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Postby teems1 » September 21st, 2009, 12:31 pm

JoKeR1980 wrote:But if they ban Briatore and Symonds...why Nelson get away? he went ahead and crashed the car! its not the army where you have to follow every order.

I would like to see which team gonna employ him now


Flavio used a 2009 F1 drive at Renault to help entice him.

Rookies always do what the higher ups tell them to. Look at Hamilton earlier this year in Liargate at the Australian GP

Renault got away easily imo compared to McLaren's verdict in Spygate, which was 100m USD fine and disqualification from the WCC that year.

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Postby AutoSport » September 21st, 2009, 12:58 pm

Really how come McLaren got a $100M fine and Renault got a suspended sentence?

And just getting rid of Briatore?? he should face the Court also.

Just goes to show what happens behind the scenes when the money in sports gets to such incredible heights.

Look at the drivers, you want me, X million dollars, you want to get rid of me, 2X million dollars.

F1 needs to look at other areas to cut costs, instead of limiting testing and R&D.

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Postby Monk BANzai » September 21st, 2009, 2:42 pm

AutoSport wrote:Really how come McLaren got a $100M fine and Renault got a suspended sentence?

And just getting rid of Briatore?? he should face the Court also.

Just goes to show what happens behind the scenes when the money in sports gets to such incredible heights.

Look at the drivers, you want me, X million dollars, you want to get rid of me, 2X million dollars.

F1 needs to look at other areas to cut costs, instead of limiting testing and R&D.


yuh understand?......see?...EVEN MEH FADDA notiec it......but naaaaaaaaaaaaah!!!....

But Briatore cannot have any involvement with any F1 event, team or driver for life!

It gets complicated because he manages both Alonso, Webber, and owns a piece of Kovalienen so it looks like he'll have to end his contracts with them at the end of the season.

Dude just cost himself $10MM a year easy...

FIA forcing drviers that are under him to let him go....sheit....out in tha cold!!

from www.f1.com.
As regards Mr. Briatore, the World Motor Sport Council declares that, for an unlimited period, the FIA does not intend to sanction any International Event, Championship, Cup, Trophy, Challenge or Series involving Mr. Briatore in any capacity whatsoever, or grant any license to any Team or other entity engaging Mr. Briatore in any capacity whatsoever. It also hereby instructs all officials present at FIA-sanctioned events not to permit Mr. Briatore access to any areas under the FIA’s jurisdiction. Furthermore, it does not intend to renew any Superlicence granted to any driver who is associated (through a management contract or otherwise) with Mr. Briatore, or any entity or individual associated with Mr. Briatore. In determining that such instructions should be applicable for an unlimited period, the World Motor Sport Council has had regard not only to the severity of the breach in which Mr. Briatore was complicit but also to his actions in continuing to deny his participation in the breach despite all the evidence


man cud only go races and watch we!! and yuh hadda PAY full spectator price!!...

UKLE Rawle...yuh reading?....EH?
:twisted: :twisted: :twisted:

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Postby teems1 » September 21st, 2009, 3:38 pm

He's banned from the FIA paddock also.

At least he could boast having knocked up Heidi Klum...

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Postby Duane 3NE 2NR » September 21st, 2009, 11:36 pm

^ some people say winning is cheating without getting caught - I guess this time, this one got caught.

Piquet Jr. got immunity for talking. Teams may still seek the services of Briatore and Symonds when or if their ban expires. But I'm sure Nelson better start looking for some taxi to drive.

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Postby noshownogo » September 22nd, 2009, 8:29 am

I wouldn't even give Nelson Jr. the safety car to drive, he that slow. :lol:

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Postby TREX » September 22nd, 2009, 4:18 pm

AutoSport wrote:Really how come McLaren got a $100M fine and Renault got a suspended sentence?

And just getting rid of Briatore?? he should face the Court also.

Just goes to show what happens behind the scenes when the money in sports gets to such incredible heights.

Look at the drivers, you want me, X million dollars, you want to get rid of me, 2X million dollars.

F1 needs to look at other areas to cut costs, instead of limiting testing and R&D.


Is Race...

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Postby JoKeR1980 » September 22nd, 2009, 4:49 pm

Flavio Briatore's fate was sealed by the evidence of a secret whistleblower within Renault, codenamed 'Witness X'.

