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The 3S-GTE performance thread!

It's all about 4AGE, NZE, 3SGTE, 1JZ, 2JZ etc.

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TESTED performance
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Postby TESTED performance » May 21st, 2009, 9:02 pm

Conrad both trac and mr gt4tified know that… they just being difficult. Toyotas are the same thing. The reason I was on gt4tified case is because he is one of the local toyota 3SGTE gurus and he has to realize and accept the responsibility and not make retarded statements like that one I quoted that can be misinterpreted by less knowledgeable tuners. Toyota fans desperately need role models as it is already. we don't need men who big in the business looking like they dunno what goin on.

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Postby gt4tified » May 21st, 2009, 10:12 pm

trd.sports.m,

Any EDUCATED, REAL tuner, knows (and uses) his terms correctly. If you were properly informed, you'd notice that I was responding to trdboy's comment that his blow off valve was in a mess. There are only three or so ppl who I know who run a recirculating setup, and he is not one.


But to satisfy your english, you want me to be more specific? Okay, fine......you should not be running an atmospheric bov on a genII 3sgte that still uses the AFM.

Now stop your backpeddling nonsense about "blanket term" blah blah. You need to go to back to the stomping ground a.k.a. mr2oc.com or alltrac.net and ask how many tuners there think that a blow-off valve is a generic term.

But why should you? You sold your 3s right? So do you really have any authority to still speak on the subject?

:roll:

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Postby Ricky99 » May 21st, 2009, 11:29 pm

trdboy wrote:i have the 2gen with the 3sge 2 wheel drive box......everyday driver, running 10psi, and believe it or not wukking good with super just reatrd the timing lil bit..

the waterpump thing will be fixed month end, i have decided to do it myself!! timing seems to be straightfwd...the only thing im not sure about is the tensioner

does the celica 3sgte carry the hydraulic tesioner like the mr2????

problems: i cant launch the car on boost i have to pet number one other wise is no traction at all... thinking bout the mr2 box and axles!!

downtime: none watsoever, this engine is a God sent.....almost 20 yrs old and just basic maintainace oil, plug and filter change on time!!!



why do you have to retard the timing a little bit? I'm getting a cold start problem and i'm using super.

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Postby AllTrac » May 22nd, 2009, 10:15 am

trd.sports.m wrote:
Anybody who can provide proof that the term "blow off valve" is not a blanket term and instead it relates SPECIFICALLY to relief valves that vent ONLY to the atmosphere, would be greatly appreciated. :roll:
(and people keep asking me why i no longer post on these forums...)



lol exactly what i expected :lol: Any real tuners who have put in wrench time when talking and making reference to a valve that vents to the atmosphere they refer to it as a BOV, when talking about one that reroutes they refer to it as a BPV or recirculating valve. Probably with you, you use it as a blanket term, i wanted to be specific, so thats why i referred to it as a BOV not recommended for a 2nd gen 3s. I realized you are hung up cause you refuse to admit Ralph is correct, so you start grabbing straws, put your differences aside and you would see the logic.


trd.sports.m wrote:
Also AND MORE IMPORTANTLY i would appreciate anybody who can provide evidence that the type of blow off valve that vents to the atmosphere has any SIGNIFICANT advantage over the recirculating type in terms of throttle response and turbo longevity(which are the only reasons the valve exists) in MAP sensor equipped engines.


Where did i say that the BOV has a significant advantage over a BPV in a map sensor engine? No one is taking about a BPV vs a BOV in a map sensor engine, you need to refine your searches in google. The topic is why a BOV is not recommended for a 2ND GEN AFM engine.BOV or BPV on a map sensor engine is NOT in the discussion. If you want to know what i think about it then, it doesnt matter if you go BPV or BOV on a map sensor engine as the air is metered after the throttle body by the intake manifold.

trd.sports.m wrote:The fact is that one type of valve was designed as an engineering solution to the problem of compressor surge and the other is a marketing device aimed at misinformed ricers who care more about perception than performance.


They both handle compressor surge, i kindda seeing where you are getting confused. Read my last response, i said " they difference to a BOV in the way it manages compressor surge. One releases it into the atmosphere(BOV) the other reroutes it back into intake track(BPV)"
Therein lies the problem when the BOV is added to a AFM 3s. From my experience and lots of true 2nrs who added a BOV to a AFM car, it caused idle problems and poor shifting. You cannot deny the logic of where the air is metered in an AFM engine and why the stalling and loss in performance occurs when you install a BOV on it. Its science. If you are denying that then its blatantly obvious that you rather mislead people cause of your petty differences. Once again, I never said one works better than the other in reducing compressor surge.

