The Religion Discussion

[Duane 3NE 2NR]

12. It is the Will of GOD that the above post hit the top of this page as I certainly did not intend it and every thing that happens that we don't have direct control of does so by HIS (Universal) WILL.

Everything that exist and happens does so by the Will of Allah! There is a good reason for such....you may or may not see it, but it is there...

so what is the purpose of fighting for land in Palestine? if it is the will of Allah for the Jews to occupy it as they do.

[i am an idiot]

Don't look at the unfounded criticism of the evil, godless, materialistic, greedy, "western" society.

Bro i work for devout muslims, they are everything u said above, that is religion to make u believe.

They goin mosque everyday, prayin all in d office, n dey are the most dishonest people i know. They just made d hajj ting too. So daiz to give you ah idea of how "devout" they are.

What people sow they will reap. I don't deny that some people are like that but that does not mean that the religion teaches dishonesty.

But then again, you could be bashing them unjustly...

They actually tell me to lie too, i informed them one time, that honesty is one of d reasons i have advanced in my career, and it never pays to lie to a customer. They actually asked me to come work for them and offered me better compensation than my previous employers. I do not tolerate dishonesty...at all.

I would not have bashed them if they were not dishonest.
I know alot of other muslims as well. Along with people of other religions. To me it shows that the people who follow these religions don't truly find what their human nature desires from it. These desires for me personally are, hope, stability, security, life, peace of mind and true happiness.

[New_SPECIES]

12. It is the Will of GOD that the above post hit the top of this page as I certainly did not intend it and every thing that happens that we don't have direct control of does so by HIS (Universal) WILL.

Everything that exist and happens does so by the Will of Allah! There is a good reason for such....you may or may not see it, but it is there...

so what is the purpose of fighting for land in Palestine? if it is the will of Allah for the Jews to occupy it as they do.

God says in the Holy Quran in Chapter 67 Surah Al Mulk verse 2:
“He (God) created death and life that He may test you, to see which of you is the best in deeds.”

God Says in the Holy Quran Chapter 21 Surah Anbiyaa verse 35:
“Every soul shall have a taste of death: and We test you by evil and by good (only) by way of trial: to Us must ye return.”

The All-Knowing, All-Wise Lord bestowed two things upon His best creation (ie. mankind) and thus put mankind to a test:

1. Intelligence or the Power of Reasoning
2. A 'free will' for a limited period of one life-time to choose whatever path one wishes to live his life.

Whoever amongst man studies and ponders over the innumerable wonders and Signs in the various creations of the Majestic Lord, and uses his bestowed intelligence and power of reasoning to understand his mission of creation, recognize His Supreme Lord and Creator, and of his own 'free will' chooses to submit his will to the Will of his Creator, and chooses to live his life in accordance with the guidance of his Creator, passes the test of life and is promised the Eternal Mercy, Grace, and Rewards of God.

And whoever amongst man uses his bestowed intelligence and power of reasoning to do everything else but does not recognize or denies his Supreme Creator, refuses to submit his will to the Will of His Creator, and of his own 'free will' chooses to live his life in accordance with any guidance other than that of His Supreme Creator, miserably fails the test of life and will have a severe accounting in the Presence of His All-Mighty and Majestic Lord on an Inevitable Day.

Thus, only for the test period of this one short and transitory life....if one, of one's bestowed limited free will, chooses to submit one's will to the Will of their Creator and do good....The Lord Most Gracious not only allows and permits the person to do the good he wills, He is Pleased with the deeds of his believing slave.

But if one, of one's own free will chooses to deny, reject, and disobey the Lord....for the period of this one short transitory life, and only to fulfill the covenant of this 'test'...the Lord allows and permits the person to do his bidding, but the Lord is not pleased with the actions of this evil and ungrateful person.

Thus, for the period of this one 'test', the Lord allows each amongst man to their bidding and fulfill their 'trial' period. For the limited period of this 'test', He neither forces nor encourages one who wills to do good to do more good; nor does He coerce or discourage the one who wills to do evil to abstain from his evil. ....ultimately they will all be gathered unto His Majestic Presence to give a full accounting of their deeds; and it is only then, on that Tumultuous Day of Judgment in the Hereafter, when the one who believed and did good will be rewarded with good, and the one who disbelieved and did evil will have to pay full retribution for his evil.


