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Install of amps done......(Subject name changed)

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altec
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Install of amps done......(Subject name changed)

Postby altec » December 31st, 2020, 9:07 am

For those that have heard and played around with a jl tw3 sub....how much louder will 500 watts sound compared to 200 watts? I am referring to observable difference for an SQ oriented everyday use vehicle. Reason...I have two 4x100 channel amps to run comps in front and coax in the rear. I also have a mono 500watt amp for sub duty. That means there would be 2x100 watts not doing anything which can go to the sub and I would avoid installing the 500 watts amp. The amp rack frame is made and the placement of components is about to begin. I have kids so I need the rear speakers.
Last edited by altec on April 16th, 2021, 3:32 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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Re: Question time on my install again....amp question...

Postby SR » December 31st, 2020, 10:01 am

Use all 3 amps

500 mono on the sub
1 4 channel amp configure as follows
2 channels on the front rweeters
2 channels on the rear coaxials

2nd 4 channel bridged to 2 channels on the front midbass


:)

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Re: Question time on my install again....amp question...

Postby SR » December 31st, 2020, 10:03 am

Or
1 4channel to run the front comps
2 channels for tweets
2 channel for mid bass

2nd 4 channel
2 channels for rear coaxials
2 channels bridged on the sub

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Re: Question time on my install again....amp question...

Postby kavaninho » December 31st, 2020, 6:34 pm

SR wrote:Use all 3 amps

500 mono on the sub
1 4 channel amp configure as follows
2 channels on the front rweeters
2 channels on the rear coaxials

2nd 4 channel bridged to 2 channels on the front midbass


:)


Go with this option if space is not an issue.

The TW3 has no problem getting loud in a ported. The TW1 even does great justice on a 300W or so.

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Re: Question time on my install again....amp question...

Postby altec » January 1st, 2021, 5:42 pm

ok.....minor problems an annoyances continue to pop up.... wire paths looking like its a bother..... What is your take on the spacing between where the wire has to pass and the tire? On a side question....Is it possible to repaint the DSP and get exact color paint? Oh I need to test everything to make sure they are working since they were down for a couple years especially the DSP...i forgot it in an old shed for about a year.....fingers crossed that all is well.
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the problem of the wire placement
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What I want butt the rear wiring is a problem

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Re: Question time on my install again....amp question...

Postby Firewall » January 2nd, 2021, 9:55 pm

The sub in the spare looks awesome.

My take on your wiring is:

Square up the equipment instead of slanted as it looks to have more space that way.

If it does not, then mount the equipment on 1/2 spacers and drill the wire holes under them.

Either way once it gets under the floorboard.

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Re: Question time on my install again....amp question...

Postby Dave » January 3rd, 2021, 12:19 pm

Interesting spare tyre build. What went into making it?

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Re: Question time on my install again....amp question...

Postby altec » January 3rd, 2021, 2:04 pm

The sub could have been done better but the experiment was a first time. I use two sided tape and stuck strips of card board on the inside of the rim. Then I masked the cardboard off with painters tape. Oh I shaped the inside to allow space for the wheel' locking screw. The wheel is still bolted down. I went with a low profile tire( used) just to make space for the amps. I could have taped direct to the rim but I wanted space to allow for wheel balancing weights. It also leaves space to carpet the enclosue.

After that it was fiberglassing. I got shitty resin and hardener from Bhagwansingh which caused no end of problems. It was not hardening. I had to blast it with a heat gun set on high to force the resin to kickstart the hardening chain reaction. Before the heatgun I waited about 15 minutes and the mix was still liquid. This allowed some areas to seperate a bit because the resin was draining off from the glass mat. Worked like hell to try and fix that after curing. I thought it was me not getting good proportions of hardener to resin so I made sure the second time and same thing happened again. All my hard work to have the fiberglass level and minimum bubbles with up in smoke. Bought resin from another hardware after that and did an extra layer of glass, five in total.

