The Religion Discussion

[Sky]

There is a ravine that flows through my grandmother's land. One day when I was small we were there and we saw a creature. She told me it was a zangie, and don't go in the ravine alone or it will bite off my big toe. I went alone once. I didn't lose my big toe, but I stepped on broken glass and fux0rd my foot. Her point wasn't to protect me from the glass, but from drowning. Maybe one day
I'll be there with my child and we'll see a zangie. What should I tell them? I could call it a salamander and tell them it carries diseases, so don't go in the ravine alone. Or I can just tell them about my foot.
The target end result remains.

[toyo682]

^^^^Cool to all the above post, I guess there is only one way to know for sure. Fact is one out of one die, we'll find out then.

[MG Man]

^^^^Cool to all the above post, I guess there is only one way to know for sure. Fact is one out of one die, we'll find out then.

that's all I'm sayin bro, that's all I'm sayin
NOBODY not believers in god, atheists can know for sure
so nobody is in a position to condemn anyone else.......

[pato]

^^^^Cool to all the above post, I guess there is only one way to know for sure. Fact is one out of one die, we'll find out then.

that's all I'm sayin bro, that's all I'm sayin
NOBODY not believers in god, atheists can know for sure
so nobody is in a position to condemn anyone else.......

Well i think most atheists become nonbelievers because of the presence of hypocrisy in all the religions of the world. I'm not sure in your case, but i hate condemning other people about their religion or their beliefs but wouldn't all of us like to know the truth about the dead and whether we will see them again or not.

[Duane 3NE 2NR]

^ perhaps we can see them all now! The energy in the universe is constant and only changes form

There is a ravine that flows through my grandmother's land. One day when I was small we were there and we saw a creature. She told me it was a zangie, and don't go in the ravine alone or it will bite off my big toe. I went alone once. I didn't lose my big toe, but I stepped on broken glass and fux0rd my foot. Her point wasn't to protect me from the glass, but from drowning. Maybe one day
I'll be there with my child and we'll see a zangie. What should I tell them? I could call it a salamander and tell them it carries diseases, so don't go in the ravine alone. Or I can just tell them about my foot.
The target end result remains.

aesop's fables = religious texts?

[pato]

Well....if you dont believe in the bible then its kinda useless to pinpoint key texts to illustrate what really happens after death and what happens to the dead.

However the bible is a book of prophecy as it foretold the coming of the Jesus Christ, the fall of Babylon the great and the exact details as to how and who would be involved.Isaiah 40:22 which describes the earth as a circle when many at the time though the earth was flat.

[MG Man]

^^^^Cool to all the above post, I guess there is only one way to know for sure. Fact is one out of one die, we'll find out then.

that's all I'm sayin bro, that's all I'm sayin
NOBODY not believers in god, atheists can know for sure
so nobody is in a position to condemn anyone else.......

Well i think most atheists become nonbelievers because of the presence of hypocrisy in all the religions of the world. I'm not sure in your case, but i hate condemning other people about their religion or their beliefs but wouldn't all of us like to know the truth about the dead and whether we will see them again or not.

I have an open mind for most things, but the more I searched for truth in religion and the idea of a supreme being, the less sense it made to me...............
funny how society scorns and condemns you for not having any 'faith' but then casts an eye towards the stupidity and hypocrisy surrounding religion...and then they totally disrespect your point of view by trying to 'save' you

when I used to follow hinduism i got sick and tired of muslims and christians always trying to condemn / save me even when they know siht about their own religion

I firmly believe Hitchens is right in that religion poisons everything

[MG Man]

Well....if you dont believe in the bible then its kinda useless to pinpoint key texts to illustrate what really happens after death and what happens to the dead.

However the bible is a book of prophecy as it foretold the coming of the Jesus Christ, the fall of Babylon the great and the exact details as to how and who would be involved.Isaiah 40:22 which describes the earth as a circle when many at the time though the earth was flat.

when did babylon fall?
when was the bible written?
How could it fortell the coming of the hippie when i was written after his death?
a circle and a sphere are two very different things
hinduism identified 10 planets, inclusive of Pluto and Charon
The mahabarath documents mechanized flight and nuclear warfare............I could go on and on
the bible is not factual
it is a book of stories set against the places of that time, and adapts stories from uch earlier civilizations

[pato]

Well....if you dont believe in the bible then its kinda useless to pinpoint key texts to illustrate what really happens after death and what happens to the dead.

