TriniTuner.com  |  Latest Event:  

Forums

Sub Woofer box tuning.

(I.C.E.)In Car Entertainment - Mobile Audio and Video

Moderator: 3ne2nr Mods

User avatar
jackal
Riding on 18's
Posts: 1675
Joined: April 20th, 2003, 9:50 am

Re: Sub Woofer box tuning.

Postby jackal » October 18th, 2020, 6:49 am

I am gonna experiment with port lengths when i come off work.

User avatar
Rovin
Trying to catch PATCH AND VEGA
Posts: 6179
Joined: January 23rd, 2014, 1:14 pm
Location: Heart of Chaguanas ...

Re: Sub Woofer box tuning.

Postby Rovin » October 18th, 2020, 1:04 pm

very same video i posted a lil higher up in this thread, at d time i was feeling lazy to embed it... is no scene if others didnt notice it :|

Rovin wrote:very 1st type of ports i ever did was circle ports [easiest thing to do-simply put a piece of pipe in a box even b4 i knew what tuning was] , i built many boxes & tried alot of stuff over d yrs that i noticed it a loooooong time ago , research & reading up on d science of it confirms my own real life experiences ...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jN-E1dfMfO0

https://physics.aps.org/articles/v8/94

User avatar
jackal
Riding on 18's
Posts: 1675
Joined: April 20th, 2003, 9:50 am

Re: Sub Woofer box tuning.

Postby jackal » October 21st, 2020, 6:58 am

Rovin wrote:very same video i posted a lil higher up in this thread, at d time i was feeling lazy to embed it... is no scene if others didnt notice it :|

Rovin wrote:very 1st type of ports i ever did was circle ports [easiest thing to do-simply put a piece of pipe in a box even b4 i knew what tuning was] , i built many boxes & tried alot of stuff over d yrs that i noticed it a loooooong time ago , research & reading up on d science of it confirms my own real life experiences ...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jN-E1dfMfO0

https://physics.aps.org/articles/v8/94


Rovin, I did view the video when you post it.

User avatar
rollingstock
TriniTuner 24-7
Posts: 17176
Joined: June 29th, 2009, 8:21 am
Location: Ain't got no chill!

Re: Sub Woofer box tuning.

Postby rollingstock » October 21st, 2020, 7:39 am

I pass the vid straight lol

User avatar
jackal
Riding on 18's
Posts: 1675
Joined: April 20th, 2003, 9:50 am

Re: Sub Woofer box tuning.

Postby jackal » November 2nd, 2020, 11:27 am

Crossectional view.jpg
So, the rain falling today, I could not go anywhere, so I went in and change the port length. I had 14" long 2" ports, so based on the WinISD Pro, for a 1.67 cu/ft box, I would need a 2.35" long port for a 35hz frequency and about 4" for a 29hz frequency. So I put a 4" long port. Will run it for a few weeks before making any changes.
Speaker.jpg
Port length.jpg

User avatar
Rovin
Trying to catch PATCH AND VEGA
Posts: 6179
Joined: January 23rd, 2014, 1:14 pm
Location: Heart of Chaguanas ...

Re: Sub Woofer box tuning.

Postby Rovin » November 2nd, 2020, 1:25 pm

based on what u typed something doesnt seem right , no way a 29 or 3hz tuning wud use such a short port for such a small cuft

double check ur calculations with this https://www.the12volt.com/caraudio/boxcalcs.asp

also - common local pvc pipe is never 2" or 4" , 4" is actually 4.3" ....

kavaninho
3NE2NR is my LIFE
Posts: 755
Joined: March 29th, 2008, 8:30 pm
Location: Gasparillo
Contact:

Re: Sub Woofer box tuning.

Postby kavaninho » November 2nd, 2020, 3:22 pm

That port area is super insufficient for the volume as well.

User avatar
rollingstock
TriniTuner 24-7
Posts: 17176
Joined: June 29th, 2009, 8:21 am
Location: Ain't got no chill!

Re: Sub Woofer box tuning.

Postby rollingstock » November 2nd, 2020, 5:00 pm

That size enclosure it's better to go sealed. Port noise is gonna be terrible with that small port. May sound okish at low excursion.

