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Audiocontrol Epicenter Help

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anythingforreal
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Audiocontrol Epicenter Help

Postby anythingforreal » July 8th, 2021, 12:23 am

My Equipment
Xfire Audio e9005 5channel class d
Re Audio Scx 10 tuned to 34hz with an F3 about 29hz
Alpine type r components
Alpine 117 headunit



I listen to different genre of music, soca, rap, reggae, alternative rock and sometimes rebassed music. Formats included 320kbps mp3, 256kbps aac and original cds.

Mostly I listen to alternative rock (usb) and cds from Phil Collins, Michael Jackson etc which I get good mids and highs from but when is comes to getting bass or some kinda bass from listening to these genre of music well is SALT! Every other genre is pretty ok and rebassed music does make my car flex

Would a audiocontrol epicenter help me make my cds and rock music sound better and is there a one setting solution that will make my system sound better or is there a way to set this thing up that will let all the different music type I listen to sound good?

Daily listening volume most of the time is between 17-21. Only time I does play abit loud-ish is when weekend comes or a Sunday when I wash my car.

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Re: Audiocontrol Epicenter Help

Postby kavaninho » July 8th, 2021, 7:11 pm

Seems that your midbass is not prominent as it should be. Ensure that your woofers and sub are in phase. What your crossovers look like? Is the doors treated any?
I suggest you go with a sealed box as it is generally easier to integrate with door woofers.

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Re: Audiocontrol Epicenter Help

Postby david12 » July 8th, 2021, 9:22 pm

What I got from this is, that you want that rebassed kinda bass or even just more bass from those particular genres of music. Unless it's a technical issue like phasing or crossover points like mentioned before. If it's the first, then the epicenter is a solid addition.

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Re: Audiocontrol Epicenter Help

Postby Gladiator » July 8th, 2021, 11:05 pm

Invest in a player that can play Hi Res FLAC files... the same alternative rock music would sound much better in a higher quality format.

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Re: Audiocontrol Epicenter Help

Postby anythingforreal » July 9th, 2021, 5:14 pm

kavaninho wrote:Seems that your midbass is not prominent as it should be. Ensure that your woofers and sub are in phase. What your crossovers look like? Is the doors treated any?
I suggest you go with a sealed box as it is generally easier to integrate with door woofers.


Doors are treated with dynamat and dynaliner.
Crossovers are 100hz on the lp ( sub ) and 70hz on the hp ( mids )
components are running passive not active though so i have 2 channels not in use on the amp

Any body using a epi here i could get a demo ? Just asking

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Re: Audiocontrol Epicenter Help

Postby Rovin » July 9th, 2021, 6:29 pm

epi might be what ur looking for but b4 spending d $ on it try this

most decks wud have 2 custom eq settings , set custom 1 eq to play with songs that already bass heavy & on custom 2 for normal pop without much bass : adjust bass eq bands a bit higher like 3dbs or accordingly on 40-50-63-80 bands ... so custom 1 for heavier bass music then switch to custom 2 for when u playing softer songs that cud do with some bass boosting

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Re: Audiocontrol Epicenter Help

Postby kavaninho » July 9th, 2021, 8:46 pm

anythingforreal wrote:
kavaninho wrote:Seems that your midbass is not prominent as it should be. Ensure that your woofers and sub are in phase. What your crossovers look like? Is the doors treated any?
I suggest you go with a sealed box as it is generally easier to integrate with door woofers.


Doors are treated with dynamat and dynaliner.
Crossovers are 100hz on the lp ( sub ) and 70hz on the hp ( mids )
components are running passive not active though so i have 2 channels not in use on the amp

Any body using a epi here i could get a demo ? Just asking


How you ended up doing 100Hz on the sub? That's a bit weird given that the doors are doing down to 70. Dial back the sub low pass to 70hz and start adjusting the TA for the sub. Since you are ported the TA will be more difficult to get correct.

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Re: Audiocontrol Epicenter Help

Postby anythingforreal » July 9th, 2021, 10:29 pm

Rovin wrote:epi might be what ur looking for but b4 spending d $ on it try this

most decks wud have 2 custom eq settings , set custom 1 eq to play with songs that already bass heavy & on custom 2 for normal pop without much bass : adjust bass eq bands a bit higher like 3dbs or accordingly on 40-50-63-80 bands ... so custom 1 for heavier bass music then switch to custom 2 for when u playing softer songs that cud do with some bass boosting


This headunit has a 7 band graphic eq 80hz - 16hz
5 band parametric eq 63hz - 17.5khz
Hp crossover starts from 60hz-100hz
Lp doesn't have a crossover ( recently found out it plays at full range)
No custom eq or preset eq either

Not sure if my sub box is tuned to low hence why I may be missing out info

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Re: Audiocontrol Epicenter Help

Postby anythingforreal » July 9th, 2021, 10:53 pm

Could investing in a dsp or better headunit possibly work?
I'll play around with the crossovers and see if it help as well.

