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Race and Crime

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zoom rader
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Re: Race and Crime

Postby zoom rader » May 20th, 2024, 12:59 pm

Habit7 wrote:
st7 wrote:
Habit7 wrote:
The_Honourable wrote:Now PNM is not going to pull that elimination trigger because they want afros dumbed down and beholden to the party.

What is this elimination trigger?

Afros are only 34% of the population but PNM wins 50% of the vote. Since PNM is buoyed by these “dumb” Afros who are the perpetrators of crime that magically turn that 34 into 50%. What is this elimination trigger that PNM doesn’t want to pull because it will harm them?

It is easy to talk about these things as if they are unicorns and fairies. But what is this one action that doesn’t violate the constitution and doesn’t open up the govt to legal damages, that can solve crime in the country?


you are assuming that the 35% indians all showing up to vote. obviously not all 34% of afros showing up to vote either but voting population is not the same category as the ethnic demographics.

that's not how your maths work. it is possible that 25% of afros who vote make up the 90% of pnm votes or 44% of overall election votes leaving a little amount of other race voters for pnm. i only making assumptions here cause clearly you are as well.

I was being facetious. PNM cannot win on the support on Afros alone. They win with a wide cross section of support because are not enough Afros to ensure their victory even if every Afro votes for them which doesn’t happen.

Therefore to make the dumb claim that “they want afros dumbed down and beholden to the party” is not supported by maths because Afro alone can’t ensure them victory.
PNM only wins by shifting boundaries, fake vote and use of criminal gangs

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Re: Race and Crime

Postby mero » May 20th, 2024, 1:40 pm

How does the UNC win?

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Re: Race and Crime

Postby j.o.e » May 20th, 2024, 2:51 pm

mero wrote:How does the UNC win?


They don’t …. Especially under KPB

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Re: Race and Crime

Postby The_Honourable » May 20th, 2024, 2:52 pm

j.o.e wrote:
mero wrote:How does the UNC win?


They don’t …. Especially under KPB


Was about to say...

mero you self... :lol:

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Re: Race and Crime

Postby The_Honourable » May 20th, 2024, 3:00 pm

Habit7 wrote:
The_Honourable wrote:
Habit7 wrote:
The_Honourable wrote:Now PNM is not going to pull that elimination trigger because they want afros dumbed down and beholden to the party.

What is this elimination trigger?

Afros are only 34% of the population but PNM wins 50% of the vote. Since PNM is buoyed by these “dumb” Afros who are the perpetrators of crime that magically turn that 34 into 50%. What is this elimination trigger that PNM doesn’t want to pull because it will harm them?

It is easy to talk about these things as if they are unicorns and fairies. But what is this one action that doesn’t violate the constitution and doesn’t open up the govt to legal damages, that can solve crime in the country?


So you read my whole post, and choose one sentence with pnm in it :?

Where in my statement I talking about voting? Yuh conveniently skip the part where i said the big fishes finance both parties ent?

Go back and read, the elimination trigger is to use draconian measures to deal with ALL involved in the drug, gun and human trafficking trade. From the afro foot soldiers on the ground to the rich indo, chinee and syrian/lebanese who import and finance the trade. But as shakes say, nobody have the balls to do that.

But here nah...

alfa ask you a question earlier and you not answering. What can be done to prevent home invasions? and I will ask, what can be done about the drugs, guns, and human trafficking taking place in this country? cause so far Erla praying and PNM failing.

You think you answered what is the elimination trigger but you didn’t.

It is easy to say get rid of soldiers and the financiers (unlike I won’t use racial stereotypes of them because you will be quite surprised of the reality). But we are still a country governed by laws. The govt got resistance passing antigang laws and only could pass a watered down version. Restricting bail was challenged by UNC proxies. Interception of Communications bill was watered down too. Nearly every crime bill was watered down or not supported because “Rowley would be a dictator.” We can’t execute murderers while PC is the final court but you don’t support CCJ because PNM will influence them. Financiers supporting crime but a UNC MP say “snitches get stitches” so we can’t get Whistleblower legislation

So if you believe crime can be eliminated by easily pulling a trigger, but that trigger is same draconian measures that govt has no support or legal authority to do, then you are just being simplistic.

What I am doing is make you all hear yourself because you all believe T&T’s crime problem is simple and all we need is some messiah in govt or TTPS to just lock up everybody. I am saying it is a lot more complicated than you all making it out to be. I am not going to make the same mistake as you all as say all we need to do is press this one button and crime is done. That is allyuh folly.

I can easily plan with my boys to invade some vulnerable person, and if we are smart enough to not leave any clues, TTPS cannot predict my actions nor would they be able to detect my actions.

Crime prevention is the responsibility for every Trinibagonian. But according to some here, it is problem only for Afro Trinis who are somehow both heavily involved in crime and are ardent supporters of the PNM. So ardent that they are a demographic PNM doesn’t want to hurt. As if UNC didn’t want to hurt their pedophile demographic by rejecting changing the child marriage age.


Aye... I didn't ask you what is pnm plan which is blaming the opposition when bills don't pass. I didn't ask you about child marriage.

I told you plain what is needed to be done, draconian as it is. If you don't like it, let me hear YOUR solution.