Furthermore no one here is looking for a role model. Its not a kindergarten, we all learn and share from our experiences. So if i see someone making tha]e same mistake as me i would try to save them the hassle, money and headache by informing them of my experiences and what i learnt. We are all still learning, no one here claims ot be a guru.

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Postby trdboy » May 22nd, 2009, 3:51 pm

AllTrac wrote:I'll give a rough explanation. The AFM gen 2 3sgte measures air by the air flow meter, which is right after the filter.
When the air is sucked in from the turbo the AFM measures the amount of air, sends the measurement to the ecu which would then know how much fuel to add to the air to create the optimum mixture. If you add a bov that releases air to the atmosphere, that would be air that was already meatured by the AFM before, so fuel would already be accommodated for it since it is now released to the atm you would have this extra fuel and no additional air to mix it thus making the mixture rich, drowning out your idle between shifts(thats when the bov releases the air) causing the engine to stumble, poor shifting, poor response and idle surging, fouled plugs, rich mixture, loss of performance.

If you add a vpc, it gets rid of the AFM and adds a map sensor which meters the air after the throttle body by the intake manifold which eliminates this problem. The 3rd gen 3sgte has a map sensor.


and this is exactly what i happening to me!! so fellas plenty info here but plenty arguements in between that could be avoided!!! basically i need a recirc instead of atmosphere ..kool and im working on that!! kerron gimme a call nah i wana know the status of those bad boys!!

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Postby TESTED performance » May 22nd, 2009, 5:12 pm

But to satisfy your english, you want me to be more specific? Okay, fine......you should not be running an atmospheric bov on a genII 3sgte that still uses the AFM.


that's much better. Takes a real man to admit when he's wrong. :wink:

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Postby gt4tified » May 22nd, 2009, 9:28 pm

^^^^ :?

admit: to own up, confess,acknowledge, come clean, disclose, divulge, declare;

specify: clarify: elucidate, make clear, explain, go into detail, spell out, simplify, shed light on.


The Dictionary- use it! :wink: :wink: :wink:

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Postby TESTED performance » May 22nd, 2009, 10:07 pm

gt4tified wrote:^^^^ :?

admit: to own up, confess,acknowledge, come clean, disclose, divulge, declare;

specify: clarify: elucidate, make clear, explain, go into detail, spell out, simplify, shed light on.


The Dictionary- use it! :wink: :wink: :wink:


thank you for specifying that you were wrong then.

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Postby gt4tified » May 22nd, 2009, 10:34 pm

*sigh* Like you and A1*2 in de same boat. Here hold this......

1pat.


Now, back to the thread:

All who running bov and who running bpv? Post ur setup!

I using a mr2 bpv routed back to my intake. I did a custom job...took the mr2 hotpipe, had a welding expert chop the flange off from it and weld it on to my 90-degree aluminum elbow. The hardest part of all was to get a 1" hose that would not melt and could make a 90-degree bend without kinking.

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Postby AllTrac » May 23rd, 2009, 10:18 am

man i regretted getting rid of my bpv, going back that route next week

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Postby gt4tified » July 7th, 2009, 2:26 am

Bump for all the non-believers:

Freshly dyno'd at a whopping 820awhp @ 39psi on race gas....ladies and gents I give you Mr. Pat Chin Sue's Celica Alltrac 2.4l 3sgte stroker, built and tuned by Cloak and Dagger Racing!

Image
Image
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He also did a 43psi pull but was getting wheelspin.....ON THE FRACKING DYNO!!!

Now go buy a sham-wow and clean up urselves! :lol:

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Postby AllTrac » July 7th, 2009, 8:56 am

weak sauce, 4efte 1.5 stroker kit ftw!!

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Postby haydn28 » July 7th, 2009, 9:10 am

haha

alltrac u still didn run shinakuma to show what 3sgte cud do , and shinakuma using a bamboo engine :lol:

any way i never open up a 3sgte , i want to know the shape of the top of the pistons and rough shape of the head (HEMISPHERICAL, whatever) guys thas all. :fadein:

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Postby trdboy » July 7th, 2009, 9:15 am

AllTrac wrote:weak sauce, 4efte 1.5 stroker kit ftw!!