If we relate to a simple worldly example, the point should be made clearer:

Lets say there is a school and the teacher spent the whole year teaching a course to its many students. At the end of the year, the students are put to a 'test'.

There was a student who gave the course the importance it deserved, always attended his classes and his lectures, paid full attention to the lectures, always did his daily homework.....for he knew with absolute conviction that at the end of the course there would be a test and the results of this test would determine his future.

Then there was another student, 'jolly-good' 'happy-go-lucky', 'cool-dude', 'cross-the-bridges-when-we-get-there' type of fellow; never gave the course the importance it deserved, hardly attended class if any, engaged himself in everything except the course.......he knew there would be a 'test' but figured something somehow someone would save him if perchance he failed the test!

During the test, the teacher happened to stand behind and overlook the good student giving the test and saw him writing all the right answers to the questions on the test. In maintaining the sanctity of the test, the teacher neither applauded, nor encouraged, nor patted the student on the back for writing the correct answers; and allowed the student to finish his prescribed test....but the teacher is pleased and satisfied with the efforts of this good student.

The teacher then stood behind that evil student giving the test and noticed that the 'cool-dude' was not so 'cool' anymore....he didn't even have a clue regarding the questions, leave alone the answers....but the student was merrily chewing his gum, whistling away, writing songs and drawing cartons, etc.....In keeping the sanctity of the test, the teacher neither stopped him, nor corrected his errors, nor discouraged him from giving his test in the manner the student willed.....but the teacher was not at all pleased nor happy with the 'casual' efforts of this evil student.

The teacher, if he so willed, could very well have encouraged the good student to continue his good, and had the teacher willed, he could have stopped or discouraged or even corrected the evil student from doing his evil....but that would violate the very sanctity of the 'test'; thus he permitted each of his students to do as they thought right, but he was mighty pleased with the efforts of one, and utterly displeased and disappointed with the efforts of the other!

Similarly, although absolutely everything that happens in the Universe can only happen only with the Precise Will and Permission of the Lord Most Majestic....He allows and permits for the period of this one 'trial'...... those who wish to do good to continue their good, and those who wish to do evil to continue their evil. Thus both good and evil can and only happen with the Permission and Will of the Lord, but He is Pleased with the doers of good, and He is Displeased with the doers of evil.

God Says in the Holy Quran Chapter 79 Surah Naziat verses 35-41:

35 The Day when Man shall remember (all) that he strove for
36 And Hell-Fire shall be placed in full view for (all) to see
37 Then for such as had transgressed all bounds
38 And had preferred the life of this world
39 Their Abode will be Hell-Fire;
40 And for such as had entertained the fear of standing before their Lord's (Tribunal), and had restrained (their) soul from lower desires;
41 Their abode will be the Garden.

If one trusts, obeys, and follows the guidance and commands of God and His Messengers, one can be assured of never ever being misled; but if one believes, obeys and follows any other guidance, other than that of God and His Messengers, one can be assured of being led astray.

[Duane 3NE 2NR]

^ was that in response to my question?

[Habit7]

.lol.

[New_SPECIES]

^ was that in response to my question?

Well based on your question... it seems as though you are a bit unsure as to what “God’s Will” actually is and what is meant by:
“Everything that exist and happens does so by the Will of God”

So I proceeded to give an explanation (from one side of the argument) for the quotations (that I just highlighted)...

Not sure if will qualify to you as a response but, like I said...

It’s just a belief and represents one side of the various views.

[i am an idiot]

Your response was utter bull$hit..........@ new species.

In short if u say allah's will is always done, den there should be no reason to go out n fight for the land in palestine. Won't allah's way come to fruition anyway?

Allyuh must read and answer accordingly. I only seeing alot of lengthy responses that totally void in relavance to the discussion.

[New_SPECIES]

Your response was utter bull$hit..........@ new species.

In short if u say allah's will is always done, den there should be no reason to go out n fight for the land in palestine. Won't allah's way come to fruition anyway?

Allyuh must read and answer accordingly. I only seeing alot of lengthy responses that totally void in relavance to the discussion.