I used an MDF ring to fiberglass the top. When I completed all glassing, I bolted the baffle to the ring with lots of wood glue. Wire was ran on top between the finishing board and the baffle. A groove was routered out for the wire which was filled and sealed with resin after the wire was installed, then the baffle was sanded flat. The finishing board is also bolted and glued to the baffle. This was an experiment to learn because I cannot pay for someone to do that kind of work. If the box eventually fail, I know I can rebuild it better. Resin really effed me up. Sub enclosure can be removed to take out the spare if needed.
Last edited by altec on January 3rd, 2021, 2:22 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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Re: Question time on my install again....amp question...

Postby altec » January 3rd, 2021, 2:20 pm

On a side note... I too old to be doing this kinda ah work....

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Re: Question time on my install again....amp question...

Postby Dave » January 3rd, 2021, 2:34 pm

Kudos for the time and effort. Full points for effort and execution.

I am in the same dilemma and was going to build similar but with a series of over lapping circles building up a lil at a time.

Same as you, don't want the hassle of removing a box plus getting younger lol.

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Re: Question time on my install again....amp question...

Postby nervewrecker » January 15th, 2021, 10:47 pm

Hey some reason from corsa. They are where I buy my polyester.

Use mold release on the rim or painters tape and foil strips. Water helps keep the foil in place.

Do a test batch. Some of my builds have info on it. Thinners is your friend and a half hard or stiff paint brush to press out bubbles.

I think was 5 to 8 drops of activator to half a coke can or three quarter.
You can bore the bottom and bolt the spare tyre through it. Use a good rubber seal to make it air thight.
Silicone from a silicone hose can work well. If not yellow jacket ac hose seals are like $5.00. they hold 500psi easy. Cut it in half or quarter. Don't overtighten. As you catch it, 1/8 turn again.

Can flush mount a baffle and pass wires through holes in the tyre.

Or slightly raised baffle drilled from the side to get wire in and seal it with caulk or silicone. I have a link for polyethylene if you want.

Them amps are complete garbage. Sell them, I buying all.

Can mount them to a board floor and make another raised false floor flush mount with the amps. Or sell me all.

Expanding foam is your friend to make shapes to pull mat over. Use a silicone barrier. I had resin eat styrofoam already. The silicone helped form a good thin barrier.

Also, resin and baby powder makes for a good finishing coat. A few layers as a matter of fact. Sanding and shaping is like sanding chalk.

And lastly, those amps not good, sell me them.

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Re: Question time on my install again....amp question...

Postby nervewrecker » January 15th, 2021, 10:50 pm

You can stick modeling clay or kids putty shiz along the bottom inside across and cut the edges flat. Make ridges as bracing. Two to three layers thick and you golden.

Can do a few from the center to the edges of you like..

Extra bracing.

Remove the putty and repeat.

Remember the foil or tape as a barrier. Rough up the surface of the enclosure nice before doing it.

Can use the baby powder composite for a nice sandable finish.

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Re: Question time on my install again....amp question...

Postby altec » March 20th, 2021, 7:18 pm

Small update.....wiring complete, next carpet going on plus straighten up wires a bit and add a few ties.... Not as neat as I wanted but safety box checked.
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Re: Question time on my install again....amp question...

Postby Rovin » March 23rd, 2021, 6:13 pm

like u decide to try a ting for urself ? ... thats d best way to get experience & learn

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Re: Question time on my install again....amp question...

Postby altec » March 23rd, 2021, 7:42 pm

My work is done with all the neaten up I could do plus carpet. Not me again, I am too old; back, knees and neck took a beating. Waiting for the car install part which I am not able to do or have the tools even to attempt.

BTW wired side is the underside...
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Re: Just my attempt at an amp rack......(Subject name changed)

Postby kavaninho » March 24th, 2021, 5:46 pm

Nice Job man!

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Re: Just my attempt at an amp rack......(Subject name changed)

Postby Rovin » March 25th, 2021, 11:35 am

i feel he watching dean & fernando ... :)

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Re: Just my attempt at an amp rack......(Subject name changed)

Postby kavaninho » March 25th, 2021, 7:17 pm

Rovin wrote:i feel he watching dean & fernando ... :)


I feel dean does pass through 500 strap in single car. :lol:

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Re: Just my attempt at an amp rack......(Subject name changed)

Postby altec » March 25th, 2021, 7:45 pm

yeah been watching 5 star for pointers. Went with a tie every 2 inch since the wires will be suspended by them.....and they look all "purddy".... :lol:
Last edited by altec on March 26th, 2021, 11:37 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Just my attempt at an amp rack......(Subject name changed)

Postby Rovin » March 26th, 2021, 11:13 am

dean is a boss at his job

however imo where it can be done i prefer wires ran underneath a panel & only piece u see is what comes out of a fitted hole going into amp , alot cleaner looking ...

