National Strike updates/ watch/ News

[SR]

he only way to please the union and for petrotrin to be able to afford to pay the 75% increase would be to remove the gas subsidy.....................

when last has petrotrin turned profit 3 years in a row




lemme hear allyuh now nah

[hydroep]

These people need a reality check. Drop their arse off in Greece for a two weeks.

[wing]

Bareback , you seem to have been mislead about who the taxpayers really are . The fact is Petrotrin contributes approx. $10 billion in petroleum and other taxes each year to the treasury. Recall that the last budget projected revenue approx $45 billion. This is because they actually sell products which generate revenue , unlike the public service which doesn't generate any GDP .So the real taxpayers are the Petrotrin workers who really and truly are minding the rest of the country .That being said , let us hope good sense does prevail.

everyone know the company drowning in debt and loans that they have to pay off, so obviously they cant suffice any sort of lavish pay increase. so why call a strike, what is the expected benefit?

btw, im sure most of the employees not willing to chance their salaries for any strike period, man have mortgage, car installment an chirren tuh mine dann.

if the company in so much debt...how come it have 2 million to give to pan and not the workers ...who are owed that money.....profit sharing is a LEGALLY binding agreement...that the company does not honor...when the company,for eg,makes 2 billion in profit...10% of anything after that is supposed to go to the workers...10%!!!!! the company still gets the other 90%...nxtreme bawling the company in debt...how come it have money to give everybody else but where it supposed to go....whether you believe (in all your ignorance) why the workers shouldnt get this or that, at the end of the day it is a legally binding document....management will gladly go to court,even though they will lose....the matter will take 5 to 7 years to come to a conclusion(and the company can invest and make money off of that money owed)...by that time people dead,fired,change jobs etc....a strike will produce immediate response...cause if they owed the workers half a mill. , when the the plants shut down,it will cost petrotrin 5 times as much,daily....

I think you may have taken the comments out of context. The union is attempting to hold the country at ransom in an attempt to squeeze more money out of the company which is in essence the state and the tax payers. If there is an agreement to pay an additional amount if the company is profitable in any given year then you are correct, that is a legally binding agreement and should be paid.

Now if on the basis of one year of profitability the union sees that as the basis of requesting further increases in compensation going forward while ignoring the previous years of losses and the current debt levels of the company which are being backed by the state and the taxpayers, then this is the essence of the comments being made.

The comments are being driven by the union's continuous demands while the company is sinking further and further at the expense of the country and the taxpayers. Now if the unions negotiated for a cap on spending or management bonuses, or for a restructuring of the management roles and the number of managers and their compensation, or for certain efficiency levels to be met before additional compensation kicks in then you may see comments of a different nature as this would signal an interest in seeing the company viable and profitable. As it stands, Petrotrin Bonds are just barely above investment grade and that is due SOLELY to the positive credit rating of the country. If the company did not have the backing of Trinidad & Tobago it would be classified as Junk Bonds and no one wojuld buy their bonds.

It is the issue of profitability and viability that is of grave concern. We already spent too many millions back in the 80's buying a useless refinery from Texaco simply because we could not afford not to have a refinery and not have our citizens employed, it simply did not make economic sense. We have already spent billions behind the company to keep it running and to modernize certain plants and to make the company competitive. Not to mention the longterm liabilities on the company's books for loans, bonds, pensions, medical, GTL, etc................

So if it is that the union is negotiating an amount above 5%, and we are not seeing a corresponding improvement in the financial position of the company nor are we seeing an equal improvement in the efficiency and productivity of the company, then seeing that it is our tax dollars at work and our country's oil being sold, give us the Non-OWTU/ Non-Petrotrin workers of T&T the same increase. That way we all benefit from the royalties of our country's resources and if Petrotrin fails then none of us can point fingers because we all had a hand in allowing it to fail.

[Bareback]

Wing: I agree they are the largest fiscal revenue contributor but i have to add, that they are a state company and thus hold the same level of responsibility as other state companies, they are producing from state resources, and they could easily contribute more to the treasury by managing costs and being more efficient/ productive.

