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Caribbean Airline aircraft crashes in Guyana!

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NorStar2K
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Re: Caribbean Airline aircraft crashes in Guyana!

Postby NorStar2K » August 1st, 2011, 1:41 pm

© Copyright 2011 The International Business Times Inc.

Strange Guyana Crash May Have Happened Because of Poor Visibility

Aug 01, 2011 09:03 AM EDT

Poor visibility resulting from rainfall may have caused a bizarre crash in Guyana on Saturday, officials have said.

Trinidadian Prime Minister Kamla Persad-Bissessar told the Trinidad Express that she was advised that the crash happened because of low visibility because of the rainfall. She also said decisions were made that if the airplane couldn't safely land then it would return to Trinidad, according to the Trinidad Express.

However, the plane crash-landed in Guyana on Saturday with 163 people board. No one was injured.

The Boeing 737-800 jet, which was coming from New York, overshot the rainy runway at the Cheddi Jagan International Airport after arriving in Georgetown, and broke apart. The landing cause several injuries.

"It was miraculous what happened because not a life was lost, not a fatality," Persad-Bissessar said after returning from Guyana, according to the Trinidad Express. She flew to the Guyana on Saturday to see the damage and meet the injured crew and passengers .

The Trinidadian pilot Fareed Dean reportedly told relatives that that the crash did happen because of poor visibility from the heavy rainfall.

Guyana's Stabroek News reported that the 52-year-old pilot was traumatized by the incident and suffered injuries to his legs also.

Dean reportedly said the runway had poor lighting, which contributed to the poor visibility when he tried to land the airplane around1:32 a.m. on Saturday. Dean along with his co-pilot and crew members are expected to receive professional counseling, according to Stabroek News.

In the meantime, an investigation into the crash is expected to begin with Guyana's Civil Aviation Authority taking the lead.

The U.S. National Transportation Safety Board and the Trinidad and Tobago Civil Aviation Authority help the Guyanese officials with the investigation, according to Bloomberg.

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Re: Caribbean Airline aircraft crashes in Guyana!

Postby Seeker » August 1st, 2011, 2:08 pm

Cant wait to the see the NTSB report on this one.

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Re: Caribbean Airline aircraft crashes in Guyana!

Postby S_2NR » August 1st, 2011, 2:10 pm

so the flaps weren't extended...interesting..
and the pilot saying he crashed because of poor visibility is a poor excuse.. he should be fired.
pilots are trained to fly solely using instruments when at flight school, or he did he "buy" his pilot license..

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Re: Caribbean Airline aircraft crashes in Guyana!

Postby Kiro_lee » August 1st, 2011, 2:18 pm


Kamla say "doh touch nutten"
Bharath say "Fcuk u biachh"

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Re: Caribbean Airline aircraft crashes in Guyana!

Postby Seeker » August 1st, 2011, 2:29 pm

Kiro_lee wrote:
Kamla say "doh touch nutten"
Bharath say "Fcuk u biachh"

Heh...well look that.

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Re: Caribbean Airline aircraft crashes in Guyana!

Postby Stephon. » August 1st, 2011, 2:40 pm

Eh Kamla, how yuh go tell d man doh touch nothin
well he touch a button doe! your move!

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Re: Caribbean Airline aircraft crashes in Guyana!

Postby NorStar2K » August 1st, 2011, 2:44 pm

ATIL wrote:This was two years ago

Aviation safety rating points to local deficiencies

By Stabroek staff | 14 Comments | Local News | Tuesday, July 21, 2009 Updated: 11:10 am

Guyana has been rated a Category 2 under the International Aviation Safety Assessment (IASA) programme, which means that it does not comply with International Civil Aviation Organisation (ICAO) standards.

Guyana is among countries such as Bangladesh, Cote D’Ivoire, Croatia, Ghana and Indonesia, which are rated as Category 2 countries. This was in last year’s assessment which was issued on December 18.

The United States Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) established the IASA programme through public policy in August 1992. FAA’s foreign assessment programme focuses on a country’s ability, not the individual air carrier, to adhere to international standards and recommended practices for aircraft operations and maintenance established by the United Nation’s technical agency for aviation, the ICAO.