User avatar
jackal
Riding on 18's
Posts: 1675
Joined: April 20th, 2003, 9:50 am

Re: Sub Woofer box tuning.

Postby jackal » November 2nd, 2020, 6:13 pm

rollingstock wrote:That size enclosure it's better to go sealed. Port noise is gonna be terrible with that small port. May sound okish at low excursion.


The volume is very very close to what the speaker spec sheet recommends for a sealed box.

As it is right now, it sounding better, I getting a better "roll" on the bass.

But them speakers woking real good!! and I have enough power behind them.

User avatar
sMASH
TriniTuner 24-7
Posts: 17595
Joined: January 11th, 2005, 4:30 am

Re: Sub Woofer box tuning.

Postby sMASH » November 2nd, 2020, 8:46 pm

A box volume thst size will need a port at least a 4 inch pvc.

Block it off and see how it sounds. U might not get as much of a change as it is.

User avatar
sMASH
TriniTuner 24-7
Posts: 17595
Joined: January 11th, 2005, 4:30 am

Re: Sub Woofer box tuning.

Postby sMASH » November 2nd, 2020, 8:51 pm

1 4" pvc port about the length of that box will give u a nice response.

User avatar
rollingstock
TriniTuner 24-7
Posts: 17176
Joined: June 29th, 2009, 8:21 am
Location: Ain't got no chill!

Re: Sub Woofer box tuning.

Postby rollingstock » November 2nd, 2020, 10:15 pm

I can just imagine what the port velocity is on that.

User avatar
jackal
Riding on 18's
Posts: 1675
Joined: April 20th, 2003, 9:50 am

Re: Sub Woofer box tuning.

Postby jackal » November 3rd, 2020, 7:49 am

Rovin wrote:based on what u typed something doesnt seem right , no way a 29 or 3hz tuning wud use such a short port for such a small cuft

double check ur calculations with this https://www.the12volt.com/caraudio/boxcalcs.asp

also - common local pvc pipe is never 2" or 4" , 4" is actually 4.3" ....


Based on the software and using the actual internal diameter of the 2" PVC pipe, which is roughly 2.25", the 4" length is a pretty good port length. I will run it a few weeks and see how it goes and then i will seal it and test it again.

User avatar
jackal
Riding on 18's
Posts: 1675
Joined: April 20th, 2003, 9:50 am

Re: Sub Woofer box tuning.

Postby jackal » June 16th, 2021, 6:16 pm

So the tuning goes on...…

My Monoblock went into ground fault. Took it out and installed my Hifonics Zeus. The bass was greatly improved. 1000% better. Feeling the bass, getting the nice roll off the music, real loud.

So I decided to buy another Monoblock, thinking that my one was defective. Took up one today, a Pioneer 1600 X1. This was disappointing. No kinda bass, the speakers started to sound underpower.

I am thinking that I am missing something!

Anybody understand between the relationship between the two amps?

Now, let me give you the specs.

Speakers is 300W X 4ohm Single. The Zeus is, it think 100 X 4ohm by 4 channel and bridgeable.

Why did I get a better bass with the Zeus verse both Monoblock?

User avatar
jackal
Riding on 18's
Posts: 1675
Joined: April 20th, 2003, 9:50 am

Re: Sub Woofer box tuning.

Postby jackal » June 26th, 2021, 1:43 pm

So I realized that this is a technical question. Might be difficult to ans.

I did some research and this is the explanation for my poor bass line with the mono block amp.

Most car amplifiers provide specified amounts of power (wattage) at common impedance ratings measured in ohms. A mono channel amplifier for subwoofers rated at 300 Watts wired to 4 ohm impedance load (speaker combination), 600W RMS at 2 ohms impedance load, and 1000W RMS at a 1 ohm load.

A 2 ohm, single voice coil sub has a fixed 2 ohm impedance rating, so would draw 600 watts from this amplifier. The same 2 ohm sub with a dual voice coil would offer 1 ohm and 4 ohm connections, depending on whether you wire the two voice coil terminal pairs in series or in parallel. Choosing the 1 ohm wiring method for this sub would make 1000 watts available from the same amplifier.