All the comments about 'not doing work that isn't yours' that have been posted going on more that 20 years now! I agree with the safety ting, but when you cyar do your job because de man you waiting on gone for ah 2 hour lunch or he drunk an you have tuh suck beans till 4, that is absolute nonsense. And the union endorses this - I have seen this first hand.

[Allergic2BunnyEars]

these rates are actually the lower end of the brackets and not like the poster above....i have a copy of the union rates somewhere around the office...

a clerk get around $52.50 per hr....

foreman 1 $85.22
foreman 3 $105.66


remember these workers also get COLA..


having worked in the environment, if you ask someone for some assistance ( for argument sake, hold a measuring tape ) and it's not in their job description, he going and tell you I AM NOT DOING THAT.......

Those rates are bogus. Engineers do not make that sort of money off the bat. The article doesn't state what grade the engineer is at to make that 20k salary nor how long it took for him to get there.

Also if one takes the 2008 salary and tries to calculate the 2011 figure based on consolidated cola and a 5% salary increase the monthly salary does not match up to what they published.

I not agreeing with the union at this point to go war over 5% but at the same time the company does PR to twist the public's thoughts on the matter.

[Redman]

he only way to please the union and for petrotrin to be able to afford to pay the 75% increase would be to remove the gas subsidy.....................

when last has petrotrin turned profit 3 years in a row




lemme hear allyuh now nah

AFAIK
Petrotrin receives market prices from the marketing companies
The marketing co s receive a subvention from the GOTT (aka the subsidy) and sell s the fuel at the local price.

That's how it happens.

Whether the govt pays in time is another issue.

Later

[teems1]

If Petrotrin workers not happy with their salary, why don't they just quit?

There are endless UWI/UTT grads who will gladly take the salaries they bitching about.

[Allergic2BunnyEars]

If Petrotrin workers not happy with their salary, why don't they just quit?

There are endless UWI/UTT grads who will gladly take the salaries they bitching about.

Please god no. University students don't know what to do straight out of school.

It easy to go to the extreme and say why not quit but you wouldn't say that if it was you in the same position.

[crazychinee]

If Petrotrin workers not happy with their salary, why don't they just quit?

There are endless UWI/UTT grads who will gladly take the salaries they bitching about.

Please god no. University students don't know what to do straight out of school.

It easy to go to the extreme and say why not quit but you wouldn't say that if it was you in the same position.

That's why they should raise salary, and then fire enough of them to compensate for the increase in salary.

Then put everyone else on contract; sign the contract to renew, or salt.

[villain]

the managers at petrotrin mismanage the company,lose millions of dollars and still recieve a bonus...which comes out of the worker's pocket....yet these managers are still here milking the company dry..since texico days what has changed...the systems of work in the rfinery or the people that manage it?...since malcom jones enter that company it all went down hill from there...and he came from ngc who made him leave because of improprieties and mismanagement....why must the workers suffer for this....since 2006 petrotrin workers hasnt had an increase in salary.....angastora got 17%...for eg...other companies have raised there workers salary,to try to match the cost of goods and services in this country ...what about the workers from petrotrin????? who is funding this country... whether is from hard work or market prices....do you know what it is to have to come out in the night at ungodly hours in the rain,chemical fumes,etc as compared to some of you who are complaining that petro. workers shouldnt get anything, when the most danger you face on a daily basis in your a/c office and padded chair, is a paper cut!!!!
those salaries posted is sheit...how can a general labourer be getting more than me and im monthly paid/permanent...
again, petrotrin prefers to give everybody else money other than its workers. they will pay off audits to make it seem like a lose,other than give the workers what is there just due(there is evidence of this...but all of a sudden petro. sent out a memo about giving out information to the public)...
you know since last year they importing oil from all over the place but it have a 330 million barrel find here that they were selling off secret to the new indian company here..(hmmm why did the prime minister suddenly went off to india again????) and it is being organised by the pm and others to sell off trimmar to this same indian company....
it have a lot of foolishness going on in petrotrin that the public doesnt know...all allu know is what is being said in the media to gain public sympathy...if this matter can go to court and have a speedy conclusion the union would have gone that way,but matters like these that years...and imagine this is from quite 2008 they trying to get the company to honor its agreements...we in 2012!!!!! come nah man...