I want to hear YOU...

YOU

YOU

YOU

What is YOUR solution on preventing home invasions? What is YOUR solution in dealing with drugs, guns, and human trafficking taking place in this country?

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Re: Race and Crime

Postby zoom rader » May 20th, 2024, 3:33 pm

The_Honourable wrote:
Habit7 wrote:
The_Honourable wrote:
Habit7 wrote:
The_Honourable wrote:Now PNM is not going to pull that elimination trigger because they want afros dumbed down and beholden to the party.

What is this elimination trigger?

Afros are only 34% of the population but PNM wins 50% of the vote. Since PNM is buoyed by these “dumb” Afros who are the perpetrators of crime that magically turn that 34 into 50%. What is this elimination trigger that PNM doesn’t want to pull because it will harm them?

It is easy to talk about these things as if they are unicorns and fairies. But what is this one action that doesn’t violate the constitution and doesn’t open up the govt to legal damages, that can solve crime in the country?


So you read my whole post, and choose one sentence with pnm in it :?

Where in my statement I talking about voting? Yuh conveniently skip the part where i said the big fishes finance both parties ent?

Go back and read, the elimination trigger is to use draconian measures to deal with ALL involved in the drug, gun and human trafficking trade. From the afro foot soldiers on the ground to the rich indo, chinee and syrian/lebanese who import and finance the trade. But as shakes say, nobody have the balls to do that.

But here nah...

alfa ask you a question earlier and you not answering. What can be done to prevent home invasions? and I will ask, what can be done about the drugs, guns, and human trafficking taking place in this country? cause so far Erla praying and PNM failing.

You think you answered what is the elimination trigger but you didn’t.

It is easy to say get rid of soldiers and the financiers (unlike I won’t use racial stereotypes of them because you will be quite surprised of the reality). But we are still a country governed by laws. The govt got resistance passing antigang laws and only could pass a watered down version. Restricting bail was challenged by UNC proxies. Interception of Communications bill was watered down too. Nearly every crime bill was watered down or not supported because “Rowley would be a dictator.” We can’t execute murderers while PC is the final court but you don’t support CCJ because PNM will influence them. Financiers supporting crime but a UNC MP say “snitches get stitches” so we can’t get Whistleblower legislation

So if you believe crime can be eliminated by easily pulling a trigger, but that trigger is same draconian measures that govt has no support or legal authority to do, then you are just being simplistic.

What I am doing is make you all hear yourself because you all believe T&T’s crime problem is simple and all we need is some messiah in govt or TTPS to just lock up everybody. I am saying it is a lot more complicated than you all making it out to be. I am not going to make the same mistake as you all as say all we need to do is press this one button and crime is done. That is allyuh folly.

I can easily plan with my boys to invade some vulnerable person, and if we are smart enough to not leave any clues, TTPS cannot predict my actions nor would they be able to detect my actions.

Crime prevention is the responsibility for every Trinibagonian. But according to some here, it is problem only for Afro Trinis who are somehow both heavily involved in crime and are ardent supporters of the PNM. So ardent that they are a demographic PNM doesn’t want to hurt. As if UNC didn’t want to hurt their pedophile demographic by rejecting changing the child marriage age.


Aye... I didn't ask you what is pnm plan which is blaming the opposition when bills don't pass. I didn't ask you about child marriage.

I told you plain what is needed to be done, draconian as it is. If you don't like it, let me hear YOUR solution.

I want to hear YOU...

YOU

YOU

YOU

What is YOUR solution on preventing home invasions? What is YOUR solution in dealing with drugs, guns, and human trafficking taking place in this country?
He won't answer you.

Hes a coward *hit and full of spin.

Says he produces facts which is mis truths

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Re: Race and Crime

Postby pugboy » May 20th, 2024, 3:43 pm

zoom, you are absolutely correct
and when faced with video evidence he refuses to watch and acknowledge it
instead try to shoot the messenger instead

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Re: Race and Crime

Postby alfa » May 20th, 2024, 3:58 pm

Since yesterday I bracing him on his crime plan and no response. Today he claimed the FUL policies as to who can get an FUL remains unchanged yet he cannot quote said policies when challenged to but resorts to throwing the whole firearms act at me.
Tell me you never read the act without telling me you never read the act

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Re: Race and Crime

Postby mero » May 20th, 2024, 4:11 pm

The_Honourable wrote:
j.o.e wrote:
mero wrote:How does the UNC win?


They don’t …. Especially under KPB


Was about to say...

mero you self...
Eh eh, UNC winning according to 2nr polls eh.

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Re: Race and Crime

Postby Habit7 » May 20th, 2024, 6:16 pm

The_Honourable wrote:
Habit7 wrote:
The_Honourable wrote:
Habit7 wrote:
The_Honourable wrote:Now PNM is not going to pull that elimination trigger because they want afros dumbed down and beholden to the party.

What is this elimination trigger?

Afros are only 34% of the population but PNM wins 50% of the vote. Since PNM is buoyed by these “dumb” Afros who are the perpetrators of crime that magically turn that 34 into 50%. What is this elimination trigger that PNM doesn’t want to pull because it will harm them?

It is easy to talk about these things as if they are unicorns and fairies. But what is this one action that doesn’t violate the constitution and doesn’t open up the govt to legal damages, that can solve crime in the country?


