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audio installers who cut corners

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sickbad
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audio installers who cut corners

Postby sickbad » November 10th, 2021, 5:50 am

I had a chance to assess my install and i've found:

0 gauge front to back CCA hidden in nylon braided wrap
old house lamp wire taped up in electrical tape (tapped into the 0 gauge under the dash)
joined used-wire for my amplifier again hidden in wrap.. everything looked pretty

this was after the installer was preaching that my system needed full copper this and that.

frankly, he talks too much charged thousands of dollars and kept my car for a full week.
Does this happen alot? why he would choose to rip off customers, to pay his bills?
I am pissed. don't know how to approach the situation. do we let forever be or attack with full force?
is it worth a few thousand dollars.. the stress, retribution ?
I've had to visit other installers and done over the work myself, of which I am grateful for learning the craft.
-but really? took me a few weeks to get copper, crimp, feruls, shrink stuff that this experienced person who says he owned a store could not acquire in all the grey hairs on his head? Do i see it as a really expensive lesson : metaphoically, litterally, financially ?

lord put a hand.
installer if you are reading this - shame on you, ironically you take advantage of people as they do not understand electronics. You cannot practice the craft and call yourself a professional when behind the books cover, you hide the same inferior materials you told the customer to stay away from. You are really an embarrassment to yourself through your work and the establishment who graciously sends you work. income. bread and butter for the family.
Last edited by sickbad on November 10th, 2021, 4:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: audio installers who cut corners

Postby *KRONIK* » November 10th, 2021, 6:38 am

Inside

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Re: audio installers who cut corners

Postby Dave » November 10th, 2021, 7:16 am

Call names. Let ppl know what they are possibly being subjected too.

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Re: audio installers who cut corners

Postby david12 » November 10th, 2021, 8:13 am

It's only a few people I trust to do a full installation not any and everybody. Some of these installers do things like:

Cut out the factory speakers and use them instead of the plastic adapters which are commonly used now.

I've seen cut radio harnesses from so called big installers already
etc.

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Re: audio installers who cut corners

Postby sickbad » November 10th, 2021, 8:42 am

story goes.

i acquired a ztreet 4chan, zap2000 from a ttuner and xtr6.5 and 6x9 with entry level pioneer deck in retail store ( all from trinituner links)

installer quotes $1800 labour and $2000 supplies. after all i need full copper and a few sound deadnening mats are expensive he could get a whole box of deadner for $1000 (included in accessory expense)

on his advice i returned the deck and got a new one online, installer said retail store is waste of time and he could source product cheaper for me, himself.

i also got a battery for $1200 as i have a stock alternator.

towards the end of the job he ran out of accessory money and needed $500 for more "full copper"

I bought a used RE12" and equalizer for $2000 for him. the EQ was scrapped because it interferred with the DSP. not the best guidance as he recommended kenwood for tonnes of features. little did he know the EQ would just work with 2 channels.

ISSUES:

    i was peeved that the Ga wire used was 16Ga, after all 90RMS and 180RMS speakers need something like 14, or 12 Ga. he ran the speaker wire to the front harness (toyora 22Ga : to slip through the door and attached a 8" piece of 16Ga to the speaker? he soldered all wires to speaker terminals, no clips.

    the power wire from the 2nd batter to the 4channel was 2x4Ga wires soldered in the middle, taped up good and made pretty with nylon wrap.

    the 2 front doors and only trunk lid have deadener, don't know if that is a "whole box" that he got afterall.

    he cut the cca 0 gauge coming from the engine bay to power the deck with house lamp wire.

    i discovered yesterday that the only piece of material that could have value front to back was infact cca in nylon it has that cheap light non copper weight to it.

he does not pick up my calls. i have a question about a random wires on the install that i do not know is for. so yea gave him $6100 for the labour supplies used sub w ox and used EQ

so far ive spend a couple hundred in full copper proper gauge speaker wire, ran it through the doors myself, fresh 0 OFC for the amplifiers. will have to get that full front to back run in OFC to right his wrongs.