[villain]

and if the economy so bad...when you give the workers a pay increase,where it going???????? ent back into the economy...because the workers will spend their money to get items,etc.....yet they have the balls to put in the express that they give 2 million dollars for Pan

[teems1]

the managers at petrotrin mismanage the company,lose millions of dollars and still recieve a bonus...which comes out of the worker's pocket....yet these managers are still here milking the company dry..since texico days what has changed...the systems of work in the rfinery or the people that manage it?...since malcom jones enter that company it all went down hill from there...and he came from ngc who made him leave because of improprieties and mismanagement....why must the workers suffer for this....since 2006 petrotrin workers hasnt had an increase in salary.....angastora got 17%...for eg...other companies have raised there workers salary,to try to match the cost of goods and services in this country ...what about the workers from petrotrin????? who is funding this country... whether is from hard work or market prices....do you know what it is to have to come out in the night at ungodly hours in the rain,chemical fumes,etc as compared to some of you who are complaining that petro. workers shouldnt get anything, when the most danger you face on a daily basis in your a/c office and padded chair, is a paper cut!!!!
those salaries posted is sheit...how can a general labourer be getting more than me and im monthly paid/permanent...
again, petrotrin prefers to give everybody else money other than its workers. they will pay off audits to make it seem like a lose,other than give the workers what is there just due(there is evidence of this...but all of a sudden petro. sent out a memo about giving out information to the public)...
you know since last year they importing oil from all over the place but it have a 330 million barrel find here that they were selling off secret to the new indian company here..(hmmm why did the prime minister suddenly went off to india again????) and it is being organised by the pm and others to sell off trimmar to this same indian company....
it have a lot of foolishness going on in petrotrin that the public doesnt know...all allu know is what is being said in the media to gain public sympathy...if this matter can go to court and have a speedy conclusion the union would have gone that way,but matters like these that years...and imagine this is from quite 2008 they trying to get the company to honor its agreements...we in 2012!!!!! come nah man...

paragraphs son, reading a wall of text isn't fun

you can rant and rave and go on, but at the end of the day, currently labourers/clerks are making 11-12k base salary.

clearly you are out of touch with reality if you think those are normal.

[villain]

sorry about the non paragraphs...but a labourer does not make that money...that is the salary of a monthly paid worker.....any labourer making this money is making it on overtime,everyday for a few weeks....i work there as both a labourer and now a permenant worker, so what is being said is nonsense....

[goodear]

I have been working Petrotrin for the last 14 years and every negotiation ,since my grandfather was fighting alongside Butler in Fyzabad ,has started at 25% or more only to NEGOTIATE to a 8 or 9 percent settlement, anyone who believes that the 25% was a demand have to not know what NEGOTIATION means. It leaves room for a counter,as a matter of fact, the last figure quoted was a 5/5/5 for the 3 years [2008 - 2011 period] to settle by the OWTU, then talks broke down, so it start over.
The company figures quoted in the newspaper are very misleading .For foremen working in the 'labour' capacity, we talking about men with 15 plus years of permanent service who are in charge of crews of men doing work, not a normal labourer. The engineer has to be a senior one with at least 8 plus years service. These figures are very misleading, but then some ppl will believe anything the politicians say, cause, as we know, politicians don't lie or twist the truth.
Profits? Well I was in a meeting when, the Union and the workers protested against GTL . Management still went ahead. Now they in 2 billion debt and being sued for 12 billion. So they use a new accounting method to pay the debt and thus put us in negative for 2 years so far. Pay the workers their just dues, which is 15% ex the first 100 million of profit , then pay the debt you got by not listening to the ppl who knew it was wrong.
No accountability by management but I have to pay and lose out on a contract agreement for profit sharing because you find a loophole to hide your mistakes for 2 years so far . Well 2 billion paid and we only show around 200 million loss over the same 2 years, we actually made 1.8 billoin profit befre we paid for the mismanagement of our resources. So that is why I will be home from saturday 10am.Again propoganda always much more believable than the truth. No to 5%

times hard....... but for stupid ppl it even harder

SOLIDARITY FOREVER

[Redman]

I'm hearing that they've settled for 8%.
the expectation is that things settling down for carnival.