Contacted for comment last evening, Transport Minister Robeson Benn said that he was in a meeting.

For those countries rated under Category 2, it means that the FAA has “assessed this country’s civil aviation authority (CAA) and determined that it does not provide safety oversight of its air carrier operators in accordance with the minimum safety oversight standards established by the ICAO.”

According to the FAA’s website, this rating is applied if one or more of the following deficiencies are identified: 1) The country lacks laws or regulations necessary to support the certification and oversight of air carriers in accordance with minimum international standards; 2) the CAA lacks the technical expertise, resources, and organization to license or oversee air carrier operations; 3) the CAA does not have adequately trained and qualified technical personnel; 4) the CAA does not provide adequate inspector guidance to ensure enforcement of, and compliance with, minimum international standards, and (5) the CAA has insufficient documentation and records of certification and inadequate continuing oversight and surveillance of air carrier operations.

Recently there have been several incidents in the local aviation sector. The most recent was the July 5 near miss involving a LIAT aircraft which was inbound to the Cheddi Jagan International Airport (CJIA), Timehri and a Learjet which had minutes earlier departed the airport for Jamaica. Reports are that around 2 pm that day, the LIAT aircraft was proceeding to CJIA when it came within hundreds of feet of the Learjet. The Guyana Civil Aviation Authority (GCAA) has launched an investigation into that incident.

In addition, there have been calls over the years, which have grown urgent recently, for an upgrade of the air traffic control systems at the CJIA.

Calls have come from air traffic controllers as well as the Aircraft Owners Associa-tion of Guyana.

Concerns had been raised about the airport’s navigational aids including the Instrument Landing System (ILS), the Non Directional Beacon (NDB), Distance Measuring Equipment (DME) and the Automatic Distance Finder (ADF).


Meantime, according to the FAA, Category 2 consists of two groups of countries. One group consists of countries that have air carriers with existing operations to the United States at the time of the assessment.

While in Category 2 status, carriers from these countries will be permitted to continue operations at current levels under heightened FAA surveillance. Expansion or changes in services to the United States by such carriers are not permitted while in category 2, although new services will be permitted if operated using aircraft wet-leased from a duly authorized and properly supervised US carrier or a foreign air carrier from a category 1 country that is authorized to serve the United States using its own aircraft.

The second group is countries that do not have air carriers with existing operations to the United States at the time of the assessment. Carriers from these countries will not be permitted to commence service to the United States while in Category 2 status, although they may conduct services if operated using aircraft wet-leased from a duly authorized and properly supervised US carrier or a foreign air carrier from a Category 1 country that is authorized to serve the United States with its own aircraft. There is no other difference between the two groups of countries while in a Category 2 status.

http://www.stabroeknews.com/2009/news/s ... iciencies/

If that was the circumstances in this case, it would certainly have made an IFR approach extremely difficult. Thus manually flying ILS approach in IFR conditions.
The most difficulty encountered in controlling an aircraft manually using just instrument references is 'chasing the needles' where over controlling the aircraft occurs.

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Re: Caribbean Airline aircraft crashes in Guyana!

Postby S_2NR » August 1st, 2011, 2:45 pm

kamla tellin d man what to do in the country he runnin..she is really a kant yes.

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Re: Caribbean Airline aircraft crashes in Guyana!

Postby JJ16 » August 1st, 2011, 2:47 pm

so what the pilot saying (dean) is that this airport has poor lighting....so how come, plane landing there long time now and never crash....wam, the airport was trying set a sexy mood by dimming the lights or wha :|

and yea, i still tryna figure out what kamala and all of them went guyana for in the first place.....she probably concerned about the ...Peeepollll..... :|

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Re: Caribbean Airline aircraft crashes in Guyana!

Postby NorStar2K » August 1st, 2011, 3:06 pm

Image

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Re: Caribbean Airline aircraft crashes in Guyana!

Postby S_2NR » August 1st, 2011, 3:08 pm

norstar2k..are u a pilot? thats my dream job!

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Re: Caribbean Airline aircraft crashes in Guyana!

Postby JJ16 » August 1st, 2011, 3:11 pm

well follow uh dreams na... :|

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Re: Caribbean Airline aircraft crashes in Guyana!

