Sandals Thread!

[agent007]

From the little I know, even the local lodge members are a bit divided on the whole sandals issue.

[bluefete]

AHAHAHAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!

From the little I know, even the local lodge members are a bit divided on the whole sandals issue.

[The_Honourable]

Weeks after Sandals pulled out of Tobago, the private sector is pushing to get the international resort back on the island.

A group of companies has already committed more than a quarter of a billion US dollars to help Sandals change its mind about investing in Tobago.

[Rovin]

regular job cyar walk in d bank & get us$300 to go on a lil holiday or buy ting online but for certain ppl a few 100 us million $$$ is accessible ...

[Miktay]

If Massy et al want to invest in Sandals...they should do so. But why gubbament needs to fund thiz. Why does gubbament need to seek external loans if large T&T companies see the potential?

[ADONI]

regular job cyar walk in d bank & get us$300 to go on a lil holiday or buy ting online but for certain ppl a few 100 us million $$$ is accessible ...

Took the f'in words out meh mouth! Why they doh sop lying, that money not going trickle down to nobody. Money going stay to the top and transferred out the county!

[hydroep]

Sandals clarifies Turks and Caicos closure
Richardson Dhalai

Sandals Resorts International (SRI) has sought to clarify its decision to close its Beaches Turk & Caicos Resort Villages and Spa from January 2021 saying this was not as a result of unpaid taxes but for breaches by the Turks and Caicos Islands, (TCI) government of “legally binding documents.”

SRI announced recently that its Beaches resort will be closed from September 3 to October 15 in 2019 and from September 7 to October 22, 2020, and then “for an indefinite period from January 2021.”

TCI Premier and Finance Minister Sharlene Cartwright-Robinson, in a statement said her administration has been addressing the “long outstanding “issue with Beaches and remains confident “that with the facts in full view, we can bring an end to a critical outstanding matter that has seen its basis in an arrangement in place since the Resort’s operation started in the 90s and existed throughout every government in the TCI since then”.

Cartwright-Robinson said the matter is not one of Beaches avoiding taxes or of the former governments intentionally leaving this matter unaddressed.

In a statement, SRI said the resort has operated in TCI for the past 23 years and has “punctually and accurately paid taxes according to law.”

“As a matter of fact, we are the first in line to pay our taxes. To the contrary, it is Beaches Resorts that is currently owed many millions of dollars in over paid taxes.”

https://newsday.co.tt/2019/02/01/sandals-clarifies-turks-and-caicos-closure/

[The_Honourable]

^^^ bad publicity? naysayers? the opposition?

[De Dragon]

Yes, Lok Jack and Massy care about Tobago people, just like the IDB were willing to loan 16 billion to "develop" T&T according to Habit7, Redman, eliteauto etc.

[Redman]

16B loan at 5% invested in infrastructure and hotels and highways,ports etc etc etc giving an ROI of 15%-is good business.

And yeah borrowing USD at 5% with US inflation is 2-3% and putting it into solid projects is just about the cheapest money we can get.

Like EVERYTHING in finance-cost benefit-Returns vs cost of funds, total benefit vs all in cost are the determinants.

[De Dragon]

16B loan at 5% invested in infrastructure and hotels and highways,ports etc etc etc giving an ROI of 15%-is good business.

And yeah borrowing USD at 5% with US inflation is 2-3% and putting it into solid projects is just about the cheapest money we can get.

Like EVERYTHING in finance-cost benefit-Returns vs cost of funds, total benefit vs all in cost are the determinants.

My apologies, I was referring to the cost of the rapid rail.
The BILLIONS required to be put out are untenable because we already are in a position where through the most unbelievable economic PNM "policy" of "borrowing to maintain our current lifestyle" has our debt to GDP ratio at a level that is unsustainable, meaning any profits generated by Sandals would be essentially eaten up as repayment of said loans.

[Redman]

I NEVER supported the rapid rail....the closest I came was to ask for justification.

In terms of Sandals...the reality is that the GORTT would have leaned on the private sector....for some if not all of the finance.