However the bible is a book of prophecy as it foretold the coming of the Jesus Christ, the fall of Babylon the great and the exact details as to how and who would be involved.Isaiah 40:22 which describes the earth as a circle when many at the time though the earth was flat.

when did babylon fall?
when was the bible written?
How could it fortell the coming of the hippie when i was written after his death?
a circle and a sphere are two very different things
hinduism identified 10 planets, inclusive of Pluto and Charon
The mahabarath documents mechanized flight and nuclear warfare............I could go on and on
the bible is not factual
it is a book of stories set against the places of that time, and adapts stories from uch earlier civilizations

I could go on and on but you are right .......we see much criticism, fighting, persecution in finding the truth about God, the dead...etc. Why is this ?......its as if something is clouding the minds of people in society. You dont believe in the bible because of past experiences not making sense to you or because certain individuals study the bible but yet act contrary to it?

I guess this would not make sense to you either...the word of the Apostle Paul in his letter to young Timothy , 2 Tim 3:16 " All scripture is inspired by god for teaching.....disciplining in righteousness" - This is showing that all the scriptures that Timothy was exposed to in his young life was written as an inspiration from God. The only think stopping this conversation is my typing but i understand how you may have came about with your beliefs because i was once there myself.

[MG Man]

I notice you didn't comment on my remark about the chronology regarding the bible's prophetic qualities

[pato]

I would but as i said my typing is what's holding this conversation back, Why don't you check your PM later this afternoon. Your questions are all the same questions that i had a few yrs back which is y i could understand perfectly y u may resort to your current beliefs. All these questions have answers but i prefer to state the events of the bible in a plot and y all the events happened as they did and explain from start to finish.

[MG Man]

ok cool
Look forward to reading

[Sky]

^ perhaps we can see them all now! The energy in the universe is constant and only changes form

There is a ravine that flows through my grandmother's land. One day when I was small we were there and we saw a creature. She told me it was a zangie, and don't go in the ravine alone or it will bite off my big toe. I went alone once. I didn't lose my big toe, but I stepped on broken glass and fux0rd my foot. Her point wasn't to protect me from the glass, but from drowning. Maybe one day
I'll be there with my child and we'll see a zangie. What should I tell them? I could call it a salamander and tell them it carries diseases, so don't go in the ravine alone. Or I can just tell them about my foot.
The target end result remains.

aesop's fables = religious texts?

What? Nooo lol. That really happened to me. That's MY granny. I don't have a kid tho.

My point was that my grandmother told me something to get a certain result, and I may tell a child something else to get the same result.

Nobody knows how many humans walked the earth. But the presence of all religions either one of two things. Either there really is some being "up there", Or it's just human nature to satisfy their existence by claiming a God "above"
My belief is that there is a superior being, but over the centuries, language barriers, geographical location race barriers and other things all contribute to different stories all leading back to the same God way back then. Because most of them push for the same effect. Be good to each other, be good to yourself and pay reverence to the being ruling us all. Do this and when you die there's a good place for you to be and you will be at peace. I also believe that over time man corrupted this for greed and to control others.
So I stay away from all of them, but knowing that they all lead back to the same being somehow, no matter how much they strayed from the real thing.

[Duane 3NE 2NR]

yes Sky that is what I meant
it was a metaphor, an analogy.

My point was that my grandmother told me something to get a certain result, and I may tell a child something else to get the same result.

The Bible, in the books of Samuel, gives the account of David and Goliath. There are many morals of the story, one being the victory of the small, good and modest over the large, evil and extravagant.

Not very different from Jack and Beanstalk.

Both teach the same values, some need to learn the lessons taught as a story, others need to have it from a divine source, some would just pick up the same lessons from good parents having not heard either story.

whichever one floats your boat.
again, its just based on what you want to believe.

Amazing though that Bluefete and others don;t quote from jack and the beanstalk and take the story literally.

[wagonrunner]

Amazing though that Bluefete and others don;t quote from jack and the beanstalk and take the story literally.

one of jacks selected few did not right that.

[Sky]

Their religion was designed that way over the centuries. You let one pass and any other can claim their own.

[d spike]

Firstly where exactly in the bible says we are going to heaven when we die ? Eccl 9:5 says " The living are concious that they will die but the dead are concious of nothing at all".

John11:11-14- When Lazarus died and Jesus resurrected him...he did not come back to life and talk about heaven or hell...for him he was in a deep sleep which is y i was curious as where exactly did the bible tells us we are going to heaven when we die.