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Re: audio installers who cut corners

Postby timelapse » November 10th, 2021, 10:29 am

That real sickening to think about.Thats half the reason I diy yes.At least you know what you paying for.Some installers out there have no clue what they doing.A friend of mine has a system where the amp was connected using 2.5 house electrical wire.Sub enclosure was supposed to be sealed, but the wood was cut real badly.Air leaks everywhere.With the carpet you couldn't see it.He actually paid somebody to do this.He checked me after because he knows how my setups sound and look.I not professionally into it, but still a heap better than the quack he paid.
One weekend: Half day work and a duck on the fire,I taught him how to wire his car properly and we even did a big 3 upgrade for future additions.All it cost him was wire, ferrules etc. and a duck.Next day we built an amp rack and rebuilt his sub box.
Moral: Check out an installer's previous work, and talk to his clients.
If you going diy, ask your questions here

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Re: audio installers who cut corners

Postby kavaninho » November 10th, 2021, 11:45 am

Very unfortunate you had to experience this like much others who did not share their story. As suggested, speak to other customers that had services done at the establishment in the past. Upholstery covers alot mal-work and can be easily deceiving.
A dishonest installer is far more worse than one with poor workmanship, simultaneously, striving to achieve better.

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Re: audio installers who cut corners

Postby nick639v2 » November 10th, 2021, 12:31 pm

Post or pm me said installer na, so I'll know up front where not to go.

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Re: audio installers who cut corners

Postby david12 » November 10th, 2021, 3:33 pm

^^ Same pm me the name and if possible a contact number

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Re: audio installers who cut corners

Postby sickbad » November 10th, 2021, 4:18 pm

JOEL KHAN #caraudio #subwoofer #audio #bass #audiomobil #carstereo #caraudiofab #caraudiofabrication #car #caraudiosystem #spl #basshead #soundquality #customcaraudio #pioneer #caraudioinstallation #sound #music #volt #audiocar #speaker #subwoofers #caraudioaddicts #v #lowbass #aintloud #sundownaudio #loudsound #bhfyp
#cars #amplifier #stetsom #ddaudio #woofergram #deafbonce #loud #jlaudio #customaudio #chuchero #pridecaraudio #midrange #rockfordfosgate #soundigital #soundsystem #prvaudio #alphard #caraudioworld #dbdrag #custom #ds #kenwood #speakers #woofer #caraudiolife #jbl

, referred by Rovin. ironic because the installer was trying to undermine the same person who sends him business.

have a look at the oem harness and a little 16Ga tail. who is he fooling . could a 90RMS speaker get proper feed from 16Ga to 22Ga to 16Ga..

theres the 4Ga splice solder.

lamp wire tap into 0 ga CCA under the dash.

and frayed ends, which he says he solders instead of feruls.
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Re: audio installers who cut corners

Postby Rovin » November 10th, 2021, 7:40 pm

sometimes with a good mind intention i try to help customers & installers out not expecting something like this would happen, This referral makes me look bad because i sent a customer to somebody who represents himself as a experienced knowledgeable person who does proper work but from what i heard over the phone from OP yesterday it was not so.

not to make excuses but like others here have said i have seen bad work from other reputable installers too , i cannot get time to do installs when my store is open, its risky to put ur head on a block to refer others.

In the past i myself have gotten bad referrals from ppl i trusted regarding mechanics, masons, plumbers, electricians, builders , autobody shops, some stores etc ... understandably this kind of stuff will trip anybody off especially when money & dishonestly is involved but before i end up in trouble i call it loss, like Op said on phone : let karma deal with that

I wish i was informed early when this happened so i could have tried to help make amends by offering my time\labor free of charge to correct bad work the guy did , even if new wiring is needed at cost from suppliers etc.

I already indicated this to OP via PM a few hrs ago but looks like he didnt see my message ... as i already said on phone & via pm i already apologized for what he went through ... :( ... obviously i wont refer anybody to that guy again, has me frighten if to ever recommend anybody else too

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Re: audio installers who cut corners

Postby rollingstock » November 11th, 2021, 12:14 pm

Is best I become an installer.

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Re: audio installers who cut corners

Postby sickbad » November 11th, 2021, 1:24 pm

thanks for your input everyone. i'll take the short end of a stick. I just walked into a retail store, bought some speakers a deck, got a referral and I'm the big clown. Sorry don't want discounts, apologies or free tips. I WANT MY 0 GAUGE wire for my >$6K install which I paid for. too bad poor unskilled installer has squandered that the same week of the install.

Money is hard to come around for some people and telling the customer full copper and you give CCA is not a joke.

Really wish I put the feeler out on facebook and met real business owners and/ craftsmen who are passionate about their work. simplistic, trinicustoms, pink something to name a few

I'll urge any customers of JOEL KHAN of CHAGUANAS to have a look at what was given to you for the hard earned money that was paid. Because you definitely cannot judge a book by its cover. Very dishonest -He would make a good furniture reupholster with glue and what not, but should stay out of car audio this lifetime around.

what's that saying about word of mouth: customer is happy and would spread word of mouth, conversely they will tell 10 people negative reviews of the experience.

