The Religion Discussion

[megadoc1]

.......I say again ......the Holy bible was compiled with the assumption that the reader has a relationship with the Holy Spirit

I'm sure we can all agree that the Holy Bible (and the books contained therein) was written by man and compiled by man. But was this done with guidance from God? I have my doubts! it is ok to doubt
but God allows for you to test Him why not seek him out and see what he have to say for Himself ? because the last time I checked
Donald Morgan is a man too, be not deceived these are only excuses to not serve the true and living God ,you agree with them because it is natural for man to want to avoid God
but the words of and infinite God speaks over everything that man in his finite self can come up with

PR 30:5 Every word of God proves true.
1KI 22:23, 2CH 18:22, JE 4:10, JE 20:7, EZ 14:9 God deceives some of the prophets.
JE 8:8 The scribes (copyists, editors, teachers) falsify the word.
2TH 2:11-12 God deceives the wicked (to be able to condemn them).
(Note: Not every word of God can prove true if God deceives anyone at all; teaching from the Bible cannot be trusted if the scribes falsify the word. In other words, the first reference is mutually exclusive with the other three. Thus, the Bible cannot be the perfect work of a perfect, all-powerful and loving God since one or more of the above references is obviously untrue. Note also: Some versions use the word "persuade" rather than "deceives." The context makes clear, however, that deception is involved.)

GE 1:31 God was pleased with his creation.
GE 6:5-6 God was not pleased with his creation.
(Note: That God should be displeased is inconsistent with the concept of omniscience.)

GE 4:15, DT 32:19-27, IS 34:8 God is a vengeful god.
EX 15:3, IS 42:13, HE 12:29 God is a warrior. God is a consuming fire.
EX 20:5, 34:14, DT 4:24, 5:9, 6:15, 29:20, 32:21 God is a jealous god.
LE 26:7-8, NU 31:17-18, DT 20:16-17, JS 10:40, JG 14:19, EZ 9:5-7 The Spirit of God is (sometimes) murder and killing.
NU 25:3-4, DT 6:15, 9:7-8, 29:20, 32:21, PS 7:11, 78:49, JE 4:8, 17:4, 32:30-31, ZP 2:2 God is angry. His anger is sometimes fierce.
2SA 22:7-8 (KJV) "I called to the Lord; ... he heard my voice; ... The earth trembled and quaked, ... because he was angry. Smoke came from his nostrils. Consuming fire came from his mouth, burning coals blazed out of it."
EZ 6:12, NA 1:2, 6 God is jealous and furious. He reserves wrath for, and takes revenge on, his enemies. "... who can abide in the fierceness of his anger? His fury is poured out like fire, and rocks are thrown down by him."
2CO 13:11, 14, 1JN 4:8, 16 God is love.
GA 5:22-23 The fruit of the Spirit of God is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, faithfulness, gentleness and self-control.

http://www.infidels.org/library/modern/donald_morgan/inconsistencies.html

[Humes]

^ he needs to be ambiguous because he has no solid evidence of anything he is saying nor is he entirely sure of which points best support his argument.

megadoc1 and bluefete both have the same argument and that is "I am right".
That is what is entire 180+ thread is about, yet 180 pages later they still cannot prove that they are.

They cannot possibly prove it so they try mulitple angles, most of the angles obviously contradict each other and none are solid or factual = ambiguity.

Remember "politics has a morality of its own"?

Well belief has a logic of its own.

A logic based on illogic, misinformation, dishonesty and myopic interpretation over critical analysis. And the most amazing part of debates like these (other than the fact that otherwise intelligent people get suckered into arguing with these fellas) is not their adherence to it, but the way they truly, sincerely don't seem to understand how actual logic works.

These fellas sittin there honestly thinkin that the rubbish they talkin makes sense.

It is f*ckin incredible.

[megadoc1]

I have learnt that
the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God
and
the peace of God, which passeth all understanding, shall keep your hearts and minds through Christ Jesus.