Against my better judgment, I am going to stick my nose in this thread again... (I pulled it out due to my inability to log on - severe versionthreeitis - and then kept it out because I couldn't cope with the double inanity of one clearly insane character along with another whose idea of a proper response is a lot of yak that doesn't include a proper response)

...What I wish to point out regards the first book quoted from above, namely, Ecclesiastes. This is actually a Sadducee scripture, the only one in the bible. (The Sadducees didn't believe in an afterlife, so the thought of looking here to answer a question regarding the Christian belief of an afterlife brings a smile to this old fool... but I digress...) The fact that both Jews and Christians (at least those early ones who compiled the scriptures) considered this text worthy of a place among the other scriptures that now make up the bible, says a lot about their open-mindedness (the Saducees were a Jewish sect that had very materialistic leanings; they considered this life the only existence for Man, therefore, one's rewards and punishments took place in this life, and was handed on to their descendants - you can see their influence in Jewish and even Christian thinking (temporal reward/punishment).

Isn't it remarkable that those early compilers of Christian scripture could be so open-minded, to include a piece of scripture from a group whose beliefs border on heresy, yet there are many who quote from that same compilation of scripture to whom open-mindedness is an alien concept?

Just my 2 cents...

[d spike]

Answer me this question which I have asked and no one seems to want to answer, How can there be several truths for one thing.
Take for example salvation, or going to heaven. If you believe that there are many ways explain how this is fair logically. Where is the fairness in God revealing himself several ways, so now I can through the revelation of Jesus go to heaven based on faith, but a Muslim must do enough good works, how does he know when he has done enough, what if he thinks he has, only to die and find out he hasn't because he does not know what he is aiming for. How about the woman in India who throws her baby into the Ganges River so that her god can forgive her, how is that fair to her or her innocent baby, since many like to clamor about the innocent. How does the Buddhist know when he achieves Nirvana, until then he is stuck here, but when I die in faith through Christ I go straight to heaven. How is this fair Duane answer me please? God has made several paths but all have different weights on them.

This is too easy... Whatever happened to "My ways are not your ways"?
What about the point Jesus was making when he told the parable in Matthew 20:1-16? How each is weighed is up to his Creator... your concern is how you will be weighed (and hopefully, not found wanting)

To quote from the book of Job, where God speaks to Job: "Who are you to question my wisdom with your ignorant empty words?... Do you know all the answers?"

But seriously, the correct answer lies in the fact that religion is part of culture, and how we view that which we consider god has to do with how we are brought to our belief - if that sounds too "cold and intellectual", then this is the same: God reaches out to us in the way we live and interact with each other, and our consciences are formed in the ways we are taught what is expected from us. This then guides us back to Him.

Stop wasting your time looking at what is on other people's plates. This only breeds jealousy or vanity. Use your concepts of right and wrong that you have learned to guide your steps - that's what they are for, that is why you were given them. From the time you start to dictate to others what is right for them, then you start to abuse those gifts. They are for personal guidance, not the judgment of others - that is not your job, you weren't sent here for that.

Cheers

[Duane 3NE 2NR]

^ preach it!

[toyo682]

^^^^cool

[megadoc1]

hello D spike

[bluefete]

My system is still down so I am on borrowed time here.

[MG Man]

I would but as i said my typing is what's holding this conversation back, Why don't you check your PM later this afternoon. Your questions are all the same questions that i had a few yrs back which is y i could understand perfectly y u may resort to your current beliefs. All these questions have answers but i prefer to state the events of the bible in a plot and y all the events happened as they did and explain from start to finish.

still waiting..............

[bluefete]

You are being very dis-ingenuous.

"Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man:
But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed.
Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death." James 1: 13-15

"But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart." Matthew 5:28

Y'know what, don't answer me with the bible, answer me with your mind and heart.

Infact, bluefete, you answer some questions. Not the next one, i think he's a legal moron, seriously. He should just go back to the NWS thread and lust, then ask for forgiveness like a good christian, then go do it again.

Adam and Eve ate the apple, against God's instructions. For this they were cast out, and from henceforth (lemme use the king james language nah, because since he translate it, people from back then used to speak like that....lawl) anywayz, from henceforth they were cast out. They saw shame yada yada. So if they didn't eat that fruit (btw I dunno where allyuh get this apple thing from, the bible never said that) anywayzz, if they didn't eat that fruit, we should all be in the garden of Eden right?. Now earlier in this thread I saw you say that we have a choice and free will. That was his gift to us. But if we do as we please is lix, right? So what if God did NOT give us free will that made the angels jealous? (btw their business fix) Then what? What would we MISS? When I say miss, I mean what would we have known as sin to actually want to do it? No murders, no rape, no stealing. Sounds like heaven to me. Do as you're told and be happy. My question is: What would it be like without sin? Then there's natural disasters. I'm gonna give you a blight and since we had no choice then we know for sure there's a God, and since that is so, He'd show his face like he did in the bible (and somehow he's shy since the bible was finished) and save us from Natural disasters. I'll give you that one.