Postby bluefete » August 1st, 2011, 3:28 pm

Ignorant Ignis wrote:
Jack the Ripper wrote:
Image

Still can't see any ravine...


it's a cliff..... and u can see where it goes down hill in this picture.....

if the plane went over the cliff everyone would have died


Thanks Jack for the pic.

IgIg - The cliff seems to be beyond the "thingie" that looks like scaffolding. I am just estimating here.

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Re: Caribbean Airline aircraft crashes in Guyana!

Postby Aaron 2NR » August 1st, 2011, 3:38 pm

yep seem that way

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Re: Caribbean Airline aircraft crashes in Guyana!

Postby cherrypopper » August 1st, 2011, 3:42 pm

buck on board...

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Re: Caribbean Airline aircraft crashes in Guyana!

Postby S_2NR » August 1st, 2011, 3:46 pm

JJ16 wrote:well follow uh dreams na... :|


:lol: :lol:
easier said than done.
from what i understand being a commercial pilot is a tough career

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Re: Caribbean Airline aircraft crashes in Guyana!

Postby cherrypopper » August 1st, 2011, 6:09 pm

reporter says:
werent you trained to use your instruments in flight school ? or your windshield wipers?

did you give a hand signal to the other planes that you were slowing down
??

did you top up your bmobile the first day of the month to receive your free credit?

answer me dean...

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Re: Caribbean Airline aircraft crashes in Guyana!

Postby Habit7 » August 1st, 2011, 7:29 pm

r3iXmann wrote:
Habit7 wrote:MKJP


how so? the only issue i can see there is if the plane falls short of the runway

Exactly!
RWY 30 will send you into the sea and RWY 12 will make you cross a fairly busy road (the AA flight was fortunate because it was late at night.

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Re: Caribbean Airline aircraft crashes in Guyana!

Postby NorStar2K » August 1st, 2011, 8:46 pm

This incident is surely going to cause (I hope) many Caribbean nations to revisit their respective crisis/emergency response plans for managing such/similar aviation related incidents/accidents.

The Piarco Airport Drill that was cancelled twice so far this year will certainly be back on stream ASAP. The ANR Robinson International Airport drill will follow soon after.

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Re: Caribbean Airline aircraft crashes in Guyana!

Postby Team Loco » August 1st, 2011, 8:53 pm

Kamla should not have gone to Guyana. this is why we have a transport minister. plus there was already a minister across in guyana. in her capacity of prime minister, her only responsibility should have been to sit at her desk and ask for a report.
her simple act of going to guyana and uttering the ill timed words "and remember ii am a lawyer" has insulted the president of guyana. she needs to understand this is a tense situation and politicians getting involved will only make it worse. let the NTSB do their work

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Re: Caribbean Airline aircraft crashes in Guyana!

Postby Seeker » August 1st, 2011, 11:22 pm

pioneer wrote:
Team Loco wrote:Kamla should not have gone to Guyana. this is why we have a transport minister. plus there was already a minister across in guyana. in her capacity of prime minister, her only responsibility should have been to sit at her desk and ask for a report.
her simple act of going to guyana and uttering the ill timed words "and remember ii am a lawyer" has insulted the president of guyana. she needs to understand this is a tense situation and politicians getting involved will only make it worse. let the NTSB do their work


It's all a pappyshow to dem, look at me...i care

X2

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Re: Caribbean Airline aircraft crashes in Guyana!

Postby JJ16 » August 1st, 2011, 11:33 pm

Seeker wrote:
pioneer wrote:
Team Loco wrote:Kamla should not have gone to Guyana. this is why we have a transport minister. plus there was already a minister across in guyana. in her capacity of prime minister, her only responsibility should have been to sit at her desk and ask for a report.
her simple act of going to guyana and uttering the ill timed words "and remember ii am a lawyer" has insulted the president of guyana. she needs to understand this is a tense situation and politicians getting involved will only make it worse. let the NTSB do their work


It's all a pappyshow to dem, look at me...i care

X2



i agree, sometimes i think its more of a publicity thing. Like if publicity is first and actually acting in the best interest of trinidad and tobago is second on the list...Whoever writes her speeches needs to check themselves, lets not forget when she said, Trinidad and Tobago isn't an ATM machine >...i mean, you hadda be sensitive in tense situations.