In short, my impendence load was too high, 4ohm, and not matched correctly, 1ohm, hence not getting the power from the amp.

User avatar
rollingstock
TriniTuner 24-7
Posts: 17176
Joined: June 29th, 2009, 8:21 am
Location: Ain't got no chill!

Re: Sub Woofer box tuning.

Postby rollingstock » June 26th, 2021, 2:26 pm

The pioneer should be about 300wrms @4ohm
The 4 channel is 100x4 @4ohm, around 150x4@2ohm, so roughly 300wrms @4ohm bridged.

So in theory they should sound comparable. I reality the pioneer mono should sound better, the Zeus is playing at its lowest impedance rating, thd would be higher. The pioneer amps are underrated and thd should be low at 4ohm.

I think your settings somewhere is off. Was the mono bought used.

User avatar
jackal
Riding on 18's
Posts: 1675
Joined: April 20th, 2003, 9:50 am

Re: Sub Woofer box tuning.

Postby jackal » June 28th, 2021, 8:10 am

rollingstock wrote:The pioneer should be about 300wrms @4ohm
The 4 channel is 100x4 @4ohm, around 150x4@2ohm, so roughly 300wrms @4ohm bridged.

So in theory they should sound comparable. I reality the pioneer mono should sound better, the Zeus is playing at its lowest impedance rating, thd would be higher. The pioneer amps are underrated and thd should be low at 4ohm.

I think your settings somewhere is off. Was the mono bought used.


The Pioneer was brought brand new in box last week. It is a 1600W X 1 max. @ 1ohm So by deduction, 800W rms X 1 @ 1 ohm. It would be 400W X 1 @2ohm and 200W X1 @ 4ohm. My speakers a pair of MTX TC512, 300W rms and 900W peak at 4ohms.

So, I running two of these. My system should need 600W RMS @ 4ohm to really drive those speakers. With the configuration, it it getting 200W. If I parallel both speakers to get 2 ohm, I would have 400W, still having the speakers underpowered.

Was the same performance I was getting with the sound Magnus 1500 X 1 Monoblock.

This is why I come to the realization and after some research, it is how the system is configured. This is why the Zeus was giving out much more power; it was matched correctly.

I have another MTX 10" pack down somewhere in a box that was built to MTX speciation's, I think that this is a dual 2ohm, will try it out when I come off work and see if that makes a difference, will bring it down to 1ohm.

If all fails, I have to do the music in the Hilux. I have 2 KICKER 44CWCD104 CompC 10" 1000w Dual 4-Ohm pack down two years now and two matts 300W 6", bass box already built, just don't have the time. Still have to get another amp for the mids and highs.

User avatar
rollingstock
TriniTuner 24-7
Posts: 17176
Joined: June 29th, 2009, 8:21 am
Location: Ain't got no chill!

Re: Sub Woofer box tuning.

Postby rollingstock » June 28th, 2021, 8:57 am

Don't take this wrong but I believe the problem is you. And not having the knowledge or grasp of what you're doing.

User avatar
rollingstock
TriniTuner 24-7
Posts: 17176
Joined: June 29th, 2009, 8:21 am
Location: Ain't got no chill!

Re: Sub Woofer box tuning.

Postby rollingstock » June 28th, 2021, 8:58 am

The speakers are single 4 ohm each?

User avatar
jackal
Riding on 18's
Posts: 1675
Joined: April 20th, 2003, 9:50 am

Re: Sub Woofer box tuning.

Postby jackal » June 28th, 2021, 9:20 am

rollingstock wrote:Don't take this wrong but I believe the problem is you. And not having the knowledge or grasp of what you're doing.


Maybe so, but I doing much better than those people who calls themselves professionals.

User avatar
jackal
Riding on 18's
Posts: 1675
Joined: April 20th, 2003, 9:50 am

Re: Sub Woofer box tuning.

Postby jackal » June 28th, 2021, 9:20 am

rollingstock wrote:The speakers are single 4 ohm each?