So you read my whole post, and choose one sentence with pnm in it :?

Where in my statement I talking about voting? Yuh conveniently skip the part where i said the big fishes finance both parties ent?

Go back and read, the elimination trigger is to use draconian measures to deal with ALL involved in the drug, gun and human trafficking trade. From the afro foot soldiers on the ground to the rich indo, chinee and syrian/lebanese who import and finance the trade. But as shakes say, nobody have the balls to do that.

But here nah...

alfa ask you a question earlier and you not answering. What can be done to prevent home invasions? and I will ask, what can be done about the drugs, guns, and human trafficking taking place in this country? cause so far Erla praying and PNM failing.

You think you answered what is the elimination trigger but you didn’t.

It is easy to say get rid of soldiers and the financiers (unlike I won’t use racial stereotypes of them because you will be quite surprised of the reality). But we are still a country governed by laws. The govt got resistance passing antigang laws and only could pass a watered down version. Restricting bail was challenged by UNC proxies. Interception of Communications bill was watered down too. Nearly every crime bill was watered down or not supported because “Rowley would be a dictator.” We can’t execute murderers while PC is the final court but you don’t support CCJ because PNM will influence them. Financiers supporting crime but a UNC MP say “snitches get stitches” so we can’t get Whistleblower legislation

So if you believe crime can be eliminated by easily pulling a trigger, but that trigger is same draconian measures that govt has no support or legal authority to do, then you are just being simplistic.

What I am doing is make you all hear yourself because you all believe T&T’s crime problem is simple and all we need is some messiah in govt or TTPS to just lock up everybody. I am saying it is a lot more complicated than you all making it out to be. I am not going to make the same mistake as you all as say all we need to do is press this one button and crime is done. That is allyuh folly.

I can easily plan with my boys to invade some vulnerable person, and if we are smart enough to not leave any clues, TTPS cannot predict my actions nor would they be able to detect my actions.

Crime prevention is the responsibility for every Trinibagonian. But according to some here, it is problem only for Afro Trinis who are somehow both heavily involved in crime and are ardent supporters of the PNM. So ardent that they are a demographic PNM doesn’t want to hurt. As if UNC didn’t want to hurt their pedophile demographic by rejecting changing the child marriage age.


Aye... I didn't ask you what is pnm plan which is blaming the opposition when bills don't pass. I didn't ask you about child marriage.

I told you plain what is needed to be done, draconian as it is. If you don't like it, let me hear YOUR solution.

I want to hear YOU...

YOU

YOU

YOU

What is YOUR solution on preventing home invasions? What is YOUR solution in dealing with drugs, guns, and human trafficking taking place in this country?

So you want to take draconian action while not acknowledging that the draconian action can only be taken with laws that don't receive the constitutional majority in the Parliament?

It seems like allyuh don't want to admit reality so I will tell you bold. The political action on crime you want to happen is being hindered by the political party you support

Death penalty
Crackdown on gangs
No bail for murder accused
No bail for illegal firearms users
Tracking of financial crimes
Whistleblower protection against govt officials
Cleaning up illegal casinos
Tapping of the criminally accused phones

All this legislation was either being watered down, challenged in court or not supported in parliament by the UNC.

So keep claiming that PNM don't want to implement draconian measures to stop crime. And keep crying PNM only blaming the Opposition.

The issue is whether what is being said is true. So keep demanding draconian measures while supporting the party that is fighting against them.

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Re: Race and Crime

Postby Habit7 » May 20th, 2024, 6:20 pm

My point in initially making the thought experiment was for you all to voice what you think should be done. It is easy to criticise the govt, but if you have no standard on what is right, your criticism is arbitrary. If the govt is failing to do something, then what is it that you think they should do. And the result of the thought experiment was racism, human rights violations, extra-judicial killings, illegal search and seizure and basically every other problem that would make a lawyer smile and enrich the same suspects you want to persecute.

The point I was making was that it is not simple and it is not easy. We are not El Salvador, we have a robust constitution, human rights and the highest Judicial Court is in the UK. We cannot lock up 1% of our population without due process. The SoE taught us that anything close to that is million-dollar payouts to hotspot residents. Our problem didn’t start in 1-2 years, and it cannot end there.

Crime in T&T can be stymied in 2 ways, preventative and prosecutorial. The preventative way is not primarily political, it is social. Hence crime is not just a “hotspot” concern but all of T&T's concerns. It starts in the home with morals and the values instilled in the family. Values of honesty, fidelity, denouncing envy but being satisfied with your station while working hard to achieve more. I can say so much more about this, but this is fundamental. Without this, you will get broken homes, or ppl who express their criminality in banditry, corruption or murder, it is the same criminality irrespective of socio-economic standing.

A society of high morals makes criminals stand out. The more citizens that obey the law, that drive cars without illegal modifications, adhere to the speed limit, don’t break lights, don’t tint their windscreen and many other things, makes it easier when real criminals are driving without being able to identify who is in the car or if they are speeding to or from a crime.

T&T citizens needs to fix itself first. We cannot think that petty crime is permissible but only big crime is actionable. Criminals hide big crime within the sea of petty crime. T&T crime is undergirded by citizens’ corruption and flouting of the law that eventually escalate to big crime.

