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What is the PNM's plan for the economy?

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Re: What is the PNM's plan for the economy?

Postby Morpheus » January 9th, 2016, 9:37 am

ingalook wrote:Image


Haven't read his essays because of that.....

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Re: What is the PNM's plan for the economy?

Postby Trinispougla » January 9th, 2016, 11:13 am

desifemlove wrote:if there is no efforts at diversification in two years time, and not just plans like she said, but actual contracts, factories, businesses, then Dr.R has failed. not saying i'd want UNC back, but if she has good plans that she WILL implement not jus talk, then maybe.

the world economy is not weak, as this oil price ting won't affect everybody. for some countries, it's a boon, like in the USA, China and most of Europe. http://www.bbc.com/news/business-29643612

As of NOW, Dr. R should be looking for joint ventures, assembly plants, and the like and by 2020 we should be seen buildings going up or at the least contracts signed. doing what she and UNC didnt do but had five years to do!

Actually DL, the world economy seems to be tumbling towards another global recession. The fracking from shale energy produces and the accompanying supply glut is spilling over from oil countries to the rest of the world. This is coupled by the excellent interest rates the US federal reserve has in place making it the place to invest.

I'll give you an example. China is the world's largest consumer of oil but has or hasn't found any reserves of their own. Logically, they should be the biggest beneficiaries of low oil prices. But they are seeing not stagnation but retraction. Why? Because US interest rates have soared as they always do during an oil collapse. Technically, TT may not have to get out of the energy industry. Shale gas is found everywhere and the head of the geological society already stated that we probably have in the gulf. But what we do within that time which is about five to ten years is critical
Last edited by Trinispougla on January 9th, 2016, 11:55 am, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: What is the PNM's plan for the economy?

Postby Trinispougla » January 9th, 2016, 11:31 am

I also seriously doubt that an assembly line could work here. What is the sense, business sense specifically, when almost every multinational has a plant in Brazil which is right there. At one point even Sega had an assembly line in the country.

We as Trinidadians despite heavy industrialization have to recognize that we are very small fish in a huge capitalist pond. The same pond that allows Mosanto and Halliburton to starve people of the developing world while using their food to make bio-gas. This pond is not a fair pond. Nobody is going to say "oh gosh, Trinidad need our help, dih mind we have plants in Brazil and Argentina, its a social service". That idea is alien to multinationals. As I said, diversification should have taken place years ago when the going was good. Oil is no doubt going to take us through the slump but we really need to seriously, at least put suggestions on the table to diversify to at least do so when the money comes. But then again DL, you must recognize that diversification is heavily dependent on the political will and alignment as we saw with the smelter?

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Re: What is the PNM's plan for the economy?

Postby EmilioA » January 9th, 2016, 2:07 pm

Trinispougla wrote:Actually DL, the world economy seems to be tumbling towards another global recession. The fracking from shale energy produces and the accompanying supply glut is spilling over from oil countries to the rest of the world. This is coupled by the excellent interest rates the US federal reserve has in place making it the place to invest.

I'll give you an example. China is the world's largest consumer of oil but has or hasn't found any reserves of their own. Logically, they should be the biggest beneficiaries of low oil prices. But they are seeing not stagnation but retraction. Why? Because US interest rates have soared as they always do during an oil collapse. Technically, TT may not have to get out of the energy industry. Shale gas is found everywhere and the head of the geological society already stated that we probably have in the gulf. But what we do within that time which is about five to ten years is critical


. China is the world's largest consumer of oil but has or hasn't found any reserves of their own. [/size]


Say what !

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Petroleum ... y_in_China
and as of 2012 China was the world's fourth-greatest oil producer, domestic oil demand has increased even faster than production, so that China has been a net importer of petroleum since 1993,

China was the world's fourth-greatest oil producer,

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Re: What is the PNM's plan for the economy?

Postby Trinispougla » January 9th, 2016, 2:51 pm

China-Oil-Imports-by-Source-EIA.jpg
China-Oil-Imports-by-Source-EIA.jpg (30.11 KiB) Viewed 2904 times
Last edited by Trinispougla on January 9th, 2016, 2:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: What is the PNM's plan for the economy?