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Re: Audiocontrol Epicenter Help

Postby ruffneck_12 » July 9th, 2021, 11:41 pm

who designed the box?

Because currently Im doing a small prototype build and I tuned it ultra low for lulz, and I am not getting any appreciable bass.

Maybe your box is designed inappropriately and/or out of phase with your midbass.

Try playing around with your sub positions, and also turn off your sub and see if you're still getting the issue, that will rule out the sub.

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Re: Audiocontrol Epicenter Help

Postby Firewall » July 10th, 2021, 6:15 am

Can you give any examples of songs (specifics wrt album etc) where you identify the bass as lacking?

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Re: Audiocontrol Epicenter Help

Postby david12 » July 10th, 2021, 6:23 am

You said that rebassed gives you plenty of output so I doubt it's a technical issue try out what Rovin says if possible because I think those older songs just don't have bass that you're expecting.
Last edited by david12 on July 10th, 2021, 6:23 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Audiocontrol Epicenter Help

Postby Rovin » July 10th, 2021, 2:08 pm

sucks that ur deck doesnt have a custom 1&2 setting & limited features, maybe time to get a new 1

he said in his 3rd line of posting : Re Audio Scx 10 tuned to 34hz with an F3 about 29hz

box design is always important & like said above box position is equally as important , i have helped ppl gain a very noticeable difference by simply trying out a different position

i think it will come down to if d song just doesnt have much natrural bass recorded in it u will have to artificially boost lower freqs to ur liking but if u keep those boosted settings on songs with naturally heavy bass it will sound exaggerated & it will frig up ur sub too ...

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Re: Audiocontrol Epicenter Help

Postby anythingforreal » July 10th, 2021, 5:54 pm

Rovin wrote:sucks that ur deck doesnt have a custom 1&2 setting & limited features, maybe time to get a new 1

he said in his 3rd line of posting : Re Audio Scx 10 tuned to 34hz with an F3 about 29hz

box design is always important & like said above box position is equally as important , i have helped ppl gain a very noticeable difference by simply trying out a different position

i think it will come down to if d song just doesnt have much natrural bass recorded in it u will have to artificially boost lower freqs to ur liking but if u keep those boosted settings on songs with naturally heavy bass it will sound exaggerated & it will frig up ur sub too ...


In terms of headunit i really thinking to get another one like a 80prs but alot of people out of stock currently.
My sub is facing the rear with an off axis port facing left ( passenger side)
Im trying to have something simple like headunit ,amp and speakers ( trying not to have to much equipment )
Was told today by a friend that i should make use of the other two channels and go active with my comps or expand by using a wideband mid range to have a 3 way set up

My idea of have a good sounding system would be to make it sound like i have no sub in the trunk but to get good midbass infront while having them sound like they are playing below the 40hz range ( i know sub placement and phasing would have an impact here with most of the content i listen too.

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Re: Audiocontrol Epicenter Help

Postby anythingforreal » July 10th, 2021, 6:04 pm

Firewall wrote:Can you give any examples of songs (specifics wrt album etc) where you identify the bass as lacking?


between 40hz to 60 hz i would say

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Re: Audiocontrol Epicenter Help

Postby Firewall » July 10th, 2021, 6:19 pm

anythingforreal wrote:
Firewall wrote:Can you give any examples of songs (specifics wrt album etc) where you identify the bass as lacking?


between 40hz to 60 hz i would say
Lol.
Two things.
I was curious as to the songs so I could have played the exact ones myself to hear what it sounds like on my system.

Also, in some of those types of music, the midbass kickdrum impact is mistaken for "sub-bass"

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Re: Audiocontrol Epicenter Help

Postby Rovin » July 10th, 2021, 6:44 pm

40-60 shud be d easiest thing to get without even trying

might want to look into ur amp's lfp, hpf & ssf if it have 1 ... ry lowering ur lpf from 100 to about 80hz, it shud tighen ur bass response depending on ur enclosure design too

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Re: Audiocontrol Epicenter Help

Postby anythingforreal » July 10th, 2021, 7:02 pm

Firewall wrote:
anythingforreal wrote:
Firewall wrote:Can you give any examples of songs (specifics wrt album etc) where you identify the bass as lacking?


between 40hz to 60 hz i would say
Lol.
Two things.
I was curious as to the songs so I could have played the exact ones myself to hear what it sounds like on my system.