As that was preventative, the next area is prosecutorial and that is sometimes political. I believe a functional, just and consistent death penalty reduces murder. The Panday admin benefited from lowering murders because they pursued and performed the death penalty consistently. We cannot perform the death penalty with the PC as our final court. Be it CCJ or something else, we need a change and that is only with a constitutional majority.

We need to increase the efficiency of the criminal courts. This has been ongoing with the elimination of the preliminary inquiry and judge only trials and other things. But as the Judiciary and DPP are independent of the govt, there is no incentive for them to improve. We can think of electing them like the US does and to have ppl campaign as the best person for the job. The fear is that the job can get political, but the status quo is not working.

I agreed with Gary Griffith that implementing a Broken Windows policy like what Juliani did in NYC can seriously curb crime. However, he never really did it when he was CoP. But in essence, it is the police strictly enforcing every law big and small. It also involves the govt enforcing things like breaking down squatters on govt land, legal vending, and approved renovations to one’s home. Making T&T a culture of law-abiding citizens. We cannot just reject murder but think every other crime is ok.

I can go on but this is getting lengthy as I initially said, the problem is not simple, it involves every citizen and it is not just political.

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Re: Race and Crime

Postby wing » May 20th, 2024, 6:40 pm

That's really nice and all. But you really wasting your time and efforts trying to talk sense especially in here. All you are going to get is insults and kamlaspeak.

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Re: Race and Crime

Postby zoom rader » May 20th, 2024, 6:57 pm

Habit7 wrote:
The_Honourable wrote:
Habit7 wrote:
The_Honourable wrote:
Habit7 wrote:
The_Honourable wrote:Now PNM is not going to pull that elimination trigger because they want afros dumbed down and beholden to the party.

What is this elimination trigger?

Afros are only 34% of the population but PNM wins 50% of the vote. Since PNM is buoyed by these “dumb” Afros who are the perpetrators of crime that magically turn that 34 into 50%. What is this elimination trigger that PNM doesn’t want to pull because it will harm them?

It is easy to talk about these things as if they are unicorns and fairies. But what is this one action that doesn’t violate the constitution and doesn’t open up the govt to legal damages, that can solve crime in the country?


So you read my whole post, and choose one sentence with pnm in it :?

Where in my statement I talking about voting? Yuh conveniently skip the part where i said the big fishes finance both parties ent?

Go back and read, the elimination trigger is to use draconian measures to deal with ALL involved in the drug, gun and human trafficking trade. From the afro foot soldiers on the ground to the rich indo, chinee and syrian/lebanese who import and finance the trade. But as shakes say, nobody have the balls to do that.

But here nah...

alfa ask you a question earlier and you not answering. What can be done to prevent home invasions? and I will ask, what can be done about the drugs, guns, and human trafficking taking place in this country? cause so far Erla praying and PNM failing.

You think you answered what is the elimination trigger but you didn’t.

It is easy to say get rid of soldiers and the financiers (unlike I won’t use racial stereotypes of them because you will be quite surprised of the reality). But we are still a country governed by laws. The govt got resistance passing antigang laws and only could pass a watered down version. Restricting bail was challenged by UNC proxies. Interception of Communications bill was watered down too. Nearly every crime bill was watered down or not supported because “Rowley would be a dictator.” We can’t execute murderers while PC is the final court but you don’t support CCJ because PNM will influence them. Financiers supporting crime but a UNC MP say “snitches get stitches” so we can’t get Whistleblower legislation

So if you believe crime can be eliminated by easily pulling a trigger, but that trigger is same draconian measures that govt has no support or legal authority to do, then you are just being simplistic.

What I am doing is make you all hear yourself because you all believe T&T’s crime problem is simple and all we need is some messiah in govt or TTPS to just lock up everybody. I am saying it is a lot more complicated than you all making it out to be. I am not going to make the same mistake as you all as say all we need to do is press this one button and crime is done. That is allyuh folly.

I can easily plan with my boys to invade some vulnerable person, and if we are smart enough to not leave any clues, TTPS cannot predict my actions nor would they be able to detect my actions.

Crime prevention is the responsibility for every Trinibagonian. But according to some here, it is problem only for Afro Trinis who are somehow both heavily involved in crime and are ardent supporters of the PNM. So ardent that they are a demographic PNM doesn’t want to hurt. As if UNC didn’t want to hurt their pedophile demographic by rejecting changing the child marriage age.


Aye... I didn't ask you what is pnm plan which is blaming the opposition when bills don't pass. I didn't ask you about child marriage.

I told you plain what is needed to be done, draconian as it is. If you don't like it, let me hear YOUR solution.

I want to hear YOU...

YOU

YOU

YOU

What is YOUR solution on preventing home invasions? What is YOUR solution in dealing with drugs, guns, and human trafficking taking place in this country?

So you want to take draconian action while not acknowledging that the draconian action can only be taken with laws that don't receive the constitutional majority in the Parliament?