Another question. A simple one. Why do we have both Saturday and Sunday off?:)

Question again: Why are you taking 80+ pages to defend NOT GOD (forget MG man, he's a kant), but the bible and the christian way of life? Why is it so difficult?

Another one: Why when you tell a christian that they found 2 more books, from Jusdas and Mary, they pull away, call you names, say that is of the devil etc?

#5: why we don't have chariots of fire anymore? Where the burning bushes? Why is God so subtle now?

Don't answer with bible verses, answer with your knowledge. Bause if you wanna play bible, There's abible study session goin on right now in my galley and I could get the verses to the things i know said in the bible and dismiss both of you.[/quote]

Sky; The first sin committed by Adam & Eve was "doubt". They doubted that God would follow through on His word.

This was followed by "disobedience". When they disobeyed, punishment swiftly followed. God kept His word.

"What would it be like without sin?" - You will doubtless find out when you reach in Heaven.

"Why do we have Saturday and Sunday off?" Speak for yourself. I work on both Saturdays and Sundays, if I so choose. Remember the sabbath was made for man, not man for the sabbath.

"Why do we not have chariots of fire anymore?" Well we do but in a different form. It is called a "spacecraft". You know, like the Saturn V rockets that sent men to the moon or the soon-to-be extinct space shuttles. God does not need to send chariots of fire when he can work in other ways. Anyway, God is still working everday in our lives.

?Why when you tell a christian that they found 2 more books, from Judas and Mary, they pull away, call you names, say that is of the devil etc?" Well, these books can either corroborate what was already written or dispute them. Was the book of Judas written by "Judas"? Is this the same Judas who hung himself after betraying Jesus?

What about the Gospel of Mary Magdalene? Do people want to make a "love" relationship link? If Jesus rebuked the devil for tempting him, how much more would he have been able to turn away Mary's advances (if there were ever any such to begin with)?

It would really be interesting to get access to the inner library of the Vatican and other religious bodies.

"Where the burning bushes?" The world does not need another Moses right now.

[bluefete]

^^^ respect for what?

Respect for a religion that believes that the Jews deserved the Holocaust because they did not believe/accept Jesus?

Respect for a religion that says their way is the only right way? All others are on a pathway to hell?

Respect for a religion that sees Buddha/Kali(and probably all others) as demons?

Respect for a religion who believes that if a child is born sick(i would love to know how this child has sinned, or what the hell a baby could do to sin) it is because of his parents or grandparents or even ancestors from thousands of years before

I have no respect for that, that is not a religion, that's a sham.

ABAQ Trading: There is only One God!!!!

[bluefete]

I have been reading this thread for a while and intrigued by all the different views. I have one question for my christian brothers. Do ppl worship Chrsit out of love or out of fear for the devil or hell??

Reason being:
I speak to alot of young ppl about their views of spirituality and when they speak about their faith in Christianity they often say "they worship Chris because of fear of the devil or going to hell" Not in those exact words but it boils down to that. Please correct me if I am wrong........but aren't you suppose to worship God out of love and not out of fear of an "evil" entity??
Why is the general impression being that worship God out of fear.

"5:3 For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.

5:4 For whatsoever is born of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that overcometh the world, even our faith.

5:5 Who is he that overcometh the world, but he that believeth that Jesus is the Son of God? "1 John 5:3-5

[bluefete]

could god tell us who gonna win the world cup?

who god backin?

I am sure God knows.

[illumin@ti]

round and round we go again ,,,,

Bluefete,,, when will we get off this not-so-merry-go-round?

when asked for proof, you cant answer with faith

faith dont cut it in a court of law, how can it apply here.

Show me proof that the election result as per your thread title (5th iteration) is the will of god.

Answer me with proof, and not scripture quotes or allusions to biblical tales.

[bluefete]

why does jesus let the stray dogs suffer?

You eh easy nuh boy

Suffer from what?

[bluefete]

round and round we go again ,,,,

Bluefete,,, when will we get off this not-so-merry-go-round?

when asked for proof, you cant answer with faith

faith dont cut it in a court of law, how can it apply here.

Show me proof that the election result as per your thread title (5th iteration) is the will of god.

Answer me with proof, and not scripture quotes or allusions to biblical tales.

Kamla is the Prime Minister, not so? What more proof do you want?