[16 cycles]

hey - which mall do you save ppl at?

[megadoc1]

at any mall we chose to go to

[Computerman]

it is ok to doubt but God allows for you to test Him

How do I test God? SAT's?

why not seek him out and see what he have to say for Himself?

How do I seek him out? Twitter?

because the last time I checked Donald Morgan is a man too

I'm glad to see we agree on somthing. Donald Morgan is indeed a man! I think.

be not deceived these are only excuses to not serve the true and living God ,you agree with them because it is natural for man to want to avoid God

Why is it natural for man to want to avoid God? Did he make us this way?

but the words of and infinite God speaks over everything that man in his finite self can come up with

So then I will not actually be able to 'hear' or comprehend the words of God? How then do I listen to his word?

[megadoc1]

it is ok to doubt but God allows for you to test Him

How do I test God? SAT's?
nope you can test his word to see if its truth, Christians are to test the bible to prove it to themselves
what you can do is go and see if what Christians claim are happening is as they say

why not seek him out and see what he have to say for Himself?

How do I seek him out? Twitter?
his kingdom where his people gathers he is always in the midst of them
or in your private place you can call out to Jesus and ask him to show you the way just open your heart to Jesus

because the last time I checked Donald Morgan is a man too

I'm glad to see we agree on somthing. Donald Morgan is indeed a man! I think.

be not deceived these are only excuses to not serve the true and living God ,you agree with them because it is natural for man to want to avoid God

Why is it natural for man to want to avoid God? because it is in our nature Did he make us this way?
nope but thru disobedience man are separated from God and the god of this world has become
the spiritual father of anyone born of a man
if it sounds silly ask yourself this, all the wrong things you have done in your life who taught you? it seemed natural ent?

but the words of and infinite God speaks over everything that man in his finite self can come up with

So then I will not actually be able to 'hear' or comprehend the words of God? he made a way for you to do so but it is the very one you are rejecting How then do I listen to his word?
when it is spoken, if you believe open your heart up to Him (Jesus)and he will reveal Himself to you thru his word, if you don't believe you remain in your status, separated from God...and all what is said will continue to be foolishness to you

[Computerman]

nope but thru disobedience man are separated from God and the god of this world has become the spiritual father of anyone born of a man
if it sounds silly ask yourself this, all the wrong things you have done in your life who taught you? it seemed natural ent?

All the wrongs I learned from mortal men/women. But so too did I learn all the good! But it was my choice, my 'free will' which allowed me to decide the path I would take at each fork in the road of life. Did God guide me in my choices? I can't say for sure! But I would like to believe he did when I asked for it. But guidance and blind fellowship are not the same. If I were to praise him for all the good that has come to me then, in the same breath, so too should I curse him for all the wrong! For if I am to beleive that everything I do and every decision I make is "the will of God" then I forgo taking responsibility for my own actions and decisions. Such thinking is that of a simple-minded drone (and possible symptoms of an obsessive-compulsive disorder).
And no, it did not seem "Natural" to do wrong.

he made a way for you to do so but it is the very one you are rejecting

The Holy Bible??!! Didn't we deal with this issue already?

when it is spoken, if you believe open your heart up to Him (Jesus)and he will reveal Himself to you thru his word, if you don't believe you remain in your status, separated from God...and all what is said will continue to be foolishness to you

I am not seperated from God son. I pray every day. I have my own personal understanding of, and relationship with God. I do not rely on religious dogma to dictate all the aspects of my existence! I have long passed that stage of ignorance!

[16 cycles]

at any mall we chose to go to

could you post a schedule or make a courtesy post here so those of us wishing to attend can come?

[megadoc1]

nope but thru disobedience man are separated from God and the god of this world has become the spiritual father of anyone born of a man
if it sounds silly ask yourself this, all the wrong things you have done in your life who taught you? it seemed natural ent?