I guess u live up to your name again!
If you really wanted to understand.. you would have.
The “wordly example” that I made comparison to, would clearly explain how “God’s Will” works according to one belief...

But then...based on all your past posts.. I know for a fact that u are jus trolling this thread rather than having any meaningful points to add.
You never read any of the past posts, but jump in and start the "questioning" all over again.

Trolling Example:

Lol. I watchin dese two fellas argue so long. Is like puppets on a string.
He was rite on que.

But I read beyond words and will not be of entertainment for you, as others may have been.

[i am an idiot]

Your response did not answer the question. Otherwise i would have understood.
Why u tink d man ask u if dat was ur response?
Because it wasn't wat he asked.
Yuh check.

[AdamB]

Also my friend. I don't think those are your own words or thoughts. I think they are pasted from a certain pro Islamic site.

Thanks for the compliment as they are not. Google it and see. I quoted verses 9-25 of Ch18 of the Quran and posted a link to tafsir (explanation) of Ibn Kathir.

[AdamB]

In short if u say allah's will is always done, den there should be no reason to go out n fight for the land in palestine. Won't allah's way come to fruition anyway?

There are 2 types, legislative will which comprise the laws for man (and jinn) to follow. It may occur or it may not occur, depends on the choice made like worshipping Allah 5 times a day or giving of compulsory annual charity.

The 2nd type is the universal will which always occurs. This we have no control over. It could change with time or whenever Allah wills to do so.

Allah created the hellfire and Satan, HE does not love Satan and what he does but he allows this, like the Hellfire, for a WISDOM. Everything HE does comprises KNOWLEDGE, WISDOM and JUSTICE!!

When you apply the above to Israel and Palestine. HE allows the Jews to continue with their evil actions and oppression...for a limited time...so that they lead themselves astray, earning the wrath of Allah, HIS punishment later on when the recompense will be established. What excuse would then then have? They were given a home after severe persecution in Europe (Germany). They could have shown grattitude and lived in peace with their neighbours but no, like Pinky and the Brain, they want to take over the world. HOW BOLD THEY ARE!

As for the Palestinians, they need to show patience like the people of Moses under the rule of the Pharoah. They are being tested, with their lives, wealth, etc. They need to hold on to their faith and religion, don't forget Allah, keep worshipping HIM, for the promise of Allah is true and everlasting.

[AdamB]

Hahaha. Ok I get it.

I see where this goes. Closed minded single religion thing. I'm done. I hate people like that who think only their religion is the best and try to push it onto others.

To you my friend. I don't think the world would be better with more religion. I think it would better if people listened to science a bit. Stop polluting, go green, recycle as well as treating people better, helping others, end racism, end religion or at least find a common ground so there is no argument, lower crime. That stuff is important to me. And don't go quoting away because that stuff doesn't necessitate religion.
And if there is a god. And I don't choose a religion but I follow these things, and live a good life why in the world am I not as good or better than the oh so religious to be accepted into whatever comes after.

GOD didn't create us to not have a purpose. HE didn't create us and just left us to roam / wander like zombies. HE sent down books, revealed to messengers and prophets, with laws, instructions, dos and don'ts.

Islam is the religion established by GOD through HIS final messenger to whom HE sent down HIS book, the Quran. I believe in the purity of this religion, that it has not been tampered with, and has maintained the correct concept of GOD. Unlike all other "religions" which have been tampered with, in one form or another. Some have made GOD into man, others want to make man into GOD. Hence, the reason for the establishment of Islam.

To answer your question underlined above: Faith (belief) comprises acceptance and submission. Your faith in something you profess is not complete until you submit to that which it calls you to, action not words.

We have been informed that the deeds of those who "do good" but do not have faith, have not submitted, will be like a mirage:

As for those who disbelieve, their deeds are like a mirage in a desert. The thirsty one thinks it to be water, until he comes up to it, he finds it to be nothing; but he finds Allah with him, Who will pay him his due (Hell). And Allah is Swift in taking account.
( سورة النور , An-Noor, Chapter #24, Verse #39)

[i am an idiot]

Allah created satan?

[marlener]

I am an idiot,it's either you are trolling or just being lazy.Again I would advise you to do a search within this same thread as most of the question you asked were discussed at length before. If however you prefer to be spoon fed I will answer you.The answer is yes.God created Satan. The answer to your next question most likely have already been answered right here as well.