Later

[pioneer]

yeh yeh...more money for dem to go to de rumshop and racing pool with...

then complain bout how hard things are...

[DSM_05]

do you know what it is to have to come out in the night at ungodly hours in the rain,chemical fumes,etc as compared to some of you who are complaining that petro. workers shouldnt get anything, when the most danger you face on a daily basis in your a/c office and padded chair, is a paper cut!!!!

What about when "technicians" laze around all day, and then "start" work at 3:30 in the afternoon (work day is 7-4, correct?)...and claim overtime ad nauseum?

Overtime is an industry in that company.

Workers/operators there need a reality check, and should work in private sector companies in the estate.


Most would boil dong like bhagi after. In fact, younger operators leavethe estate to go work for petor...for a better salary and an easier job.

Their (petro operator) salary IS BETTER, than most estate workers/operators (who work LONGER hours/shifts, and don't get "long week bonuses").



Talk nah.

[goodear]

Come down in the refinery and work nah man, i need a drinking partner as well as one who could fight a hydrocarbon fire and administer first aid as i have done twice last year. And no, no 8% yet ,they still in meeting.

[DSM_05]

^been there done that....was there many years ago the refinery. Back then fires were more rampnt, PPE wasn't even mandatory for all personnel visting the plant.

Never returning...sorry.

In the private sector you have to work more...but it is more rewarding for someone who wants to progress..and who values a job-well-done, rather than wants to kick back and relax.....and not do anything "outside" their job description.

[Redman]

The state should not be in business

Make it a publicly traded oil co like PETROBRAS

Let everybody be paid on productivity.

Later

[sMASH]

^^^ jolly good.

[redmanjp]

I LOL@ these unions threatening "90 days of war"

They should be arrested and charged for threatening to destabilize the country. In the modern world that threat won't be taken lightly.

well it would be illegal if they do strike since it's an essential service right?

[villain]

do you know what it is to have to come out in the night at ungodly hours in the rain,chemical fumes,etc as compared to some of you who are complaining that petro. workers shouldnt get anything, when the most danger you face on a daily basis in your a/c office and padded chair, is a paper cut!!!!

What about when "technicians" laze around all day, and then "start" work at 3:30 in the afternoon (work day is 7-4, correct?)...and claim overtime ad nauseum?

Overtime is an industry in that company.

Workers/operators there need a reality check, and should work in private sector companies in the estate.


Most would boil dong like bhagi after. In fact, younger operators leavethe estate to go work for petor...for a better salary and an easier job.

Their (petro operator) salary IS BETTER, than most estate workers/operators (who work LONGER hours/shifts, and don't get "long week bonuses").



Talk nah.

you talking like that dont happen in your job....how about the lazy public servants who do nothing and frustrate the public on a daily basis...ent they got a raise???? without people like you condemning them....
i work in a dept. where i eat..when i can...rest when i can...outside on top a tank in sun,rain...night or day....i or rather "we" do jobs outside of our job description,because you know what?..it doesnt have one for us...it conveniently disappeared....you are trying to lump all "technicians" in the same boat,and i dont have to tell you how that sounds..(do i?)...should i also come to your job and try to tell you how unimportant your job is or what you should or shouldnt get?...i'd be FAST AND OUT OF PLACE....

[De Dragon]

I'll never forget the cool story an engineer who used to work here once told me bout his time there.