All the wrongs I learned from mortal men/women. ah ha But so too did I learn all the good! But it was my choice, my 'free will' which allowed me to decide the path I would take at each fork in the road of life. Did God guide me in my choices? I can't say for sure! But I would like to believe he did when I asked for it. But guidance and blind fellowship are not the same. If I were to praise him for all the good that has come to me then, in the same breath, so too should I curse him for all the wrong! For if I am to beleive that everything I do and every decision I make is "the will of God" then I forgo taking responsibility for my own actions and decisions. Such thinking is that of a simple-minded drone (and possible symptoms of an obsessive-compulsive disorder). yeah its not right to think you are doing the will of God when you don't even know what it is
And no, it did not seem "Natural" to do wrong.
but then how did you know it was wrong?

he made a way for you to do so but it is the very one you are rejecting

The Holy Bible??!! no Jesus Didn't we deal with this issue already? C'mon

when it is spoken, if you believe open your heart up to Him (Jesus)and he will reveal Himself to you thru his word, if you don't believe you remain in your status, separated from God...and all what is said will continue to be foolishness to you

I am not seperated from God son. I pray every day. I have my own personal understanding of, and relationship with God. I do not rely on religious dogma to dictate all the aspects of my existence! I have long passed that stage of ignorance! well good luck!...but tell me why do you feel the need to look back?

at any mall we chose to go to

could you post a schedule or make a courtesy post here so those of us wishing to attend can come?

when we are moving in a group the decision to go where we go is known after we pray..... but I will see what I can do because a lot of times we end up in movietowne

[16 cycles]

^cool

[sMASH]

^^ pray for a schedule

[Computerman]

yeah its not right to think you are doing the will of God when you don't even know what it is

And the question therefore is "Do you know what the will of God is? If so, who told you?"

but then how did you know it was wrong?

We covered this already by your previous question and my previous response. But let me simplify it for you, society! What you should have asked was "why did it not seem natural?" My response to that is again simple, "it did not feel good to make others feel bad!"

no Jesus Didn't we deal with this issue already? C'mon

Yes I think we did. We crucified him didn't we?

well good luck!...but tell me why do you feel the need to look back?

Personally, I find it important to look back and remember where I came from (in all aspects of my life) so I can truly appreciate where I am now and where I am going in the future.

[Duane 3NE 2NR]

stop assuming nah, who said we don't ? we even do it in the malls
this is not something special or confined ,it is the natural Christian life
the kingdom of heaven is wherever a Christian goes

that's nice, so if you are doing this all over the place why are there still sick people and the need for doctors?

oh and when you use the term church as in the building that is kinda religious
the church is actually the people who follows Jesus so wherever the church is
miracles happen

LOL @ you not wanting to be considered "religious".

it is natural for man to want to avoid God

really? Why did God make us this way?

all the wrong things you have done in your life who taught you? it seemed natural ent?

Failed logic again. Are you purporting that all the right things he did was taught to him by your God?

And no, it did not seem "Natural" to do wrong.

but then how did you know it was wrong?

errr, if he it was natural then he WOULDN'T know it was wrong!

when we are moving in a group the decision to go where we go is known after we pray..... but I will see what I can do because a lot of times we end up in movietowne

LOL, wait wait wait, so you pray and God tells you where to go and of all the places in need to healing it turns out to be movietowne? ROFL

Why not a children's home or a poor family or a hospital?
You pray to find out that you should go to Movietowne? LOLOLOL

[megadoc1]

yeah its not right to think you are doing the will of God when you don't even know what it is

And the question therefore is "Do you know what the will of God is? for my life yes If so, who told you?"God and it was confirmed by to persons years apart

but then how did you know it was wrong?

We covered this already by your previous question and my previous response. But let me simplify it for you, society! oh so people dictates what is good and bad ? What you should have asked was "why did it not seem natural?" My response to that is again simple, "it did not feel good to make others feel bad!" by who standards? society?

no Jesus Didn't we deal with this issue already? C'mon

Yes I think we did. We crucified him didn't we?
am... when I said Jesus I meant that he is the way to understanding the word of God
and if you reject him you reject the only way God chose to reveal himself to you

well good luck!...but tell me why do you feel the need to look back?