Postby desifemlove » January 9th, 2016, 2:52 pm

Trinispougla wrote:
desifemlove wrote:if there is no efforts at diversification in two years time, and not just plans like she said, but actual contracts, factories, businesses, then Dr.R has failed. not saying i'd want UNC back, but if she has good plans that she WILL implement not jus talk, then maybe.

the world economy is not weak, as this oil price ting won't affect everybody. for some countries, it's a boon, like in the USA, China and most of Europe. http://www.bbc.com/news/business-29643612

As of NOW, Dr. R should be looking for joint ventures, assembly plants, and the like and by 2020 we should be seen buildings going up or at the least contracts signed. doing what she and UNC didnt do but had five years to do!

Actually DL, the world economy seems to be tumbling towards another global recession. The fracking from shale energy produces and the accompanying supply glut is spilling over from oil countries to the rest of the world. This is coupled by the excellent interest rates the US federal reserve has in place making it the place to invest.

I'll give you an example. China is the world's largest consumer of oil but has or hasn't found any reserves of their own. Logically, they should be the biggest beneficiaries of low oil prices. But they are seeing not stagnation but retraction. Why? Because US interest rates have soared as they always do during an oil collapse. Technically, TT may not have to get out of the energy industry. Shale gas is found everywhere and the head of the geological society already stated that we probably have in the gulf. But what we do within that time which is about five to ten years is critical


then T&T will forever be in the same position.... If shale prices drop, then same fiscal issues.

to say it will be bad for all is not true...http://ec.europa.eu/economy_finance/ima ... prices.pdf

China's economy is slowing down due to many factors, one reason why the legalised two kids per family. Fact remains without diversification, T&T will always have these shocks. to say we cannot do much else is defeatist, and economic development ent all about size. Singapore is small. Luxembourg is small. again, you saying of all the industries out there, there's nothing T&T could get into. this ent how countries does progress, it requires thinking outside the box. it's countries that are diversified that will be least affected by this.

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Re: What is the PNM's plan for the economy?

Postby EmilioA » January 9th, 2016, 3:00 pm

Trinispougla wrote:
China-Oil-Imports-by-Source-EIA.jpg



Relevance ?

Do you think being an oil importer means a country has no oil reserves ? Cause that's what you wrote. No oil reserves. Not that China is a net importer. Big difference. Half of China's oil is domestic production.

That kind of sloppy fact checking undermines your reasoning.

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Re: What is the PNM's plan for the economy?

Postby Habit7 » January 9th, 2016, 3:06 pm

Trinispougla wrote:We as Trinidadians despite heavy industrialization have to recognize that we are very small fish in a huge capitalist pond. The same pond that allows Mosanto and Halliburton to starve people of the developing world while using their food to make bio-gas.

How Halliburton starving people?

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Re: What is the PNM's plan for the economy?

Postby Trinispougla » January 9th, 2016, 3:07 pm

There are things TT can get into of course. But now isn't the time and it will have to be practical, in a field that we can compete in. As I said, and several other commentators have and I think it's on the PNM's manifesto, turning TT into a financial capital. Singapore did not become tech savy in a short period of time. When Lee Quan Yu was rulin . Singapore was known as an excellent place to invest. And the money from that is how they funded their technological revolution. Singapore also has 700,000 more people than us so that is at least 80-100,000 more engineers, computer scientists, programmers, etc. Luxembourg is an excellent place to invest which is why, the world's largest steel producer , Ancelormittal, is headquaterd there.

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Re: What is the PNM's plan for the economy?

Postby Trinispougla » January 9th, 2016, 3:21 pm

EmilioA wrote:
Trinispougla wrote:Actually DL, the world economy seems to be tumbling towards another global recession. The fracking from shale energy produces and the accompanying supply glut is spilling over from oil countries to the rest of the world. This is coupled by the excellent interest rates the US federal reserve has in place making it the place to invest.

I'll give you an example. China is the world's largest consumer of oil but has or hasn't found any reserves of their own. Logically, they should be the biggest beneficiaries of low oil prices. But they are seeing not stagnation but retraction. Why? Because US interest rates have soared as they always do during an oil collapse. Technically, TT may not have to get out of the energy industry. Shale gas is found everywhere and the head of the geological society already stated that we probably have in the gulf. But what we do within that time which is about five to ten years is critical


. China is the world's largest consumer of oil but has or hasn't found any reserves of their own. [/size]


Say what !

