On the subject of GATE

[death365]

Just to be Devils advocate... the persons who earn more money... pay more taxes. And doesn't get gate

So in sweet T&T is better to make less money

[Daran]

Just to be Devils advocate... the persons who earn more money... pay more taxes. And doesn't get gate

So in sweet T&T is better to make less money

Food card, HDC House, URP/CEPEP, lower or no income tax and now GATE just for you.

All this just to attempt to win you over from a life of crime. Clearly seems to be working.

[wavehunter]

People still going to beat this system because it seems to have loop holes.

If a regular family with two people working and children, male makes eight thousand and the female makes 10000, all they can say is now the female is ah home maker and but she still working. The income on the form they submit for their child will now show less than 10000.. How is the ministry going to verify people who now say they have one person in the family who is now a home maker ? Is BIR and ministry of education going to be linked to see who working and who not and what their total income going to be ?

Another loop hole is if a person who own a business and makes $20000 a month salary, it is not mandatory for a business person to pay themselves $20000 so they can now pay themselves $5000 a month which is less than the $10000 for 100% free. How is the ministry now going to determine who owns business and how much they were really making now dropped to less than $10000.

I am sure there are others but what you will start to see is less people in these programs because certain persons who used the system will start to drop out because they cant jump up around from program to program.

I did a diploma at a certain education institution in TNT and during my course, one student failed a course by a few marks and do you know they had to pass him because they were not offering the course anymore. How should that be possible !!!!!!

[X_Factor]

You will have to sign stating that info is true and correct, you really wanna open yourself up to serious fines and even prosecution IF they ever pick up on you?

[Joshie23]

Just to be Devils advocate... the persons who earn more money... pay more taxes. And doesn't get gate

So in sweet T&T is better to make less money

My sentiments exactly..how is it 'right', that I make more money..pay a boatload in taxes (I know people who have paid for their 5 years of tuition, with 1 year of PAYE) and still have to finance part of my degree?? And trust me, it's not about a 'dependency mentality' but to me, it seems somewhat counterproductive that I pay more in taxes and can't benefit from the system to which I contribute..ik the GoRTT is in a case of damned if you do, damned if you don't..but I can't seem to understand the rationale behind this logic..at least you can claim back some of your money when you file taxes for tertiary expenses..

[Daran]

Their logic is bad.

Especially with having such strict thresholds, I would hate to be making 11k month and have a couple kids to send to school.

They're several problems with tertiary education in Trinidad. Wastage and fly by night schools making millions of GATE which has devalued degrees.

GATE should revert to dollar for dollar. Can't afford that? Then offer a zero interest loan to those that they repay over a 10 year period after graduation. Still can't afford that? Then have a case by case Means Test requiring an essay and references.

[pete]

What about adults who aren't living with their parents and are going to school?

[De Dragon]

All incentives seem to be for the very rich, or the very poor. Lower to no taxes, State freeness etc. We're supposed to be encouraging people to better themselves by education and opportunity. This should apply to ALL citizens, not just a certain few.

[Daran]

All incentives seem to be for the very rich, or the very poor. Lower to no taxes, State freeness etc. We're supposed to be encouraging people to better themselves by education and opportunity. This should apply to ALL citizens, not just a certain few.

Well I'm not surprised, that is exactly who the PNM serves.

[X_Factor]

It was only a matter of time before this happened
we started a savings 1k a mth 1yr ago for my son and i strongly suggest any parent/s to do the same now

We will increase it when our mortgage is over but if it stays the same
after 17yrs it would barely touch 200k, add inflation 17yrs down the road, that would probably barely pay 1/3 the cost

[EFFECTIC DESIGNS]

Anybody here does watch those Judge Judy court cases? have you ever noticed how many people on that show admit to applying for student loans and using it to pay rent or buy rims for their cars etc? or use it to get the boyfriend out of jail? or waste it on some dotish degree thats meaningless and then stuck with bad credit unable to repay it and unable to ever find employment and end up flipping burgers? then Judy goes berserk on them and calls the Obama administration incompetent and stupid? and how right she always is.

No matter what you do, GATE or student loans, it seems like people and or businesses find a way to exploit the system. Normally I won't care if the money being wasted is in small numbers. But the GATE budget is massive, it was inevitable that this would happen. The corruption in the GATE system in this country goes so far down the latrine hole you all have no idea.

The only system thats impossible to exploit is dollar for dollar, Pandey was ahead of his time, if the government bring back dollar for dollar one would assume that the GATE budget would be reduced by half right? actually thats not true its even better the GATE budget would be reduced by 80%. Because then all the fly by night dotish degrees would disappear. And as an added bonus we will be able to stop employers from asking for degrees to fill positions that in reality only requires CXC or A levels, this will reduce our under employment levels and an even greater added bonus degrees will become more valued because there will be less of it on the market, basic supply and demand GATE has devalued degrees.

[Daran]

ED,

There are many control mechanisms you can use when giving loans. For example, just maybe make the Cheque out to the institution. If the loan covers living expenses as well then it's up to the individual to be responsible. Good life lesson.

Agree with your thoughts on dollar for dollar.

But combining both so that poorer students can use loans for living expenses would be ideal.

I know lots of people living deep east and far south who can't go UWI because they can't afford to pay rent and living expenses without working.

They can take students loans, but banks often need a guarantor which not everyone has.