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Re: Caribbean Airline aircraft crashes in Guyana!

Postby rfari » August 2nd, 2011, 12:35 am

Kiro_lee wrote:
Kamla say "doh touch nutten"
Bharath say "Fcuk u biachh"

jagdeo is ah c.unt orrr? boss lady make sense when she say doh touch de mc plane and he wha play he bring up safety talk and disrespecting we pm? he playin mad orr? wha obstructing runway he talking bout? de fackin plane park up outside. daz nah obstructing anybody. he act like plane does turn around dey. mc.

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Re: Caribbean Airline aircraft crashes in Guyana!

Postby zcarz » August 2nd, 2011, 12:58 am

rfari wrote:
Kiro_lee wrote:
Kamla say "doh touch nutten"
Bharath say "Fcuk u biachh"

jagdeo is ah c.unt orrr? boss lady make sense when she say doh touch de mc plane and he wha play he bring up safety talk and disrespecting we pm? he playin mad orr? wha obstructing runway he talking bout? de fackin plane park up outside. daz nah obstructing anybody. he act like plane does turn around dey. mc.

Not really, the man have sense, but I do believe it should be left up to the safety officials to say what should be the next move, the decision is not hers to make since she doesn't have control over the airport. Aviation law is a complicated specialization that requires extensive knowledge to practise. I believe that the NTSB has already concurred that it is safe to remove the tail.

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Re: Caribbean Airline aircraft crashes in Guyana!

Postby rfari » August 2nd, 2011, 1:06 am

kamla run ting, ting nah run she.
jagdeo ever giwwe back we turbine pumps we did lend dem when dey flood out? i doubt buh he wha play he giving kamla chat.

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Re: Caribbean Airline aircraft crashes in Guyana!

Postby zcarz » August 2nd, 2011, 1:17 am

rfari wrote:kamla run ting, ting nah run she.
jagdeo ever giwwe back we turbine pumps we did lend dem when dey flood out? i doubt buh he wha play he giving kamla chat.

:? ok then

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Re: Caribbean Airline aircraft crashes in Guyana!

Postby Mudboy » August 2nd, 2011, 4:17 am

Jack the Ripper wrote:
Habit7 wrote:
jehusaunders wrote:well i think what happen was either two things
1- pilot forgot to extend flaps to proper angle
or 2- when pilot realised "AYYY this plan cyah stop... "he retract the flaps to try to take back off and to try to try to land again later

1- from what we see the flaps wasn't extended at all, however the GPWS would be screaming "FLAPS"
2-In at attempt to retract the flaps from 40 to 5 in a rejected take off, he could have reduce it to 0, oops :oops:

ROFL @ ''AYYY this plan cyah stop...''

However, does anyone know how long it takes to retract from 40 to 0 (or 5) It takes about 2 minutes to EXTEND from 0 to 15...Looking at the flap lever it looks like it'd be easy to go from 40 to 0 in a hurry (or by mistake), you'd have to shift the lever to the right, get the pin out of the notch, shift the lever forward to the desired setting and then shift to the left to engage the pin back into the groove...

Image

I can't really imagine an experienced flight crew making this mistake but I guess on a wet runway at night and you're running out of runway it would be possible.

That being said, if they did reject the landing and tried to go around, why do the pics show both engines still in reverse thrust positions? :roll:

Thank God no lives were lost and strangely enough, Capt Dean flew me to JFK just a couple days before...


Captain Dean needs to check his eyes.......an his ego

and what a shame to be calling that an International Airport...we does try to drag race on spray plane runway like that.....

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Re: Caribbean Airline aircraft crashes in Guyana!

Postby Aaron 2NR » August 2nd, 2011, 5:02 am

^ in ah guyanese dialect......


" we need get ah talla runway"

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Re: Caribbean Airline aircraft crashes in Guyana!

Postby Team Loco » August 2nd, 2011, 6:33 am

i still laughing at the woman who say 'she foot buss way" lol

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Re: Caribbean Airline aircraft crashes in Guyana!

Postby Aaron 2NR » August 2nd, 2011, 6:46 am

who that , the big skin gyul?

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