Corona-Warn-App tracing and verification app and a Europe-wide digital COVID-19 vaccine verification system.

https://www.channelnewsasia.com/busines ... ho-2514811

[matr1x]

Covid is a eat ah food. Nothing meant to cure

[st7]

Covid is a eat ah food. Nothing meant to cure

please tell me more.

[matr1x]

Has the vaccines cured a single person? Did it really help anyone? Or are we simply seeing natural immunity getting used to a pathogen?


But pharma made stupid amount of money as well as law enforcement. Imagine having mandates that every one has to take a vaccine.

[st7]

Has the vaccines cured a single person? Did it really help anyone? Or are we simply seeing natural immunity getting used to a pathogen?


But pharma made stupid amount of money as well as law enforcement. Imagine having mandates that every one has to take a vaccine.

please tell me more

[matr1x]

Has the vaccines cured a single person? Did it really help anyone? Or are we simply seeing natural immunity getting used to a pathogen?


But pharma made stupid amount of money as well as law enforcement. Imagine having mandates that every one has to take a vaccine.

please tell me more

More

[ed360123]

Has the vaccines cured a single person?

Vaccines aren't cures. That's not how they work.

Did it really help anyone? Or are we simply seeing natural immunity getting used to a pathogen

Yes, there are multiple statistics worldwide that show that vaccines decrease the chances of death and hospitalization.

Imagine having mandates that every one has to take a vaccine.

Those already exist. Children are required to be vaccinated against certain diseases both locally and in other countries. Many countries worldwide also require international travelers to be vaccinated for yellow fever and other diseases well before Corona existed.

[adnj]

You should read slower ed.

You asked which study I used to make up my mind....the answer is NONE....my mind was made up by first hand, front line, hands on experience from someone I trust.

Same thing with the vaxx-frontline Doc says take it... I took it

The studies are informative but like everything else-can be manipulated.
If that qualifies as bunk in your mind then ok, you need to pick what you want to use and deal with it.

Whatever I posted would have been in response to your or others questions.

You said there are no studies-well the site links studies that were done world wide.

Saying:
"Studies say what whoever paid for them say."

and
"The studies are informative but like everything else-can be manipulated."

Are two different things, dude.

Only if you want to be.pedantic.

Look at data ,get your info....pick your poison.

I am attempting to be straight up with you - so none of my forum bullshitt. I have read the entire study. I have seen the data you are quoting. I have read some of the rebuttals to the data.

The study in question has a certain design with a certain population that (in this case) gives a 95% confidence level that there are no significant errors. That sounds pretty good.

Now, the study DOES show that deaths and mechanical ventilation ARE significant. The raw data is there and the p-values indicate it.

The problem with drawing those conclusions from this study is that, in general, the population for a less likely primary outcome (like death) requires a larger population to test to the same 95% level of confidence. This study has about 500 participants. Based on the population death rate of Malaysia that was stated by the authors of the paper, a similarly well-designed study would need a population of about 10,000 participants. If you stick with the population size of 500 participants, you get ~1% level of confidence. That indicates errors are very likely (but not necessarily certain) with the number of deaths in the study.

So, this particular study only indicates that something may need to be tested further by yet another significantly larger study. Without the larger study, the number deaths as primary outcomes is indeterminant.

Dont attempt to be straight up-just be straight up.
My interests begin and end with what gets me and mine out on the other side of this in full health.
I believe that matches your interests for you and yours.
And to be clear-its great to discuss this sans BS.


I stated earlier that the study was narrow and any conclusions at best are weak.
Underpowered is the term Ive seen used for small studies.

My simple understanding of the p values within a study is that the lower the p value, the greater the confidence level.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2895822/

Thus a p value is simply a measure of the strength of evidence against H0. A study with a p = 0.531 has much less evidence against H0 than a study with a p = 0.058. However, a study with a p = 0.058 provides similar evidence as a study with a p = 0.049

The p value of the Primary outcome is .25, vs .09 for the mortality, and .17 for the Mech Ventilation (Life Support)
If my read on p values is correct(I am not certain) then the outcome with a p value of .25 has much less evidential strength than an outcome of .09
Is this correct?

So we have the published result being contradicted by two more serious outcomes with lower P values.

Getting away from Lies Damn lies and Statistics,

We have a study that has 3 sets of data that show the Ivm group having lower incidents of death,ICU,and Ventilation.

The Non Ivm group had less incidents of progression -but experienced more ICU,Ventilation and Death.

One can conclude that despite the higher progression in the Ivm group, the candidates handled it better than the non Ivm group.

If you were being admitted to a hospital in Malaysia today-which group would you want to be part of?
I would appreciate an answer.

When you go further and cloud the issue with the age of the participants,their high level of co morbidity, and their somewhat advanced C19 symptoms at the point of entry- How representative of anything is this entire study?

The published conclusion was a stretch and contradicted by the study itself.

You were told straight. You say that you don't understand the statistics, don't want the statistics but you're going to support your argument with the statistics.

You are saying nothing different from the study's authors; not one thing that does not appear in the report. What you willingly and doggedly fail to grasp is that based on the study that you say proves your point, there is no way to prove it correct or incorrect because the population of test subjects was too small. It is an indicator of something that appears to be significant.

You have drawn a conclusion from a study that can only support that outcome with a 1% level of confidence in the accuracy of that outcome. Is all of that is in the published document? Of course it is.