To cover rent, living expenses and tution with dollar for dollar would cost $60k per year, so 180k over 3 years. A zero interest 10 year loan would only require a monthly payment of $1250/mo.

[zoom rader]

Nice Rowley brings back Massa Days for his people

[toyolink]

The out pouring of support for new gate facility model may be borne from;
-Relief that it could have been worse.
-Normal sentiment that students whose family have money don't deserve same level of assistance.
A deeper qualitative analysis of investments in education and the true meaning of equitable treatment of all may yield a completely different perspective.

[sMASH]

To sound a bit racist, long time Indian family estate financial policies will take back a hold. And hopefully , it will reach to a point they wouldn't need to access loans from banks.

[pugboy]

Those who claim they pay more taxes etc
Are just as guilty of the poor ppl entitlement syndrome

State Student funding should be based on academic performance and potential aptitude
Extracurricular included, just like big tertiary education systems around the world
No need to reinvent the wheel.

Prove that you can make use of the education first.

[greggle71]

I think the changes are reasonable, my only concern is the application of the means test, only from an equity standpoint. If a household has multiple children then there should be some kind of adjustment of the bands. Chances are that a home with siblings a few years apart there is a good likelyhood that both my be enrolled simultaneously in university at some point if my income is in the 25 contribution band that's actually 50 percent to pay.

Ideally in that circumstance some kind modification down to 35 to 40 percent for the two will ease the pressure for that year or two while both are enrolled.

[rspann]

When they are determining means , I feel they should take into consideration major ,unavoidable expenses? eg mortgages and rent , food bill etc. A lot of middle income earners like civil servants might make Ten to twenty thousand dollars monthly ,but car payments and mortgages eat up a large chunk. They also have to feed their families and clothe them ,how much disposable income does the average family actually have?

[rspann]

Pugboy is right on that last post, some of them who want gate, really just can't make the grade.

[JF.K]

What about adults who aren't living with their parents and are going to school?

This..
These are the people who will feel it the most.
Based on my experience in the tertiary arena, these were also the students who were most serious.

[desifemlove]

nothing wrong with those who earn more pay more.

if people lie on the means test, jail them.

[rspann]

Stuart Young said that today, you have to do a statutory declaration ,and if they catch you lying, they will deal with it.

[DVSTT]

"Deal with you"

[rspann]

Well yeah, but what you think they will deal with, the act of lying on the declaration or worse, go into your finances? because to prove you lied, they will have to know what you really making. This might cause a lot of people to hold back from making false declarations since they are more fearful of letting out their real worth.

[Redman]

last five year tax returns and pay slips.
That should be the starting request for the means test.

You want help...be compliant

[drchaos]

This is stupid ... Most people start tertiary education at 18. At 18 you are considered an adult and can have your own household.

What happens if my son lists himself as the head of his own household and declares his monthly income as $6000 a month (just say he cutting people lawn) that I give him as cash. He places his address at my sister in-law's house and claims he pays rent (which his aunt will back up). Looks legit on paper ...

Also who is going to investigate this to check up on his declarations which all look very legit. Trini's can't stop simple law breaking like littering, speeding (yet to caught), fraud, tax evasion, corruption and let me add the murder detection rate is a woeful 10%.

[cherrypopper]

Raise academic requirements to access gate. ..

Half of the class empty there.

[greggle71]

This is stupid ... Most people start tertiary education at 18. At 18 you are considered an adult and can have your own household.

What happens if my son lists himself as the head of his own household and declares his monthly income as $6000 a month (just say he cutting people lawn) that I give him as cash. He places his address at my sister in-law's house and claims he pays rent (which his aunt will back up). Looks legit on paper ...

Also who is going to investigate this to check up on his declarations which all look very legit. Trini's can't stop simple law breaking like littering, speeding (yet to caught), fraud, tax evasion, corruption and let me add the murder detection rate is a woeful 10%.

Just state the truth, if by August 2017 you can't plan from now then all the best to you.

Another example of trinis being trinis, finding fault with everything

[drchaos]

This is stupid ... Most people start tertiary education at 18. At 18 you are considered an adult and can have your own household.

What happens if my son lists himself as the head of his own household and declares his monthly income as $6000 a month (just say he cutting people lawn) that I give him as cash. He places his address at my sister in-law's house and claims he pays rent (which his aunt will back up). Looks legit on paper ...

Also who is going to investigate this to check up on his declarations which all look very legit. Trini's can't stop simple law breaking like littering, speeding (yet to caught), fraud, tax evasion, corruption and let me add the murder detection rate is a woeful 10%.

Just state the truth, if by August 2017 you can't plan from now then all the best to you.

Another example of trinis being trinis, finding fault with everything

Naive ...

[greggle71]

This is stupid ... Most people start tertiary education at 18. At 18 you are considered an adult and can have your own household.

What happens if my son lists himself as the head of his own household and declares his monthly income as $6000 a month (just say he cutting people lawn) that I give him as cash. He places his address at my sister in-law's house and claims he pays rent (which his aunt will back up). Looks legit on paper ...

Also who is going to investigate this to check up on his declarations which all look very legit. Trini's can't stop simple law breaking like littering, speeding (yet to caught), fraud, tax evasion, corruption and let me add the murder detection rate is a woeful 10%.

Just state the truth, if by August 2017 you can't plan from now then all the best to you.

Another example of trinis being trinis, finding fault with everything

Naive ...

No doubt there will attempts to exploit, no system is devoid of that. It will probably require a few cycles to get the model right