It seems like allyuh don't want to admit reality so I will tell you bold. The political action on crime you want to happen is being hindered by the political party you support

Death penalty
Crackdown on gangs
No bail for murder accused
No bail for illegal firearms users
Tracking of financial crimes
Whistleblower protection against govt officials
Cleaning up illegal casinos
Tapping of the criminally accused phones

All this legislation was either being watered down, challenged in court or not supported in parliament by the UNC.

So keep claiming that PNM don't want to implement draconian measures to stop crime. And keep crying PNM only blaming the Opposition.

The issue is whether what is being said is true. So keep demanding draconian measures while supporting the party that is fighting against them.
Unc is opposition, and that's their job.

Deal with it and stop making excuses because PNM can't put their points across

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Re: Race and Crime

Postby zoom rader » May 20th, 2024, 6:59 pm

Habit7 wrote:My point in initially making the thought experiment was for you all to voice what you think should be done. It is easy to criticise the govt, but if you have no standard on what is right, your criticism is arbitrary. If the govt is failing to do something, then what is it that you think they should do. And the result of the thought experiment was racism, human rights violations, extra-judicial killings, illegal search and seizure and basically every other problem that would make a lawyer smile and enrich the same suspects you want to persecute.

The point I was making was that it is not simple and it is not easy. We are not El Salvador, we have a robust constitution, human rights and the highest Judicial Court is in the UK. We cannot lock up 1% of our population without due process. The SoE taught us that anything close to that is million-dollar payouts to hotspot residents. Our problem didn’t start in 1-2 years, and it cannot end there.

Crime in T&T can be stymied in 2 ways, preventative and prosecutorial. The preventative way is not primarily political, it is social. Hence crime is not just a “hotspot” concern but all of T&T's concerns. It starts in the home with morals and the values instilled in the family. Values of honesty, fidelity, denouncing envy but being satisfied with your station while working hard to achieve more. I can say so much more about this, but this is fundamental. Without this, you will get broken homes, or ppl who express their criminality in banditry, corruption or murder, it is the same criminality irrespective of socio-economic standing.

A society of high morals makes criminals stand out. The more citizens that obey the law, that drive cars without illegal modifications, adhere to the speed limit, don’t break lights, don’t tint their windscreen and many other things, makes it easier when real criminals are driving without being able to identify who is in the car or if they are speeding to or from a crime.

T&T citizens needs to fix itself first. We cannot think that petty crime is permissible but only big crime is actionable. Criminals hide big crime within the sea of petty crime. T&T crime is undergirded by citizens’ corruption and flouting of the law that eventually escalate to big crime.

As that was preventative, the next area is prosecutorial and that is sometimes political. I believe a functional, just and consistent death penalty reduces murder. The Panday admin benefited from lowering murders because they pursued and performed the death penalty consistently. We cannot perform the death penalty with the PC as our final court. Be it CCJ or something else, we need a change and that is only with a constitutional majority.

We need to increase the efficiency of the criminal courts. This has been ongoing with the elimination of the preliminary inquiry and judge only trials and other things. But as the Judiciary and DPP are independent of the govt, there is no incentive for them to improve. We can think of electing them like the US does and to have ppl campaign as the best person for the job. The fear is that the job can get political, but the status quo is not working.

I agreed with Gary Griffith that implementing a Broken Windows policy like what Juliani did in NYC can seriously curb crime. However, he never really did it when he was CoP. But in essence, it is the police strictly enforcing every law big and small. It also involves the govt enforcing things like breaking down squatters on govt land, legal vending, and approved renovations to one’s home. Making T&T a culture of law-abiding citizens. We cannot just reject murder but think every other crime is ok.

I can go on but this is getting lengthy as I initially said, the problem is not simple, it involves every citizen and it is not just political.
Yeah we not El Salvador and we not even Trinidad but a PNM cont Tree , only excuses and its Kamala fault

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Re: Race and Crime

Postby redmanjp » May 20th, 2024, 8:01 pm

another SOE can bring things back under control but jus do it different from the 2011 SOE- dont just arbitrarily detain ppl. but perhaps take every person's fingerprint once they living in a hotspot area and compare with crime scene data- this info can be erased in 1-2 years once there are no matches to any crime scene. charge those whose prints match. raid every suspect or gang member house in those areas or where they living during curfew hours 9pm-4am for guns, drugs, etc.
after the SOE eliminate the ability to make license plates except for a few licensed places which would use special identifiers on the plate plus rfid- this should easily distinguish genuine from fake plates even from a distance.

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Re: Race and Crime

Postby CB Style » May 21st, 2024, 12:13 am

Habit7 wrote:My point in initially making the thought experiment was for you all to voice what you think should be done. It is easy to criticise the govt, but if you have no standard on what is right, your criticism is arbitrary. If the govt is failing to do something, then what is it that you think they should do. And the result of the thought experiment was racism, human rights violations, extra-judicial killings, illegal search and seizure and basically every other problem that would make a lawyer smile and enrich the same suspects you want to persecute.

The point I was making was that it is not simple and it is not easy. We are not El Salvador, we have a robust constitution, human rights and the highest Judicial Court is in the UK. We cannot lock up 1% of our population without due process. The SoE taught us that anything close to that is million-dollar payouts to hotspot residents. Our problem didn’t start in 1-2 years, and it cannot end there.