Yep!

User avatar
SR
Chief Cook & Instigator
Posts: 13835
Joined: April 7th, 2003, 8:11 pm

Re: Sub Woofer box tuning.

Postby SR » June 28th, 2021, 11:56 am

https://www.pioneerelectronics.com/PUSA ... s/GM-DX871


If its this amp it does 500@ 2 ohm not 600

User avatar
rollingstock
TriniTuner 24-7
Posts: 17176
Joined: June 29th, 2009, 8:21 am
Location: Ain't got no chill!

Re: Sub Woofer box tuning.

Postby rollingstock » June 28th, 2021, 1:24 pm

jackal wrote:
rollingstock wrote:The speakers are single 4 ohm each?


Yep!


Are you wiring the subs parallel or series?

8Ohm load for the bridged 4 channel is ok but you have to wire to 2ohm for the mono

User avatar
rollingstock
TriniTuner 24-7
Posts: 17176
Joined: June 29th, 2009, 8:21 am
Location: Ain't got no chill!

Re: Sub Woofer box tuning.

Postby rollingstock » June 28th, 2021, 1:25 pm

jackal wrote:
rollingstock wrote:Don't take this wrong but I believe the problem is you. And not having the knowledge or grasp of what you're doing.


Maybe so, but I doing much better than those people who calls themselves professionals.


I can believe that :lol:

User avatar
jackal
Riding on 18's
Posts: 1675
Joined: April 20th, 2003, 9:50 am

Re: Sub Woofer box tuning.

Postby jackal » June 28th, 2021, 3:38 pm

SR wrote:https://www.pioneerelectronics.com/PUSA/Car/Amplifiers/GM+Digital+Series/GM-DX871


If its this amp it does 500@ 2 ohm not 600



You see, even less than what I quoted.

Now this is a man (SR) who is a professional and a real professional.

User avatar
jackal
Riding on 18's
Posts: 1675
Joined: April 20th, 2003, 9:50 am

Re: Sub Woofer box tuning.

Postby jackal » June 28th, 2021, 3:39 pm

rollingstock wrote:
jackal wrote:
rollingstock wrote:The speakers are single 4 ohm each?


Yep!


Are you wiring the subs parallel or series?

8Ohm load for the bridged 4 channel is ok but you have to wire to 2ohm for the mono


Parallel.

User avatar
rollingstock
TriniTuner 24-7
Posts: 17176
Joined: June 29th, 2009, 8:21 am
Location: Ain't got no chill!

Re: Sub Woofer box tuning.

Postby rollingstock » June 28th, 2021, 4:29 pm

How are you wiring both subs to the 4 channel? I'm guessing two channels bridged per sub? So each bridged channels seeing a 4 ohm load?

User avatar
rollingstock
TriniTuner 24-7
Posts: 17176
Joined: June 29th, 2009, 8:21 am
Location: Ain't got no chill!

Re: Sub Woofer box tuning.

Postby rollingstock » June 28th, 2021, 4:31 pm

My advice go by a professional cause I'm convinced you're doing chit and blaming the equipment.

User avatar
jackal
Riding on 18's
Posts: 1675
Joined: April 20th, 2003, 9:50 am

Re: Sub Woofer box tuning.

Postby jackal » June 28th, 2021, 4:53 pm

rollingstock wrote:My advice go by a professional cause I'm convinced you're doing chit and blaming the equipment.


Not blaming equipment, already identified that the system was not matched properly.

Too much fraud men out there.
Last edited by jackal on June 28th, 2021, 4:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
jackal
Riding on 18's
Posts: 1675
Joined: April 20th, 2003, 9:50 am

Re: Sub Woofer box tuning.

Postby jackal » June 28th, 2021, 4:57 pm

rollingstock wrote:How are you wiring both subs to the 4 channel? I'm guessing two channels bridged per sub? So each bridged channels seeing a 4 ohm load?



When I bridge the amp, each speaker to a bridged channel, so +200W (from the Zeus 25 year anniversary edition) going to each speaker.

Advertisement

Return to “I.C.E. / Car Audio Tech”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 5 guests