Again...if the analysis shows that the benefits outweigh the costs...then why not.

I would just ask for robust transparent analysis

[zoom rader]

Good riddance to Sandals, this is how Trump got rich he imposed the same tactics on New York city. He made New York spent the money and he got rich all for nothing.

[ek4ever]

If Massy et al want to invest in Sandals...they should do so. But why gubbament needs to fund thiz. Why does gubbament need to seek external loans if large T&T companies see the potential?

Thank you. Business people here so full of sh1t.... don't want to take any risk and always have govt foot the bill and then they jump on the bandwagon and profit. To hell with all of them.... Just like OWTU... put up or shut up.... This is why our business sector so uncompetitive.

And to the Sandals supporters, Tobago had Hilton here.... an international brand much bigger than Sandals... and that failed because of underlying weaknesses in our tourism products.... which still exists today and even worse off... a big name hotel was not going to fix this and just think what would happen if Sandals pull out after 5 years of under performance... who holding the bill. BTW... why would North Americans choose Tobago when Sandals have locations much closer to them?

[Miktay]

If Massy et al want to invest in Sandals...they should do so. But why gubbament needs to fund thiz. Why does gubbament need to seek external loans if large T&T companies see the potential?

Thank you. Business people here so full of sh1t.... don't want to take any risk and always have govt foot the bill and then they jump on the bandwagon and profit. To hell with all of them.... Just like OWTU... put up or shut up.... This is why our business sector so uncompetitive.

And to the Sandals supporters, Tobago had Hilton here.... an international brand much bigger than Sandals... and that failed because of underlying weaknesses in our tourism products.... which still exists today and even worse off... a big name hotel was not going to fix this and just think what would happen if Sandals pull out after 5 years of under performance... who holding the bill. BTW... why would North Americans choose Tobago when Sandals have locations much closer to them?

For some Sandals iz like a cruise. You may have taken the Bahamas cruise but also on offer iz a cruise to Mexico, Cuba, Bermuda etc.

IMHO Butch asked for way too much and GORTT wasnt able to justify the demands of Sandals. That said no economic analysis can really predict the future. Occupancy rates will decline if there iza global recession for example.

A better partnership iz where each entity Sandals, T&T private sector and GORTT have enough skin in the game to provide an incentive to succeed. If Butch can just walk away if the going gets rough cuz he put no money into the deal how iz t that an equitable arrangement?

[matr1x]

We adding the C to the thread title yet?

[De Dragon]

I NEVER supported the rapid rail....the closest I came was to ask for justification.

In terms of Sandals...the reality is that the GORTT would have leaned on the private sector....for some if not all of the finance.

Again...if the analysis shows that the benefits outweigh the costs...then why not.

I would just ask for robust transparent analysis

Again, NOTHING in any of the talks, information( scant though it was) mentioned any of this. The MOU, and yes I know your take on that, clearly stated that the GORTT was to finance the project. Goebbels, nor JUHN Scarfy have ever said anything about local private sector involvement.

[Redman]

I NEVER supported the rapid rail....the closest I came was to ask for justification.

In terms of Sandals...the reality is that the GORTT would have leaned on the private sector....for some if not all of the finance.

Again...if the analysis shows that the benefits outweigh the costs...then why not.

I would just ask for robust transparent analysis

Again, NOTHING in any of the talks, information( scant though it was) mentioned any of this. The MOU, and yes I know your take on that, clearly stated that the GORTT was to finance the project. Goebbels, nor JUHN Scarfy have ever said anything about local private sector involvement.

Uh you need to re read the MOU.
The MOU said by any reasonable means-including PRIVATE EQUITY FINANCING.
those words were used-
Govt can finance through multiple mechanisms.

[De Dragon]

I NEVER supported the rapid rail....the closest I came was to ask for justification.

In terms of Sandals...the reality is that the GORTT would have leaned on the private sector....for some if not all of the finance.

Again...if the analysis shows that the benefits outweigh the costs...then why not.