Also, in some of those types of music, the midbass kickdrum impact is mistaken for "sub-bass"


Phil Collins - Easy Lover
Yes- owner of a lonely heart
Seal - Kiss from rose

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Re: Audiocontrol Epicenter Help

Postby anythingforreal » July 10th, 2021, 7:06 pm

Rovin wrote:40-60 shud be d easiest thing to get without even trying

might want to look into ur amp's lfp, hpf & ssf if it have 1 ... ry lowering ur lpf from 100 to about 80hz, it shud tighen ur bass response depending on ur enclosure design too


well i suffering in that range lol
box is built to re specs - 1 cubic minus port and sub displacement

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Re: Audiocontrol Epicenter Help

Postby Rovin » July 10th, 2021, 8:10 pm

90% of d time factory recommended specs for whatever brands usually suck, they always give a small cuft so ppl will say oh it doesnt take up much space & buy that product when in fact if u plot close to a flat or low end response it can be as much 2 times recommended

go plot that sub to see how its response really is ...

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Re: Audiocontrol Epicenter Help

Postby nick639v2 » July 10th, 2021, 8:43 pm

Rovin wrote:90% of d time factory recommended specs for whatever brands usually suck, they always give a small cuft so ppl will say oh it doesnt take up much space & buy that product when in fact if u plot close to a flat or low end response it can be as much 2 times recommended

go plot that sub to see how its response really is ...
This x2... My 3510 recommended was 1.25-1.5 cubes, I plotted and ended up best results with 2-2.5 before displacement

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Re: Audiocontrol Epicenter Help

Postby anythingforreal » July 11th, 2021, 11:50 am

So using winisd i re calculated an enclosure.
using an enclosure of 1.4 cubic tuned to 35 hz ( minus port and sub displacement ) this is what im looking at on the graph

-3db - 28hz to 110hz
0 db - 30hz to 84 hz
3db - 33hz to 58 hz
5 db- 35hz to 49hz

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Re: Audiocontrol Epicenter Help

Postby anythingforreal » July 11th, 2021, 11:54 am

Rovin wrote:90% of d time factory recommended specs for whatever brands usually suck, they always give a small cuft so ppl will say oh it doesnt take up much space & buy that product when in fact if u plot close to a flat or low end response it can be as much 2 times recommended

go plot that sub to see how its response really is ...


-3db - 29hz to 111hz
0 db - 32hz to 85hz
3 db - 35hz to 60hz
5db - 38hz to 48 hz
peak is around 42- 43 hz

this is using the 1 cubic enclosure ( port and sub disaplacement not included ) tune to 35hz

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Re: Audiocontrol Epicenter Help

Postby Rovin » July 11th, 2021, 1:27 pm

if u have a 5db peak at 48hz which almost middle of 40-60 u say ur lacking i find that rel odd

like i said b4 adjust ur filters & eq 1st b4 u change anything else ...

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Re: Audiocontrol Epicenter Help

Postby anythingforreal » July 11th, 2021, 8:01 pm

So played around with the crossovers on the amp today and achieved abit more mid bass and very pleasing sub bass as well. Not exactly sure to as what are the crossover points though ( just played around with it until it sounded better)
Got a better up front sound stage with the sub as well but I think it's just that the music itself just doesn't have the sub bass Im expecting.

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Re: Audiocontrol Epicenter Help

Postby Firewall » July 11th, 2021, 8:32 pm

anythingforreal wrote:
-3db - 29hz to 111hz
0 db - 32hz to 85hz
3 db - 35hz to 60hz
5db - 38hz to 48 hz
peak is around 42- 43 hz



Can you explain this please. I'm a bit lost as to how this was generated.

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Re: Audiocontrol Epicenter Help

Postby anythingforreal » July 11th, 2021, 8:38 pm

Firewall wrote:
anythingforreal wrote:
-3db - 29hz to 111hz
0 db - 32hz to 85hz
3 db - 35hz to 60hz
5db - 38hz to 48 hz
peak is around 42- 43 hz



Can you explain this please. I'm a bit lost as to how this was generated.


This is what the graph looks like on winisd
It gives a range of what frequencies are naturally boosted by the enclosure.

I hope i explained that correctly

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Re: Audiocontrol Epicenter Help

Postby Firewall » July 12th, 2021, 9:35 am

Is it the transfer function graph? I guess what i am asking is how you get the range of values at a given db.

Eg. Afaik the transfer function curve intersects 0db at a given point. Not sure how to get the range, unless I'm reading it wrong

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Re: Audiocontrol Epicenter Help

Postby Rovin » July 12th, 2021, 6:30 pm

anythingforreal wrote:So played around with the crossovers on the amp today and achieved abit more mid bass and very pleasing sub bass as well. Not exactly sure to as what are the crossover points though ( just played around with it until it sounded better)
Got a better up front sound stage with the sub as well but I think it's just that the music itself just doesn't have the sub bass Im expecting.


exactly as i suspected, good to see u fiddle with it like i suggested & at least it improved .. 8-)

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