Personally, I find it important to look back and remember where I came from (in all aspects of my life) so I can truly appreciate where I am now and where I am going in the future. wow deep but I look to forward to Jesus because thru my faith in him I have an expected end

stop assuming nah, who said we don't ? we even do it in the malls
this is not something special or confined ,it is the natural Christian life
the kingdom of heaven is wherever a Christian goes

that's nice, so if you are doing this all over the place why are there still sick people and the need for doctors?
because 1 a lot of people reject Jesus, and as long as they do he cannot affect them and the more of them do it is the more of them will remain with their infirmities until a doctor cure them
and 2 there is a need for more laborers in the kingdom of heaven
something we are instructed to pray for but by the mean while we are doing our part

oh and when you use the term church as in the building that is kinda religious
the church is actually the people who follows Jesus so wherever the church is
miracles happen

LOL @ you not wanting to be considered "religious".
yuh know what I talking about

it is natural for man to want to avoid God

really? Why did God make us this way? over a hundred pages ago we dealt with this
and even a few post up I said God never made man so but thru disobedience man inherited that nature

[

all the wrong things you have done in your life who taught you? it seemed natural ent?

Failed logic again. Are you purporting that all the right things he did was taught to him by your God?
well he answered an said people taught him.....check his response

And no, it did not seem "Natural" to do wrong.

but then how did you know it was wrong?

errr, if he it was natural then he WOULDN'T know it was wrong! I gathered it was based on what society said....check his response

when we are moving in a group the decision to go where we go is known after we pray..... but I will see what I can do because a lot of times we end up in movietowne

LOL, wait wait wait, so you pray and God tells you where to go and of all the places in need to healing it turns out to be movietowne? ROFL
amm.. when we are going to the malls?

Why not a children's home or a poor family or a hospital?
You pray to find out that you should go to Movietowne? LOLOLOL
you very well know how to throttle your intellect the guy wanted to know when we are at the MALLS
and whats wrong with movietowne ? I have experienced so much great things there

[Duane 3NE 2NR]

^I'm sure you have

exactly what do you do there?
go to the dens of iniquity and correct the wrongs they are doing?

and it was confirmed by to persons years apart

confirmed how?

[illumin@ti]

^ he needs to be ambiguous because he has no solid evidence of anything he is saying nor is he entirely sure of which points best support his argument.

megadoc1 and bluefete both have the same argument and that is "I am right".
That is what is entire 180+ thread is about, yet 180 pages later they still cannot prove that they are.

They cannot possibly prove it so they try mulitple angles, most of the angles obviously contradict each other and none are solid or factual = ambiguity.

Remember "politics has a morality of its own"?

Well belief has a logic of its own.

A logic based on illogic, misinformation, dishonesty and myopic interpretation over critical analysis. And the most amazing part of debates like these (other than the fact that otherwise intelligent people get suckered into arguing with these fellas) is not their adherence to it, but the way they truly, sincerely don't seem to understand how actual logic works.

These fellas sittin there honestly thinkin that the rubbish they talkin makes sense.

It is f*ckin incredible.

HUMES,,, dude ,, u just made my day

[megadoc1]

^I'm sure you have

exactly what do you do there? exactly what I say we do
go to the dens of iniquity and correct the wrongs they are doing?

and it was confirmed by to persons years apart

confirmed how?
word of knowledge

[Duane 3NE 2NR]

^I'm sure you have

exactly what do you do there?

exactly what I say we do

and what did you say you do?

confirmed how?

word of knowledge

oh so you dreamed it!

[Humes]

Word is bond, homie.

[Duane 3NE 2NR]

examples of "word of knowledge" in front of congregations is perhaps the best example of pentecostal evangelism trying hard to prove itself yet these acts have never been proven any more than fortune tellers with crystal balls.