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Petroleum ... y_in_China
and as of 2012 China was the world's fourth-greatest oil producer, domestic oil demand has increased even faster than production, so that China has been a net importer of petroleum since 1993,

China was the world's fourth-greatest oil producer,
[/quote
Out of the pie chary, only Iran has ceased exporting to Chiba since 2009 because of sanctions

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Re: What is the PNM's plan for the economy?

Postby Trinispougla » January 9th, 2016, 4:50 pm

EmilioA wrote:
Trinispougla wrote:
China-Oil-Imports-by-Source-EIA.jpg



Relevance ?

Do you think being an oil importer means a country has no oil reserves ? Cause that's what you wrote. No oil reserves. Not that China is a net importer. Big difference. Half of China's oil is domestic production.

That kind of sloppy fact checking undermines your reasoning.

No Emiliano. It has everything to do with the impending global recession. China is the largest buyers of industrial commodities. Because of US interest rates and the strategy of devaluing their own currency, they have slowed on imports. This has further decreased the price of oil owing to the fact that OPEC is selling less to the Chinese. The same thing has happened with gold and copper. Hence, I get back to my point. The situation is only good for the US boosted by shale oil and gas. For everybody else, its not good because the country most likely to buy your products is now in flux by choice or by circumstance

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Re: What is the PNM's plan for the economy?

Postby Habit7 » January 9th, 2016, 7:12 pm

Trinispougla wrote:Singapore also has 700,000 more people than us so that is at least 80-100,000 more engineers, computer scientists, programmers, etc.

Um... Singapore has a population of over 5 million ppl.

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Re: What is the PNM's plan for the economy?

Postby bluesclues » January 10th, 2016, 7:06 am

Trinispougla wrote:There are things TT can get into of course. But now isn't the time and it will have to be practical, in a field that we can compete in. As I said, and several other commentators have and I think it's on the PNM's manifesto, turning TT into a financial capital. Singapore did not become tech savy in a short period of time. When Lee Quan Yu was rulin . Singapore was known as an excellent place to invest. And the money from that is how they funded their technological revolution. Singapore also has 700,000 more people than us so that is at least 80-100,000 more engineers, computer scientists, programmers, etc. Luxembourg is an excellent place to invest which is why, the world's largest steel producer , Ancelormittal, is headquaterd there.


a lil out of the box thinking and we could very easily diversify with a very low initial cost with high return in at least 3 areas that i know off that will offer services on the international market. besides that, we can keep our energy sales somehwere near 4x current market price, increase roadway efficiency and start paying off the deficit within 2 years if my plans were to go into action NOW.

but allyuh din vote for ilp. ah did tell allyuh vote for ilp but allyuh want to go back and vote pnm so ah leave allyuh. ah could say tho.. that unc will be voted out of opposition in the next election. and pnm will go back to opposition just before they get vote out of that position too.

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Re: What is the PNM's plan for the economy?

Postby zoom rader » January 10th, 2016, 7:40 am

Well the PNM is pumping more tax payers into PAN and their Kalypso Revue tents which is known for anti indo songs. Expect more racist songs tobe pumped out by their mouth pieces.

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Re: What is the PNM's plan for the economy?

Postby EmilioA » January 10th, 2016, 11:34 am

Habit7 wrote:
Trinispougla wrote:Singapore also has 700,000 more people than us so that is at least 80-100,000 more engineers, computer scientists, programmers, etc.

Um... Singapore has a population of over 5 million ppl.


More sloppy fact checking.

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Re: What is the PNM's plan for the economy?

Postby De Dragon » January 10th, 2016, 12:12 pm

Redman wrote:The upside is in what was said beyond your choice of focus.

That there is a stated intention to increase collections

So collecting a higher proportion of a 12.5% tax....is certainly better than leaving a 15% tax uncollected.
Isn't it a given that making compliance easier and cheaper improves collection?

Your PoV is valid but lopsided by not taking into account of the whole strategy.

Why not try to improve the collection of existing VAT? If there is a plan to improve the lower VAT, then it should be implemented to the present VAT level first.

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Re: What is the PNM's plan for the economy?