[i am an idiot]

I nuh gonna search through all dat to find answers to questions. Ent allyuh answering. Lol. I work two jobs at 15 hours a day. I don't have time marlener.

[marlener]

Well people normally make time for things they consider important,I looked at your posting history on the page and assumed that you had some time on hand. Duane designed the site/page with a search bar. Still don`t just believe everything people say doublecheck for yourself. Remember life is about balance as well so.....

[ruffneck_12]

Satan is the one true god.

[VLDS]

Look man just fall off the other end yes. Smh

[AdamB]

Allah created satan?

Isn't that what I said? Satan is a jinn created from smokeless fire, not an angel (created from light) that has fallen like my christian brethren say. Angels do exactly as they are commanded. Jinns have free will just like mankind.

Read about the story in the Quran. Satan used to be in the company of the angels. When Allah created Adam HE commanded the angels (and Iblis, later Satan) to bow (of respect) to Adam. All of the angels did so because that's their nature. However, Iblis did not. Allah asked him why he didn't obey (it's not that Allah didn't know). Iblis said, "I was created from fire and he (Adam) from clay, I AM BETTER THAN HIM."

Satan has no power to challenge GOD (Allah) but rather Allah allows him to try to lead astray Allah's servants from among mankind by whispering to them suggesting evil desires. There's no war or rapture to come where you know who will come on a cloud to save ppl...all Nancy stories.

[maj. tom]

and yours isn't a Nancy story?

[AdamB]

and yours isn't a Nancy story?

No, not according to certain criteria.

Let me clarify what I meant. What I stated above, everyone knows, is the christian version of what will happen. Just like their creed of trinity, there is no basis FROM THE SCRIPTURE ITSELF that reasonably supports these "stories". From books with unknown or questionable authors, "preserved / corrected" with words put in to try to support the unfounded theories of the church.

Islam, our books of Quran and hadith, can take the criticism / acid test.

[ruffneck_12]

All Hail Satan.

I rebuke thee in the name of Jesus Christ.

Your god is weak and powerless.
ALL HAIL SATAN.

[i am an idiot]

Well people normally make time for things they consider important,I looked at your posting history on the page and assumed that you had some time on hand. Duane designed the site/page with a search bar. Still don`t just believe everything people say doublecheck for yourself. Remember life is about balance as well so.....

I don't consider this important.

[AdamB]

People don't realize how important the matter truly is.

As Gandalf The Grey said (in Lord of the Rings) before falling into the abyss,"RUN!!! YOU FOOLS."

[New_SPECIES]

Since we in the "Christmas Season" and this is a "Religion Discussion"...

Then I have a few interesting questions on Christmas;


Firstly, can the Christians explain their view on Christmas...

Is it really a "Religious" Holiday?

Is it really to celebrate the "birth" of Christ?

What date exactly, do Christians really believe that Jesus was born?

What does the Christmas Tree have to do with Christmas?


I am sure answers to these from the "educated ones" will be welcomed by all!

[Duane 3NE 2NR]

^ take a read
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christmas

Also
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christmas_tree

And
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Santa_Claus

[bluefete]

All Hail Satan.

I rebuke thee in the name of Jesus Christ.

Your god is weak and powerless.
ALL HAIL SATAN.

I rebuke thee again in the name of Jesus Christ.

Be very careful, my friend, that your own words do not fall back on you.

You know not what you are doing.

[New_SPECIES]

^ take a read
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christmas

Also
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christmas_tree

And
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Santa_Claus

I know info all over d net... But is wikipedia a Christian Site?
Is the explanations given on wikipedia the actual belief of Christians?

I want to hear from the Christians on this thread and what they actually believe/follow.
I want to understand what it means to them from a real Christian point of view.

Many say that it's based on Christ etc, well... we've heard arguments and defences about many other topics... so let's hear something about Christmas.

[bluefete]

What do you get when you re-arrange the word "Santa"?

[New_SPECIES]

What do you get when you re-arrange the word "Santa"?

Wasn't really askin bout Santa, especially since we all know that was Coca-Cola's mascot.

But Fete... ent you's a Christian?

Enlighten we nah.