Interestingly governments hire psychics but they don't seem to hire people with "word of knowledge"

[sMASH]

word of knowledge, edify, testify, testimonial, the coloration these words conjure up... u sure not not doing religion?

[cacasplat3]

^ he needs to be ambiguous because he has no solid evidence of anything he is saying nor is he entirely sure of which points best support his argument.

megadoc1 and bluefete both have the same argument and that is "I am right".
That is what is entire 180+ thread is about, yet 180 pages later they still cannot prove that they are.

They cannot possibly prove it so they try mulitple angles, most of the angles obviously contradict each other and none are solid or factual = ambiguity.

Remember "politics has a morality of its own"?

Well belief has a logic of its own.

A logic based on illogic, misinformation, dishonesty and myopic interpretation over critical analysis. And the most amazing part of debates like these (other than the fact that otherwise intelligent people get suckered into arguing with these fellas) is not their adherence to it, but the way they truly, sincerely don't seem to understand how actual logic works.

These fellas sittin there honestly thinkin that the rubbish they talkin makes sense.

It is f*ckin incredible.

HUMES,,, dude ,, u just made my day

i lol'ed when i read it as well........

^I'm sure you have

exactly what do you do there?

exactly what I say we do

and what did you say you do?

confirmed how?

word of knowledge

oh so you dreamed it!

i'd like to see a proper response from him, for once at least..........the questions are relevant ones to the discussion.............a discussion that is on-going.........yet answers that lack any real information keep being used..............

[Computerman]

God and it was confirmed by to persons years apart

So, just curious, but did you require confirmation by these two persons? Or did you take God at his word?

oh so people dictates what is good and bad ?

Yes. Mat 16:19 And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.

by who standards? society?

Yes. Genesis 1:26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

am... when I said Jesus I meant that he is the way to understanding the word of God

I most certainly agree with this statement. Jesus is the teacher of the word of God.

and if you reject him you reject the only way God chose to reveal himself to you

I disagree with this statement. If Jesus is the only "true" word of God, then other beliefs would not be able to arrive at identical principles because they would, by definition, lack a suitable philosophical foundation on which to build. When Jesus was asked for his definition of the greatest commandment, he replied that the "greatest commandment" was to "love one another" and "do unto others." If this was the greatest commandment to have been revealed by God through Jesus, then it could not arise from an unbeliever. However, since this same principle was known to the followers of the Buddha and to Confucius, both of whom lived 500 years prior to Jesus, they must have arrived at it without having it revealed to them by Jesus! Based on your statement how is that possible?

wow deep but I look to forward to Jesus because thru my faith in him I have an expected end

http://www.bci.org/prophecy-fulfilled/leaven.htm

[Duane 3NE 2NR]

When Jesus was asked for his definition of the greatest commandment, he replied that the "greatest commandment" was to "love one another" and "do unto others."

this goes against what megadoc1 has been "preaching"

loving one another and doing good for others as you would have them done unto you megadoc1 claims are prideful acts in his God's eyes

Megadoc1 claims that doing good works by yourself is prideful in God's eyes. I see no logic in this.

[megadoc1]

God and it was confirmed by to persons years apart

So, just curious, but did you require confirmation by these two persons? Or did you take God at his word?
lets not go any further on this

oh so people dictates what is good and bad ?

Yes. Mat 16:19 And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.
am... this verse speaks about the power Christians have over everything spiritually on the earth,it speaks nothing about what is considered good or bad

by who standards? society?