Postby Redman » January 10th, 2016, 12:57 pm

so what you saying is you prefer to continue paying the higher taxes until govt gets its sheit together?
yes/no answer please.


I have no issue really with paying less NOW and the onus being on govt to improve its internal inefficiencies.

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Re: What is the PNM's plan for the economy?

Postby 1UZFE » January 10th, 2016, 1:47 pm

Good point Dragon. Too much doubles men, mini mart owners, taxi/maxi owners etc escaping taxes. If there is more emphasis placed on collection of over due taxes then a better picture of the economy can be seen.
Too much persons escaping..

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Re: What is the PNM's plan for the economy?

Postby zoom rader » January 10th, 2016, 2:21 pm

1UZFE wrote:Good point Dragon. Too much doubles men, mini mart owners, taxi/maxi owners etc escaping taxes. If there is more emphasis placed on collection of over due taxes then a better picture of the economy can be seen.
Too much persons escaping..



dem is small fry, its the big government financiers that evade the most taxes

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Re: What is the PNM's plan for the economy?

Postby De Dragon » January 10th, 2016, 3:58 pm

Redman wrote:so what you saying is you prefer to continue paying the higher taxes until govt gets its sheit together?
yes/no answer please.


I have no issue really with paying less NOW and the onus being on govt to improve its internal inefficiencies.


Therein lies the problem, they can't manage the existing system, yet looking to make everything VATable but with no articulated means to make collection of VAT more efficient.

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Re: What is the PNM's plan for the economy?

Postby Redman » January 10th, 2016, 4:17 pm

Not articulated means it doesn't exist?

You are stating that because YOU don't know it doesn't exist...

While you might be right...I think in this case its unlikely.

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Re: What is the PNM's plan for the economy?

Postby De Dragon » January 10th, 2016, 5:38 pm

Redman wrote:Not articulated means it doesn't exist?

You are stating that because YOU don't know it doesn't exist...

While you might be right...I think in this case its unlikely.

So what's the big secret then? When you don't say, people will speculate, and most times the speculation in not kind to the Gov't.

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Re: What is the PNM's plan for the economy?

Postby Redman » January 10th, 2016, 9:20 pm

I agree with you...there is a real lack of guidance....whether this is by design...(I hope)....or because they really don't have any idea where to begin...remains to be seen.

Really we have become accustomed to an over dose of noise from the govt...where everything was a press release...or a pre action protocol letter...the concept of the political directorate just shutting the fack up and doing their job isn't an UN welcome one.

Frankly in 10 years we will be around...and the country probably will not be in a mess...the world will turn.

What we as a people need to do is pretend oil is back at 150..tomorrow and .determine what issues will still remain unresolved..regardless of whether we have money or not....and focus on those issues.
The price of oil isn't a reason to ignore those issues....as happened in the past.

IMHO...if we as a people wait on govt to tell us what we need to do....then we in a real mess...regardless of where oil is.

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Re: What is the PNM's plan for the economy?

Postby zoom rader » January 11th, 2016, 2:22 am

People are beginning to understand that they made a huge mistake putting this government in power.

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Re: What is the PNM's plan for the economy?

Postby src1983 » January 11th, 2016, 7:55 am

VAT list coming out today. Let's see what happens

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Re: What is the PNM's plan for the economy?

Postby desifemlove » January 11th, 2016, 7:55 am

kams would have done no different in a second term. and then say "we having issues" despite Howai saying we ent in no recession. "UNCKamslogic

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Re: What is the PNM's plan for the economy?

Postby Habit7 » January 11th, 2016, 12:21 pm



The only difference is we have a refinery and petrochemical industries. But our diversification into aluminium and aluminium products was shafted. Now we just had 4 years of some of the highest oil prices ever and now 2 years of growing debt.

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Re: What is the PNM's plan for the economy?

Postby Allergic2BunnyEars » January 11th, 2016, 5:54 pm

ImageUploadedByTapatalk1452549267.152673.jpg

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Re: What is the PNM's plan for the economy?

Postby eliteauto » January 11th, 2016, 5:55 pm


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Re: What is the PNM's plan for the economy?

Postby bluesclues » January 11th, 2016, 6:40 pm



chick peas and flour aint raise. price of doubles unaffected.

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