But what does the study show with relative certainty? If you get sick from COVID, ivermectin does NOT do shitt to keep you from getting even more sick. But you can't see that shitt in the data.

[bamfo_dennis]

y sum of u keep answerin d same tings over n over nover again. it look like dese dumkunts want d reality stone in dey life? y dey keep asking the same stupid ting n gettin d same answers n asking d same ting again n get d same answer n repeat d same question. if is not ivermectin is vaccine, is not dat is mask, is not dat is ivermectin again, is nut dat is fauci, is not dat is vaccine....

ah forget d question

[matr1x]

Has the vaccines cured a single person?

Vaccines aren't cures. That's not how they work.

Did it really help anyone? Or are we simply seeing natural immunity getting used to a pathogen

Yes, there are multiple statistics worldwide that show that vaccines decrease the chances of death and hospitalization.

Imagine having mandates that every one has to take a vaccine.

Those already exist. Children are required to be vaccinated against certain diseases both locally and in other countries. Many countries worldwide also require international travelers to be vaccinated for yellow fever and other diseases well before Corona existed.

They are not cures and don't stop the the spread

Those stats are based on? Can the definitively say the cause is the vaccines?

Mandates based on proven treatments to stop the spread

[adnj]

Has the vaccines cured a single person?

Vaccines aren't cures. That's not how they work.

Did it really help anyone? Or are we simply seeing natural immunity getting used to a pathogen

Yes, there are multiple statistics worldwide that show that vaccines decrease the chances of death and hospitalization.

Imagine having mandates that every one has to take a vaccine.

Those already exist. Children are required to be vaccinated against certain diseases both locally and in other countries. Many countries worldwide also require international travelers to be vaccinated for yellow fever and other diseases well before Corona existed.

They are not cures and don't stop the the spread

Those stats are based on? Can the definitively say the cause is the vaccines?

Mandates based on proven treatments to stop the spread

Then what are those treatments doing? Was it better before the treatments? I can countershittalk with youif you need it.

The difference is, I know what is going on. You just #makingupsomeshit

[adnj]

.....

[sMASH]

Hmm, natual immunity turns out to be better than the Vax immunity and longer lasting.
But I remmebr people saying the Vax immunity was better and they counldnt say if people got natural immunity.


Lol

[adnj]

Hmm, natual immunity turns out to be better than the Vax immunity and longer lasting.
But I remmebr people saying the Vax immunity was better and they counldnt say if people got natural immunity.


Lol

Survive COVID and get immunity OR

Get vaccinated, survive asymptomatic or mild COVID and get SUPER IMMUNITY.

[st7]

Hmm, natual immunity turns out to be better than the Vax immunity and longer lasting.
But I remmebr people saying the Vax immunity was better and they counldnt say if people got natural immunity.


Lol

why does it bother you so much that you go on and on about it?

[alfa]

Hmm, natual immunity turns out to be better than the Vax immunity and longer lasting.
But I remmebr people saying the Vax immunity was better and they counldnt say if people got natural immunity.


Lol

Them was the same people saying two weeks to flatten the curve. The science keeps changing again lol.

[Redman]

So adnj which group would you prefer to be in?
You eh answer that in your little rant.

[ed360123]

Hmm, natual immunity turns out to be better than the Vax immunity and longer lasting.
But I remmebr people saying the Vax immunity was better and they counldnt say if people got natural immunity.


Lol

Again, even if 'natural' immunity is better that vaccine immunity (which is still actively being investigated) it requires you to *get* the disease in the first place, which kind of defeats the point.

[adnj]

Hmm, natual immunity turns out to be better than the Vax immunity and longer lasting.
But I remmebr people saying the Vax immunity was better and they counldnt say if people got natural immunity.


Lol

why does it bother you so much that you go on and on about it?

Because he said dumb shitt and has to make everyone forget that he said dumbshitt.

A new study finds that two forms of immunity — breakthrough infections following vaccination or natural infection followed by vaccination — provide roughly equal levels of enhanced immune protection. The study published online today in the journal Science Immunology.

https://news.ohsu.edu/2022/01/25/new-st ... o-covid-19

[adnj]

Hoping for inferior nonvaccinated natural immunity for Carnival.
*fingers crossed*


Strong immunity against coronavirus infection is about the same between people who got vaccinated and then had a breakthrough infection vs. others who got infected first and then received immunization, a new study reveals.

Either way, people generally end up with a robust immune response because of this hybrid protection.

"It was interesting that the immune boost for vaccination following natural infection was so uniform, given that natural infection alone produces highly variable immunity," says study author William B. Messer, MD, PhD.

"This was novel, if not completely surprising," he says.

https://www.webmd.com/lung/news/2022012 ... accination

[sMASH]

Check ur trends. Vax released x covid spikes. Super spreader event, covid goes up. Omicron releases, covid dies down.


Dumb sheit seems to be true.

Taking a Vax every 4 months is not a Vax, that's treatment.

[adnj]

So adnj which group would you prefer to be in?
You eh answer that in your little rant.

What I choose ain't nobody's business.

[sMASH]

So adnj which group would you prefer to be in?
You eh answer that in your little rant.

What I choose ain't nobody's business.

Should mandate what u choose, cause choices have cwansequences.

[adnj]

Check ur trends. Vax released x covid spikes. Super spreader event, covid goes up. Omicron releases, covid dies down.


Dumb sheit seems to be true.

Taking a Vax every 4 months is not a Vax, that's treatment.

#samedumbshit #nothingfreshoverthere