Yuh done know

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Postby dmitc » July 7th, 2009, 9:32 am

gt4tified wrote:Bump for all the non-believers:

Freshly dyno'd at a whopping 820awhp @ 39psi on race gas....ladies and gents I give you Mr. Pat Chin Sue's Celica Alltrac 2.4l 3sgte stroker, built and tuned by Cloak and Dagger Racing!

Image
Image
Image
He also did a 43psi pull but was getting wheelspin.....ON THE FRACKING DYNO!!!

Now go buy a sham-wow and clean up urselves! :lol:

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Postby haydn28 » July 7th, 2009, 9:55 am

good time slip>dyno queen :lol: :lol:

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Postby AllTrac » July 7th, 2009, 10:10 am

haydn28 wrote:haha

alltrac u still didn run shinakuma to show what 3sgte cud do , and shinakuma using a bamboo engine :lol:


rofl so that makes it a default win, thats why i surrendered, 4efte ftw! 8-)

as for him running a "bamboo" engine as you like to put it, i could of sworn all engines from the bamboo came from japan, that would make a rb26dett a "bamboo" engine to, i guess mines came from the UK and was specially built by Fensport :shock: fensport block, fensport internals, fensport head and cams, since its unopened :lol:

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Postby AllTrac » July 7th, 2009, 10:13 am

haydn28 wrote:good time slip>dyno queen :lol: :lol:


before these new mods, last time i checked about almost 2 years ago, that celica did 10's, driven to the track and back, ralph is on the registry now, back then Patrick Chin sue did post his time slip.

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Postby A172 » July 7th, 2009, 10:22 am

AllTrac, :lol: :lol: :lol:

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Postby haydn28 » July 7th, 2009, 8:00 pm

A172 wrote:AllTrac, :lol: :lol: :lol:




X2 :lol: :lol:

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Postby AllTrac » July 7th, 2009, 10:11 pm

you like too much ah bachanal :lol:

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Postby honda hoe » July 7th, 2009, 10:21 pm

:lol: :lol: :lol:

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Postby legoRB » July 8th, 2009, 12:33 am

:fadein:

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Postby gt4tified » July 8th, 2009, 1:14 am

I coulda swear that "bamboo" was some new tuning company in Japan, like JUN or Mines oui! :lol:

Anyway, since allyuh dyno-queens must...here's Pat's 39psi pull:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hqMiVakdXso

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Postby haydn28 » July 14th, 2009, 3:30 pm

how much can the stock Rods handle ? and how much has any one pushed the stock pistons.. ? on the 3sgte.
i might look to install a 3sgte and take out the 4efte jus now in the corolla nah so :|
this is an unusually serious question from me :|

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Postby A172 » July 14th, 2009, 3:32 pm

1pat

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Postby gt4tified » July 14th, 2009, 7:18 pm

haydn28 wrote:how much can the stock Rods handle ? and how much has any one pushed the stock pistons.. ? on the 3sgte.
i might look to install a 3sgte and take out the 4efte jus now in the corolla nah so :|
this is an unusually serious question from me :|


Not that I think you incapable of being serious haydn28, but I'll bite:

The mr2 guys have been known to push the limits more on the stock gen2 engine, as the celica guys throw caution to the wind and use forged internals from more conservative power levels upwards.

As long as you can keep detonation under acceptable levels, the stock pistons can take 450bhp all day long. The rods can take around the same or even a bit more. Those who have had the rods shot-peened have claimed 700bhp as the tensile strength limit.

Hope this helps.

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Postby AllTrac » July 14th, 2009, 8:46 pm

haydn28 wrote:how much can the stock Rods handle ? and how much has any one pushed the stock pistons.. ? on the 3sgte.
i might look to install a 3sgte and take out the 4efte jus now in the corolla nah so :|
this is an unusually serious question from me :|


500hp on unopened engine.

Jeff "Hyde" MR2

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Re: The 3S-GTE performance thread!

Postby Monster 101 » November 5th, 2012, 6:31 pm

great thread.....


btw where can i tune my car with stock ecu......?

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Re: The 3S-GTE performance thread!

Postby gt4tified » November 6th, 2012, 12:29 am

Holy thread resurrection batman!

Stock ecu is not capable of holding a tune....if you mean playing with afr and ignition, daz another story, but I would still play it safe with at minimum an emanage.

What did you have in mind though Monster 101?

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