I would just ask for robust transparent analysis

Again, NOTHING in any of the talks, information( scant though it was) mentioned any of this. The MOU, and yes I know your take on that, clearly stated that the GORTT was to finance the project. Goebbels, nor JUHN Scarfy have ever said anything about local private sector involvement.

Uh you need to re read the MOU.
The MOU said by any reasonable means-including PRIVATE EQUITY FINANCING.
those words were used-
Govt can finance through multiple mechanisms.

What they could have done, and what they were actually going to do are very, very different things. I f you could show me where a spirited defence of this "game changing" project by JUHN Scarfy, or Goebbels, or fack it any PNM politico, that specifically mentions private sector funding, I'd be grateful.

[matr1x]

Now we know why they wanted sandals....more ppl to rob

[Redman]

I NEVER supported the rapid rail....the closest I came was to ask for justification.

In terms of Sandals...the reality is that the GORTT would have leaned on the private sector....for some if not all of the finance.

Again...if the analysis shows that the benefits outweigh the costs...then why not.

I would just ask for robust transparent analysis

Again, NOTHING in any of the talks, information( scant though it was) mentioned any of this. The MOU, and yes I know your take on that, clearly stated that the GORTT was to finance the project. Goebbels, nor JUHN Scarfy have ever said anything about local private sector involvement.

Uh you need to re read the MOU.
The MOU said by any reasonable means-including PRIVATE EQUITY FINANCING.
those words were used-
Govt can finance through multiple mechanisms.

What they could have done, and what they were actually going to do are very, very different things. I f you could show me where a spirited defence of this "game changing" project by JUHN Scarfy, or Goebbels, or fack it any PNM politico, that specifically mentions private sector funding, I'd be grateful.

https://newsday.co.tt/2017/10/31/guardi ... nterested/

Prime Minister Dr Keith Rowley revealed on Sunday that Government is seeking private-sector investment to help build the Sandals resort in Tobago and that so far, Guardian Life and Massy Holdings have expressed an interest.

[sMASH]

[Monk BANzai]

for those of you who thought Sandals was gonna make indigenous Trinis and Bagoninans "Bell hops"...

https://news784.com/local-news/sandals- ... t-vincent/

Gov't after gov't never gets it right.... another lost opportunity.

[zoom rader]

for those of you who thought Sandals was gonna make indigenous Trinis and Bagoninans "Bell hops"...

https://news784.com/local-news/sandals- ... t-vincent/

beachesplane.jpg

Gov't after gov't never gets it right.... another lost opportunity.

A Perceived Billonare criminal was jail and he also sponsored Cricket.

[Redman]

for those of you who thought Sandals was gonna make indigenous Trinis and Bagoninans "Bell hops"...

https://news784.com/local-news/sandals- ... t-vincent/

beachesplane.jpg

Gov't after gov't never gets it right.... another lost opportunity.

That lie was propagated and leveraged...

What is sad is that there isnt anything wrong with people being bell hops etc....service is not servitude.



Earlier this year I met a man that was a bell hop at the Hyatt- he was smart and diligent enough whereby he was amassing a very respectable income -work ethic and 'hustle'

A strong and qualified labor pool that is experienced and mobile would pay dividends to the entire country, another loss on the altar of politics.

[88sins]

for those of you who thought Sandals was gonna make indigenous Trinis and Bagoninans "Bell hops"...

https://news784.com/local-news/sandals- ... t-vincent/

beachesplane.jpg

Gov't after gov't never gets it right.... another lost opportunity.

problem wasn't only turning locals into "bell hops" tho
iirc we were supposed to pay the total cost to initial build it entirely from the ground up & operate it, sandals would then plaster their name on it, control who works there, who supplies them, & then take a huge chunk of the revenue generated. That whole deal was looking & sounding like ratchet racket. It would have been a real sweet deal if it went thru, sweet for sandals.


consider
with this pandemic in the air & many countries limiting & restricting travel for God alone knows how long again, and who knows how long it will be before tourist arrival numbers return to pre-covid normalcy not just here but across the region, some would say that since that deal never went thru we might have just dodged a bullet. no sense having a new 1000 room hotel with nobody in it due to covid travel restrictions or the tourist pool shrinks due to economic hard times in north america & europe.