[coolstory]As part of a Mech Eng team they had recently completed the installation of some new pumps at one ah the plants within the Pointe-à-Pierre refinery. On the day of commissioning of said pumps they had a small ceremony and invited a few senior engineers and the suppliers of the pump. However the commissioning was delayed because a valve turner was not present (He was out on lunch) to turn on the valve and start the pump. To have any other person do so would have taken away work from the valve turner and OWTU does not allow work to be taken from their members[end /coolstory]

The idea of this is more of a safety aspect.
When i used to work on site, we were told not to do any work outside our classification, cause in the event of an accident, we would be wrong if we were doing something we were not employed to do.

Yeah but to open a valve? (This is assuming of course that the operator has already readied the pump for first service.)

[goodear]

So let me get this straight, because private sector industries raping you while paying you a pitance of your worth I must subject myself to your personal hell,lol, sounds like sour grapes. Keep your slave mentality to yourself. The livelyhood of my family is of utmost importance ,not lining the pockets of foreigners.No valve turners in the refinery, only operators are allowed to operate valves on a plant, so if the man hungry let him eat while the fat cats wait in the heat and smell of the 50 year old plants and equipment that we face every day . Never seen a manager on a plant in the 9 years I've been running them. And I've worked on 3 of the bigger ones.

[villain]

if you do something outside of your job and something happens...you get the full brunt of the company....if you are injured, the first thing the company asks what you were doing there and they seek to lay the blame on you,hence distancing themselves away from any and all responsibility...this has happened before many times....so i guess people learn they lesson and dont do what they are not being paid to do

[Aaron 2NR]

these rates are actually the lower end of the brackets and not like the poster above....i have a copy of the union rates somewhere around the office...

a clerk get around $52.50 per hr....

foreman 1 $85.22
foreman 3 $105.66


remember these workers also get COLA..


having worked in the environment, if you ask someone for some assistance ( for argument sake, hold a measuring tape ) and it's not in their job description, he going and tell you I AM NOT DOING THAT.......

Those rates are bogus. Engineers do not make that sort of money off the bat. The article doesn't state what grade the engineer is at to make that 20k salary nor how long it took for him to get there.

Also if one takes the 2008 salary and tries to calculate the 2011 figure based on consolidated cola and a 5% salary increase the monthly salary does not match up to what they published.

I not agreeing with the union at this point to go war over 5% but at the same time the company does PR to twist the public's thoughts on the matter.

go to the owtu and ask them for a copy for the rate sheet set by the unions you will be surprised. I worked in the refinery up to last year....saw contractual agreements daily....

[nervewrecker]

*yawns*

tank full, no traffic by richmond street.....wait....it have nobody fulling this hour so thats why it have no line

[Allergic2BunnyEars]

these rates are actually the lower end of the brackets and not like the poster above....i have a copy of the union rates somewhere around the office...

a clerk get around $52.50 per hr....

foreman 1 $85.22
foreman 3 $105.66


remember these workers also get COLA..


having worked in the environment, if you ask someone for some assistance ( for argument sake, hold a measuring tape ) and it's not in their job description, he going and tell you I AM NOT DOING THAT.......

Those rates are bogus. Engineers do not make that sort of money off the bat. The article doesn't state what grade the engineer is at to make that 20k salary nor how long it took for him to get there.

Also if one takes the 2008 salary and tries to calculate the 2011 figure based on consolidated cola and a 5% salary increase the monthly salary does not match up to what they published.

I not agreeing with the union at this point to go war over 5% but at the same time the company does PR to twist the public's thoughts on the matter.

go to the owtu and ask them for a copy for the rate sheet set by the unions you will be surprised. I worked in the refinery up to last year....saw contractual agreements daily....

I working there all now and the rate booklet, my payslip, my contract all do not line up with those published figures.

Also if you take the figures of 2008 and try to calculate the 2011 figures they don't match up.

[wing]

Aaron , the rates that were posted are actually at the higher end i.e. after merit and progression . How you claim to have a salary schedule of the monthly paid bargaining unit collective agreement seems a bit fishy since you were not employed by the company but were part and parcel of the outrageous cost overruns in the GOP project. So please let us have constructive discussion and hope for a reasonable outcome.