Crime in T&T can be stymied in 2 ways, preventative and prosecutorial. The preventative way is not primarily political, it is social. Hence crime is not just a “hotspot” concern but all of T&T's concerns. It starts in the home with morals and the values instilled in the family. Values of honesty, fidelity, denouncing envy but being satisfied with your station while working hard to achieve more. I can say so much more about this, but this is fundamental. Without this, you will get broken homes, or ppl who express their criminality in banditry, corruption or murder, it is the same criminality irrespective of socio-economic standing.

A society of high morals makes criminals stand out. The more citizens that obey the law, that drive cars without illegal modifications, adhere to the speed limit, don’t break lights, don’t tint their windscreen and many other things, makes it easier when real criminals are driving without being able to identify who is in the car or if they are speeding to or from a crime.

T&T citizens needs to fix itself first. We cannot think that petty crime is permissible but only big crime is actionable. Criminals hide big crime within the sea of petty crime. T&T crime is undergirded by citizens’ corruption and flouting of the law that eventually escalate to big crime.

As that was preventative, the next area is prosecutorial and that is sometimes political. I believe a functional, just and consistent death penalty reduces murder. The Panday admin benefited from lowering murders because they pursued and performed the death penalty consistently. We cannot perform the death penalty with the PC as our final court. Be it CCJ or something else, we need a change and that is only with a constitutional majority.

We need to increase the efficiency of the criminal courts. This has been ongoing with the elimination of the preliminary inquiry and judge only trials and other things. But as the Judiciary and DPP are independent of the govt, there is no incentive for them to improve. We can think of electing them like the US does and to have ppl campaign as the best person for the job. The fear is that the job can get political, but the status quo is not working.

I agreed with Gary Griffith that implementing a Broken Windows policy like what Juliani did in NYC can seriously curb crime. However, he never really did it when he was CoP. But in essence, it is the police strictly enforcing every law big and small. It also involves the govt enforcing things like breaking down squatters on govt land, legal vending, and approved renovations to one’s home. Making T&T a culture of law-abiding citizens. We cannot just reject murder but think every other crime is ok.

I can go on but this is getting lengthy as I initially said, the problem is not simple, it involves every citizen and it is not just political.


All that jibrish just to prove again you are a PNM sheep. You can only fool the PNM fan boys here with that rubbish. Crime out of control in this country but your so called solutions has no mention about what the Minister of NAT Sec or the CoP can do differently. Nothing about our police force? Maybe a lil shout out to the army? It's always what the citizens and society as a whole should do. Is almost as if allyuh PNM sheeps really believe Ethelbert when he say that is not his job. Come nah man hoodrat7, little wingy and Meri counting on you and that is what you come with?

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Re: Race and Crime

Postby daring dragoon » May 21st, 2024, 2:55 am

all this nonsense when the facts are in your face. most crimes are commited by blacks so time to start a "no black no crime" movement. similar to "black lives matter". gps all black men and crime done.

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Re: Race and Crime

Postby screwbash » May 21st, 2024, 3:44 am

daring dragoon wrote:all this nonsense when the facts are in your face. most crimes are commited by blacks so time to start a "no black no crime" movement. similar to "black lives matter". gps all black men and crime done.


so what about the black women? some stories reported is that black women are helping the black men in luring women into taxis for assault and robberies. who will get that GPS contract? Amalgamated ??? G4 ??? MTS ????

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Re: Race and Crime

Postby killercow » May 21st, 2024, 3:57 am

redmanjp wrote:another SOE can bring things back under control but jus do it different from the 2011 SOE- dont just arbitrarily detain ppl. but perhaps take every person's fingerprint once they living in a hotspot area and compare with crime scene data- this info can be erased in 1-2 years once there are no matches to any crime scene. charge those whose prints match. raid every suspect or gang member house in those areas or where they living during curfew hours 9pm-4am for guns, drugs, etc.
after the SOE eliminate the ability to make license plates except for a few licensed places which would use special identifiers on the plate plus rfid- this should easily distinguish genuine from fake plates even from a distance.
I find fingerprint taking should be compulsory for anyone applying for a national ID card / passport / drivers permit.

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Re: Race and Crime

Postby Habit7 » May 21st, 2024, 6:52 am

wing wrote:That's really nice and all. But you really wasting your time and efforts trying to talk sense especially in here. All you are going to get is insults and kamlaspeak.

I do it to demonstrate how vacuous the alternative is for the impartial onlooker who might not say a word.

redmanjp wrote:another SOE can bring things back under control but jus do it different from the 2011 SOE- dont just arbitrarily detain ppl. but perhaps take every person's fingerprint once they living in a hotspot area and compare with crime scene data- this info can be erased in 1-2 years once there are no matches to any crime scene. charge those whose prints match. raid every suspect or gang member house in those areas or where they living during curfew hours 9pm-4am for guns, drugs, etc.
after the SOE eliminate the ability to make license plates except for a few licensed places which would use special identifiers on the plate plus rfid- this should easily distinguish genuine from fake plates even from a distance.
You cannot demand ppl’s fingerprint or search their house without ‘probable cause.’ Also as I demonstrated earlier on with a random google search of recent home invasion suspects, they resided in various locations few of which were traditional hotspots. There are no hotspots in TT, everywhere is a hotspot.