[pugboy]

^correct
that deal was gonna give them major concessions on supply of items too
sure we would be allowed monoply supply of toolum and beneballs
and yeah the world hotel industry in a bust now

[Rovin]

88 & PB hit d nail on its head ...

[Monk BANzai]

for those of you who thought Sandals was gonna make indigenous Trinis and Bagoninans "Bell hops"...

https://news784.com/local-news/sandals- ... t-vincent/

beachesplane.jpg

Gov't after gov't never gets it right.... another lost opportunity.

problem wasn't only turning locals into "bell hops" tho
iirc we were supposed to pay the total cost to initial build it entirely from the ground up & operate it, sandals would then plaster their name on it, control who works there, who supplies them, & then take a huge chunk of the revenue generated. That whole deal was looking & sounding like ratchet racket. It would have been a real sweet deal if it went thru, sweet for sandals.


consider
with this pandemic in the air & many countries limiting & restricting travel for God alone knows how long again, and who knows how long it will be before tourist arrival numbers return to pre-covid normalcy not just here but across the region, some would say that since that deal never went thru we might have just dodged a bullet. no sense having a new 1000 room hotel with nobody in it due to covid travel restrictions or the tourist pool shrinks due to economic hard times in north america & europe.

i have no issue with that to be honest, given that on our OWN steam we can't do jack chit. At least it would have taken the value of the Tourism dollar higher than us trying to get it off the ground...and failing at it. Had we have a solid environment and Sandals came with that trojan horse we were well within our method to hit them a HYMC. But we are not. And we constantly sit in a position of "What if" instead of pulling le trigger.

And again i ask, the other Caribbean countries that use the Sandals model...where are they in tersm of the global tourism footprint?

Where are we? From a process standpoint. We've gone and shopped for what we want, and admit that we don't have the means to do it.....and yet...

Good points and perspective tho..got me thinking about other regions and how they are mitigating the risk of large empty rooms and what the governments of those regions are doing to stem the bleed.

[bluefete]

for those of you who thought Sandals was gonna make indigenous Trinis and Bagoninans "Bell hops"...

https://news784.com/local-news/sandals- ... t-vincent/

beachesplane.jpg

Gov't after gov't never gets it right.... another lost opportunity.

problem wasn't only turning locals into "bell hops" tho
iirc we were supposed to pay the total cost to initial build it entirely from the ground up & operate it, sandals would then plaster their name on it, control who works there, who supplies them, & then take a huge chunk of the revenue generated. That whole deal was looking & sounding like ratchet racket. It would have been a real sweet deal if it went thru, sweet for sandals.


consider
with this pandemic in the air & many countries limiting & restricting travel for God alone knows how long again, and who knows how long it will be before tourist arrival numbers return to pre-covid normalcy not just here but across the region, some would say that since that deal never went thru we might have just dodged a bullet. no sense having a new 1000 room hotel with nobody in it due to covid travel restrictions or the tourist pool shrinks due to economic hard times in north america & europe.

i have no issue with that to be honest, given that on our OWN steam we can't do jack chit. At least it would have taken the value of the Tourism dollar higher than us trying to get it off the ground...and failing at it. Had we have a solid environment and Sandals came with that trojan horse we were well within our method to hit them a HYMC. But we are not. And we constantly sit in a position of "What if" instead of pulling le trigger.

And again i ask, the other Caribbean countries that use the Sandals model...where are they in tersm of the global tourism footprint?

Where are we? From a process standpoint. We've gone and shopped for what we want, and admit that we don't have the means to do it.....and yet...

Good points and perspective tho..got me thinking about other regions and how they are mitigating the risk of large empty rooms and what the governments of those regions are doing to stem the bleed.

The governments of those economies do not have oil and gas so they have to be innovative and creative. Talk done.