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Re: Just my attempt at an amp rack......(Subject name changed)

Postby altec » March 27th, 2021, 3:52 pm

tadaaaaa....Not messing with the DSP as yet but the riser in the top right was made for it. Waiting time now. Onto the questions...
The JL 10tw3 sub is rated to 400 watts dual coil, but if the sub amp is ran 2 ohm then it will get around 800watts. Too much?
Kren suggested running one 4 channel bridged to the door mids. That means the alpine 100 watts mids will about 350 watts if the internet is correct. Too much?
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Re: Just my attempt at an amp rack plus......(Subject name changed)

Postby altec » March 29th, 2021, 6:41 pm

Had glass mat remaining so I tried modding the sails. Some bonding problems so hopefully it survives the install without breaking or cracking.
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Re: Just my attempt at an amp rack plus......(Subject name changed)

Postby kavaninho » March 29th, 2021, 9:16 pm

Excellent for a DIY

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Re: Just my attempt at an amp rack plus......(Subject name changed)

Postby altec » April 3rd, 2021, 1:05 pm

Changed the carpet color to black in order to blend in more. Enclosure walls could have been finished smooth but it will live inside a wheel and I did not want to do all that work....carpet went on as is.
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Re: Just my attempt at an amp rack plus......(Subject name changed)

Postby roger » April 6th, 2021, 10:46 am

Nice work dude....been following this build from the first post.

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Re: Just my attempt at an amp rack plus......(Subject name changed)

Postby timelapse » April 6th, 2021, 1:38 pm

Altec what's the total enclosure space? Not sure if you mentioned it before

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Re: Just my attempt at an amp rack plus......(Subject name changed)

Postby altec » April 6th, 2021, 2:28 pm

My averaging check is around 0.6 to 0.7 cubic feet. Its above recommended spec of 0.5. Looks larger than that but the top is three layers of 5/8 MDF to account for the fiberglassed ring, the baffle and finally the "beauty/finisher" ring.

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Re: Install of amps done......(Subject name changed)

Postby altec » April 16th, 2021, 3:53 pm

Update.....rack installed and connected at Kren Technologies. The connection to the factory system went ok but the factory signal is balls. There are loads of factory processing that is messing with the frequency range. Having said that, its my first attempt at dialing in a SQish tune which I have completed. Now who could do a FREE listen to check out my tune? I don't think it could get much better than it is now considering the signal fed to the DSP. KREN knows their business.

When the door was dismantled to access the tweeter wires we discovered that the electrician who previously installed the speakers two years ago, did some shortcuts. The speaker wires were butchered, the screws used were dry wall type and the connections were just twisted. Also, I bought stinger road kill for the doors, mister electrician used it on ONE DOOR ONLY So at a later date, doors will have to be redone inclusive of speaker change. That just proves why I rather pay techs out of my area. Pics when I clean up the vehicle but not much difference from what was posted.

BTW Rovin, I need 2 yards of black carpet, You still have the same thing I bought?

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Re: Install of amps done......(Subject name changed)

Postby SR » April 16th, 2021, 6:37 pm

What deck and was the output of the factory deck analysed to see whats going on with it? Also is the signal full range or separate for tweeter mid bass and sub. Many newer oem systems also have time alignement already set and it also affects sound when adding aftermarket

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Re: Install of amps done......(Subject name changed)

Postby altec » April 16th, 2021, 6:55 pm

Sportage oem deck with oem external amplifier. I used the helix to look at the input and there was very very low midrange apart from general ragged frequency . Input was summed, tweeter + mid and sub+ mid. The summed input channels were smoothened to about 4db+- overall an 8db difference. before general equalization. Channels are front mid an tweeter, rear coax, sub. Vehicle does not have factory time alignment and no center channel.

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