CB Style wrote:Crime out of control in this country but your so called solutions has no mention about what the Minister of NAT Sec or the CoP can do differently. Nothing about our police force?
You are functionally illiterate. Please reread what I said. And if you are still perplexed press Ctrl+F and search for “CoP” and realise for yourself how your dyslexia is getting the better of you.

daring dragoon wrote:all this nonsense when the facts are in your face. most crimes are commited by blacks so time to start a "no black no crime" movement. similar to "black lives matter". gps all black men and crime done.
Great idea. I am sure all the Afro politicians including the PM will vote this as law. And the Afro dominated police will enforce it. And all our Afro dominated neighbours will feel a sense of pride trading with a nation like us who implement a policy like this. And Afro tourists will feel so special coming to a country like ours with such a focus on them.

BTW most ppl in this country are Black, I think you mean Afro descendants? And how Afro do you have to be? Douglas and other mixed ethnicities will included in this dragnet?

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Re: Race and Crime

Postby zoom rader » May 21st, 2024, 7:29 am

Habit7 wrote:
wing wrote:That's really nice and all. But you really wasting your time and efforts trying to talk sense especially in here. All you are going to get is insults and kamlaspeak.

I do it to demonstrate how vacuous the alternative is for the impartial onlooker who might not say a word.

redmanjp wrote:another SOE can bring things back under control but jus do it different from the 2011 SOE- dont just arbitrarily detain ppl. but perhaps take every person's fingerprint once they living in a hotspot area and compare with crime scene data- this info can be erased in 1-2 years once there are no matches to any crime scene. charge those whose prints match. raid every suspect or gang member house in those areas or where they living during curfew hours 9pm-4am for guns, drugs, etc.
after the SOE eliminate the ability to make license plates except for a few licensed places which would use special identifiers on the plate plus rfid- this should easily distinguish genuine from fake plates even from a distance.
You cannot demand ppl’s fingerprint or search their house without ‘probable cause.’ Also as I demonstrated earlier on with a random google search of recent home invasion suspects, they resided in various locations few of which were traditional hotspots. There are no hotspots in TT, everywhere is a hotspot.

CB Style wrote:Crime out of control in this country but your so called solutions has no mention about what the Minister of NAT Sec or the CoP can do differently. Nothing about our police force?
You are functionally illiterate. Please reread what I said. And if you are still perplexed press Ctrl+F and search for “CoP” and realise for yourself how your dyslexia is getting the better of you.

daring dragoon wrote:all this nonsense when the facts are in your face. most crimes are commited by blacks so time to start a "no black no crime" movement. similar to "black lives matter". gps all black men and crime done.
Great idea. I am sure all the Afro politicians including the PM will vote this as law. And the Afro dominated police will enforce it. And all our Afro dominated neighbours will feel a sense of pride trading with a nation like us who implement a policy like this. And Afro tourists will feel so special coming to a country like ours with such a focus on them.

BTW most ppl in this country are Black, I think you mean Afro descendants? And how Afro do you have to be? Douglas and other mixed ethnicities will included in this dragnet?
U such a kant that u smell like one

"There are no hotspots in TT, everywhere is a hotspot." PNM created this

Hmm when last a home invasion up in Good wood Park?

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Re: Race and Crime

Postby zoom rader » May 21st, 2024, 7:39 am

Race & Crime

Another pest .

People lick his arse and he's no different than the maloney bandits
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Re: Race and Crime

Postby alfa » May 21st, 2024, 8:02 am

Habit I read your response and have two issues with it. The first suggestion you offered requires a cultural change which may take generations to happen if at all. The third world always has some kind of relaxed attitude to following minor rules which is impossible to break

The second part while correct in asserting that all infarctions of the law should be dealt with, the present system cannot even treat with the major crimes due to incompetence and lack of resources much less lesser crimes like squatters and illegal vending. Even if they were, I fear the population would see at as an attack on law abiding citizen, read my first point. Thus leading to more crime.

Either way both solutions you offered are very much long term, we needed help as of yesterday. If not as drastic as some including myself had suggested then at least a professional hit squad like the flying squad of old to eliminate pests in the short term. We could work on citizens not littering and tinting windows after we get the streets back under control.

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Re: Race and Crime

Postby zoom rader » May 21st, 2024, 8:25 am

alfa wrote:Habit I read your response and have two issues with it. The first suggestion you offered requires a cultural change which may take generations to happen if at all. The third world always has some kind of relaxed attitude to following minor rules which is impossible to break

The second part while correct in asserting that all infarctions of the law should be dealt with, the present system cannot even treat with the major crimes due to incompetence and lack of resources much less lesser crimes like squatters and illegal vending. Even if they were, I fear the population would see at as an attack on law abiding citizen, read my first point. Thus leading to more crime.

Either way both solutions you offered are very much long term, we needed help as of yesterday. If not as drastic as some including myself had suggested then at least a professional hit squad like the flying squad of old to eliminate pests in the short term. We could work on citizens not littering and tinting windows after we get the streets back under control.
Bro, the only way is drastic measures

Deal with pest one on one, SOE by all means necessary.

The criminals knows the state is weak and they exploit it.

The PNM are afraid of SOE since elections is around the corner and most criminals families vote PNM.