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Re: audio installers who cut corners

Postby sickbad » November 13th, 2021, 5:25 am

its like putting a sock in yuh jockeys.

MORE cheap 4Ga CCA with nylon braided.. looks almost like a 0Ga. Really wonder how people could sleep knowing they are talking to the customer premium and giving him pauper.

so maybe I have the grounding surface area of a BIG 2.

the only items of value would be the nylon braided wrap. thanks JOEL 767-3291 for all your amateur car audio install efforts. time to hang up the hat, there are teenagers old who are more competent as we can see from the work.
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Re: audio installers who cut corners

Postby timelapse » November 13th, 2021, 7:31 am

OP.
Sorry for your loss.What that guy did is effed up.
You seem to be distrought,as you should be.
If you have the time, do it over yourself.It will be a good learning experience, and,if something goes wrong while you on the road somewhere in the future,you will be better equipped to troubleshoot.There are fellas who will buy your wire.Listen for zesser music.Prime targets.
If you letting someone else do it for you,be a little more hands on.Inspect it at every stage.This is your car and your safety that you are talking about.I personally do a piece of sheit in my car where a wire was mislabeled and I roast a door speaker.I also passed a wire where it interfered with my e brake back in the day.Sheit happens.
If you need any advice , we got your back here .

Just a question:Put an equipment list here and type of vehicle.That 4 awg may work depending on what you running.

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Re: audio installers who cut corners

Postby fatboy slim » November 14th, 2021, 4:02 pm

I bought a new pioneer headunit from Joel Khan back in 2006 and saw the same one for $200 less in a retail store. I kicked myself in the ass for that one. :lol: :lol:

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Re: audio installers who cut corners

Postby sickbad » November 15th, 2021, 6:26 am

Thanks, the support means alot. perhaps ill share the build on a separate thread.

one question i had about the wiring was .. he ran a speaker wire +&- from front to back. say + was the 12VDC remote for the monoblock and the 4channel. the other wire (i forgot to take pictures where it went) measures 0.2VDC which research says is the deckoutput, what would that wire possibly be for? grounded? i'm stumped.

To the pioneer deck man.. geeze at least yours was still a pioneer and not an fake with wireloom hiding his lies, shame and reputation

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Re: audio installers who cut corners

Postby timelapse » November 15th, 2021, 6:47 am

Possibly for power antenna if you have one, or he just used both the +- and connected to the amps.If that loose somewhere in there, you have a problem....

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Re: audio installers who cut corners

Postby SR » November 15th, 2021, 3:41 pm

$1800 labor.........clearly i charge to cheap

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Re: audio installers who cut corners

Postby shake d livin wake d dead » November 18th, 2021, 9:01 am

Firstly: hard luck boy op boy....live and you learn I guess. No matter how much the system cost, a loss is a loss because it's hard earned $. However, you WILL get over it!!!

Secondly: afaik, a 1amp system usually costs around $800-$1200( labour). Cost of wires would depend on brand etc etc. That being said(learnt this the hard way). NEVER buy wires/jacks etc from an "installer" . Get a list of what he needs and go buy it yourself. A lot will be saved.

This brings me to another point. Imo, there are only a handful of reputable installers out there and even the so called good ones have a few tricks to hide. The car audio industry is turning out to be a BIG turn off if you ask me. Installers only studying to milk men(especially if you clueless about the sport).

One eg: a good friend was gifted some nice equipment(no he doesnt know nothing about the stuff eh). He visited an installer, told him what he has(18 sound speakers etc), installer say "nah that is s$^%...buy what I have(Gt pro).... it way better. Again, my friend is clueless so he gave in, did the hook up etc....long story short, I took the same 18 sound speaker he had and compared to the speaker he bought.....man got turn off one time!!!