Yes. Genesis 1:26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.this verse also speaks about the power man have over everything on the earth (including satan) it speaks nothing about what should be considered good or bad
hint: read further on and see where God warned about the tree of good and evil

am... when I said Jesus I meant that he is the way to understanding the word of God

I most certainly agree with this statement. Jesus is the teacher of the word of God. true but I think you aint quite understand it ,Jesus is the word

and if you reject him you reject the only way God chose to reveal himself to you

I disagree with this statement. If Jesus is the only "true" word of God, then other beliefs would not be able to arrive at identical principles because they would, by definition, lack a suitable philosophical foundation on which to build. When Jesus was asked for his definition of the greatest commandment, he replied that the "greatest commandment" was to "love one another" and "do unto others." If this was the greatest commandment to have been revealed by God through Jesus, then it could not arise from an unbeliever. However, since this same principle was known to the followers of the Buddha and to Confucius, both of whom lived 500 years prior to Jesus, they must have arrived at it without having it revealed to them by Jesus! Based on your statement how is that possible?because you misunderstood, thru faith in Jesus Christ upon hearing his word ,if you open your heart to him he comes in and revealed himself to you thru his word (the bible),if you don't let him in you are stuck with only the principles you gathered from his word (the bible) but not him(Jesus) who is most important because its all about Jesus

wow deep but I look to forward to Jesus because thru my faith in him I have an expected end

http://www.bci.org/prophecy-fulfilled/leaven.htm

[megadoc1]

When Jesus was asked for his definition of the greatest commandment, he replied that the "greatest commandment" was to "love one another" and "do unto others."

this goes against what megadoc1 has been "preaching"
show me where, I dare you....because Jesus also says how a man can enter into the kingdom of heaven but you choose to ignore it
(you claim otherwise)
he says whoever believes in him the things he did we can do also but you choose to ignore it
(you claim its false)
he speaks about hell and who goes into it but you chose to ignore it
(you don't believe that)
but hear this Jesus also said "If you love me you will keep my commandments "
so I kinda want to know how do you keep his commandment and not love him? or how can one love him and not keep his commandments?

loving one another and doing good for others as you would have them done unto you megadoc1 claims are prideful acts in his God's eyes this is a lie

Megadoc1 claims that doing good works by yourself is prideful in God's eyes. I see no logic in this.

am .............. you keep them comming if you didn't use logic when you make this post how can you see logic in it?

[d spike]

...loving one another and doing good for others as you would have them done unto you megadoc1 claims are prideful acts in his God's eyes this is a lie

Megadoc1 claims that doing good works by yourself is prideful in God's eyes. I see no logic in this.

am .............. you keep them comming if you didn't use logic when you make this post how can you see logic in it?

Megadoc, I fear you have started using a particular word, of which you seem to have no practical experience...
Exactly what in Duane's post do you find not logical?

[megadoc1]

...loving one another and doing good for others as you would have them done unto you megadoc1 claims are prideful acts in his God's eyes this is a lie

Megadoc1 claims that doing good works by yourself is prideful in God's eyes. I see no logic in this.

am .............. you keep them comming if you didn't use logic when you make this post how can you see logic in it?

Megadoc, I fear you have started using a particular word, of which you seem to have no practical experience...
Exactly what in Duane's post do you find not logical?

I think you are right d spike its not really his post that is not logical but it is the deceitful way he puts it, pretending not to understand what I was saying while pushing the roman catholic concept which was used to enslave believers in Christ, the very system that had you killed for reading the bible in English !

but I will say it again you cannot get to heaven with "good works" but thru faith in Jesus christ
also thru faith in Jesus Christ "good works" comes as a result of his love
in other words the motive behind Good works will be love (full stop no reward)
God commanded that we love one another so as long as I love good works follows as a demonstration of love so our good works comes as a result of faith

I never said it is bad if you do good works , all I am saying is, that is not what gets you to heaven(if you believe in heaven that is) and wishes to go there

[Duane 3NE 2NR]

megadoc1 time and time again you have repeated that doing good acts to be a good person is seen as a filthy rag in the eyes of God.
SO please stop contradicting yourself and please learn the meaning of the word "logical"

oh and please show me REAL evidence of "word of knowledge" taking place.
"word of knowledge" is used as a bait tactic by evangelists to convince gullible followers that the preacher is guided by the holy spirit.