Habit knows very well PNM is supported by criminals and their family

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Re: Race and Crime

Postby Habit7 » May 21st, 2024, 8:28 am

alfa wrote:Habit I read your response and have two issues with it. The first suggestion you offered requires a cultural change which may take generations to happen if at all. The third world always has some kind of relaxed attitude to following minor rules which is impossible to break

The second part while correct in asserting that all infarctions of the law should be dealt with, the present system cannot even treat with the major crimes due to incompetence and lack of resources much less lesser crimes like squatters and illegal vending. Even if they were, I fear the population would see at as an attack on law abiding citizen, read my first point. Thus leading to more crime.

Either way both solutions you offered are very much long term, we needed help as of yesterday. If not as drastic as some including myself had suggested then at least a professional hit squad like the flying squad of old to eliminate pests in the short term. We could work on citizens not littering and tinting windows after we get the streets back under control.

Well we have several 3rd world countries near to us that follow minor rules and are low crime.

My suggestion included judicial reform which would make the judicial process more efficient and deal with both major and minor crimes.

Our problems didn’t start in 1-2 yrs it will not end in 1-2 yrs. Extra judicial killings will only make the police into an addition gang which would start killing hornermen, their woman husband, men who owe them money, men who they owe money, and take the same contract killing as gun men. It doesn’t work.

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Re: Race and Crime

Postby zoom rader » May 21st, 2024, 8:36 am

Habit7 wrote:
alfa wrote:Habit I read your response and have two issues with it. The first suggestion you offered requires a cultural change which may take generations to happen if at all. The third world always has some kind of relaxed attitude to following minor rules which is impossible to break

The second part while correct in asserting that all infarctions of the law should be dealt with, the present system cannot even treat with the major crimes due to incompetence and lack of resources much less lesser crimes like squatters and illegal vending. Even if they were, I fear the population would see at as an attack on law abiding citizen, read my first point. Thus leading to more crime.

Either way both solutions you offered are very much long term, we needed help as of yesterday. If not as drastic as some including myself had suggested then at least a professional hit squad like the flying squad of old to eliminate pests in the short term. We could work on citizens not littering and tinting windows after we get the streets back under control.

Well we have several 3rd world countries near to us that follow minor rules and are low crime.

My suggestion included judicial reform which would make the judicial process more efficient and deal with both major and minor crimes.

Our problems didn’t start in 1-2 yrs it will not end in 1-2 yrs. Extra judicial killings will only make the police into an addition gang which would start killing hornermen, their woman husband, men who owe them money, men who they owe money, and take the same contract killing as gun men. It doesn’t work.
Trinidad is not classed as a 3rd world country

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Re: Race and Crime

Postby mero » May 21st, 2024, 8:46 am

So who gonna be the new appointees after we kill out the gangs cartel style? Cuz the drugs and guns ARE coming and money HAS to be made.

Or allyuh really feel daz it? Kill out ninjas from the hills and daz it? Organized crime done? Narco trade done? Gun trade done? Human trafficking done?

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Re: Race and Crime

Postby zoom rader » May 21st, 2024, 8:58 am

mero wrote:So who gonna be the new appointees after we kill out the gangs cartel style? Cuz the drugs and guns ARE coming and money HAS to be made.

Or allyuh really feel daz it? Kill out ninjas from the hills and daz it? Organized crime done? Narco trade done? Gun trade done? Human trafficking done?
Bro the moment the PNM gangs started killing out injuns, decent trinis & and home invasions that was crossed the line.

Its OK for ninjas to Kill out other ninjas as decent folk don't care. Its gone to far now.

We know u support these criminals as they are the reason why PNM gets votes

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Re: Race and Crime

Postby alfa » May 21st, 2024, 9:02 am

mero wrote:So who gonna be the new appointees after we kill out the gangs cartel style? Cuz the drugs and guns ARE coming and money HAS to be made.

Or allyuh really feel daz it? Kill out ninjas from the hills and daz it? Organized crime done? Narco trade done? Gun trade done? Human trafficking done?

Legalize drugs and hoes. With one caveat, everybody have enough knowledge about the dangers of drugs so if you get hook you're on your own. So far it working for marijuana and only the people who you'd figure to be weed heads are actually becoming weed heads and not the productive members of society so it might work.

Give law abiding citizen guns like kamla said so they could even the playing field

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Re: Race and Crime

Postby mero » May 21st, 2024, 9:11 am

zoom rader wrote:
mero wrote:So who gonna be the new appointees after we kill out the gangs cartel style? Cuz the drugs and guns ARE coming and money HAS to be made.

Or allyuh really feel daz it? Kill out ninjas from the hills and daz it? Organized crime done? Narco trade done? Gun trade done? Human trafficking done?
Bro the moment the PNM gangs started killing out injuns, decent trinis & and home invasions that was crossed the line.

Its OK for ninjas to Kill out other ninjas as decent folk don't care. Its gone to far now.

We know u support these criminals as they are the reason why PNM gets votes


Allyuh does be in character so long I can't take nothing you say seriously cuz nothing you say is serious. You hadda be in your 50's by now.For a bunch of apparent educated ppl on tuner, allyuh does sound flat out dunch. Ahh the joys of anonymity.

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