And this is just one example. Op...dbu...enough people in here to guide you through a good build. Hang in there

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Re: audio installers who cut corners

Postby ruffneck_12 » November 21st, 2021, 10:28 am

rollingstock wrote:Is best I become an installer.



yeah, dunning-krueger effect


The people who know plenty, know exactly how much they don't know as well. So they think that they're dumb


Meanwhile the people who dotish, don't know how much they don't know. SO they'll charge an arm and a leg for sheit wuk

So go thru dawg. Become a premium installer

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Re: audio installers who cut corners

Postby kavaninho » November 21st, 2021, 11:18 am

ruffneck_12 wrote:
rollingstock wrote:Is best I become an installer.



yeah, dunning-krueger effect


The people who know plenty, know exactly how much they don't know as well. So they think that they're dumb


Meanwhile the people who dotish, don't know how much they don't know. SO they'll charge an arm and a leg for sheit wuk

So go thru dawg. Become a premium installer


This summarizes my life.

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Re: audio installers who cut corners

Postby rollingstock » November 21st, 2021, 3:14 pm

ruffneck_12 wrote:
rollingstock wrote:Is best I become an installer.



yeah, dunning-krueger effect


The people who know plenty, know exactly how much they don't know as well. So they think that they're dumb


Meanwhile the people who dotish, don't know how much they don't know. SO they'll charge an arm and a leg for sheit wuk

So go thru dawg. Become a premium installer


Lol I'll never make it. I have a soft heart, one sad story and I does ready to take out my own equipment

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Re: audio installers who cut corners

Postby timelapse » November 23rd, 2021, 8:24 am

rollingstock wrote:
ruffneck_12 wrote:
rollingstock wrote:Is best I become an installer.



yeah, dunning-krueger effect


The people who know plenty, know exactly how much they don't know as well. So they think that they're dumb


Meanwhile the people who dotish, don't know how much they don't know. SO they'll charge an arm and a leg for sheit wuk

So go thru dawg. Become a premium installer


Lol I'll never make it. I have a soft heart, one sad story and I does ready to take out my own equipment
You're the kind of installer that cuts corners on sandwiches and things then lol

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Re: audio installers who cut corners

Postby rollingstock » November 23rd, 2021, 9:12 am

Nah me ain't no installer. I just have a little knowledge and a Buttload of tools.

The so called installer not too far from me always calling by the gate to borrow my hydraulic crimper. While ago he calling but I was taking a sheit, priorities I didn't answer. He saw me later and told me is best he hold on to it as I hardly ever use it and when I need it I can borrow it.

Irl I'm a nice respectful person, but he got some MC in he arse. Pass I see him with a chisel grind down in the center and a hammer. Necessity is the mother of invention :lol:

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Re: audio installers who cut corners

Postby kavaninho » November 23rd, 2021, 11:48 am

rollingstock wrote:Nah me ain't no installer. I just have a little knowledge and a Buttload of tools.

The so called installer not too far from me always calling by the gate to borrow my hydraulic crimper. While ago he calling but I was taking a sheit, priorities I didn't answer. He saw me later and told me is best he hold on to it as I hardly ever use it and when I need it I can borrow it.

Irl I'm a nice respectful person, but he got some MC in he arse. Pass I see him with a chisel grind down in the center and a hammer. Necessity is the mother of invention :lol:

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

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Re: audio installers who cut corners

Postby sickbad » November 24th, 2021, 6:06 am

[he calling but I was taking a sheit, priorities I didn't answer. He saw me later and told me is best he hold on to it as I hardly ever use it and when I need it I can borrow it.]

The nerve people have. This guy used my work drill while my car was by him for the week. I know this because the batteries were depleted.

Hence why we admire work from people like josh electronics. Very clean install, invests in the tools of the trade, uses proper terminal ends and has a close eye to detail with wire management which all has elements of making the sound delivered best.

And these people can charge premium prices, their work speaks for itself. Too bad Robin isn’t chummy with A class artists as such. And he is so right, DIY.. YouTube, but shop around because montrose/gopauls is very competitive and their customer service is also excellent.

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Re: audio installers who cut corners

Postby sickbad » December 6th, 2021, 1:51 am

Image

Running fresh cable through the doors ? Leave it for the for professionals. Need to save time ? Simply send your wiring to the oem harness because that goes through the doors ! Duh here is a step by step tutorial how we do things to make top dollar by Joel Khan

Image

Need power on the jiffy? Store closed and you spent it all on perfume and the pastor?

Grab some lamp cord, make incisions where convenient and wrap up tight with electrical, Tesa tape, you can even use masking tape! The customer will never know.

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Re: audio installers who cut corners

Postby VexXx Dogg » December 9th, 2021, 11:10 am

OMFL, that man going to burn down somebody car.

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Re: audio installers who cut corners

Postby timelapse » December 10th, 2021, 1:59 pm

That is actually the first time I ever see a ratch like that.Man special yes

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