:shock:

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Postby Maserati » September 22nd, 2009, 5:39 pm

JoKeR1980 wrote:Flavio Briatore's fate was sealed by the evidence of a secret whistleblower within Renault, codenamed 'Witness X'.

:shock:


who could that be?????????? :shock: :shock: :lol:

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Postby teems1 » September 22nd, 2009, 5:50 pm

Maserati wrote:
JoKeR1980 wrote:Flavio Briatore's fate was sealed by the evidence of a secret whistleblower within Renault, codenamed 'Witness X'.

:shock:


who could that be?????????? :shock: :shock: :lol:


Image

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Postby AutoSport » September 22nd, 2009, 11:18 pm

Doh forget, that Briatore also said, in a dotish attempt at trying to deny the facts....
"So if I tell him to go and kill somebody, yuh think he will listen to me?"

Look Briatore was not fined one Euro, and he made millions from Renault, and even more millions from the commissions from the drivers he managed, so he must be smiling all the way to his young girlfriend who going an have a baby for him sometime soon.

His punishment as stated above is called "being warned off" - get lost from anything to do with F1.

Also everybody coming down on Piquet jr, but face it, this is the top of racing, and he figured if he did not comply, he is out, and like all persons who in crime, he figured they would never be found out, and he would have his seat for a long time.

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Postby Monk BANzai » September 22nd, 2009, 11:38 pm

AutoSport wrote:Doh forget, that Briatore also said, in a dotish attempt at trying to deny the facts....
"So if I tell him to go and kill somebody, yuh think he will listen to me?"

Look Briatore was not fined one Euro, and he made millions from Renault, and even more millions from the commissions from the drivers he managed, so he must be smiling all the way to his young girlfriend who going an have a baby for him sometime soon.

His punishment as stated above is called "being warned off" - get lost from anything to do with F1.

Also everybody coming down on Piquet jr, but face it, this is the top of racing, and he figured if he did not comply, he is out, and like all persons who in crime, he figured they would never be found out, and he would have his seat for a long time.


X2

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Postby noshownogo » September 23rd, 2009, 8:05 am

Doh get me wrong, I commend Piquet Jr. for standing up to his boss and the "system" but that still doesn't make amends for being a slow driver. He was being out performed by just about everyone on the grid.

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Postby JoKeR1980 » September 24th, 2009, 12:08 pm

WTF @ point #5!!!!????


There were no winners only losers out of the Singapore race fixing 'scandal'. Nelson Piquet Junior may have been given Max Potter's cloak of immunity, but that won't get him a race drive.


1.Nelson Piquet Junior may not expect forgiveness, let's hope he doesn't expect another competitive race drive that his father doesn't have to pay for. NASCAR might be his best bet. They love drivers who crash, even ones that do it deliberately. And if you want, you can get fat and still drive.


2.The punishments handed down to the Renault team by the FIA seem more or less fair considering the severity of the crime. But you have to wonder what the penalty might have been if the team in question had been Mclaren? The Renault team's skullduggery was far in excess of anything that McLaren did during spygate in 2007 and they got a $100m fine. What's more - Renault's offence was only a year after they had been caught doing virtually the same thing as McLaren.

On the basis that McLaren got $100m for some industrial espionage, we should be talking in the $150m region for starters. However Max Mosley knows that if he did that, it would be curtains for the Enstone team and one less engine brand on the grid. His hands were tied...


3.Flavio should have been given a ban for five years not a lifetime. Considering we have a cherished former World Champion who is gagging to get back into a race seat who has caused two deliberate crashes to try and win two World Championships, it seems a bit odd that Flavio got a lifetime ban while all Michael had to do was join a road safety campaign. As with so many things FIA, the punishment doesn't seem to fit the crime, it seems to fit the individual.


4.The FIA are right to stop Briatore, or any other F1 team manager, from becoming a driver manager as well as a team manager. From now on it is common sense that you do one or the other.


5.Nelson Piquet Senior has now had it exposed in the international press that he asked Flavio Briatore to move his son from London to Oxford to keep him away from a 51-year-old 'friend'. Nice one, Dad.


6.Fernando Alonso should sue Nelson Piquet Senior for libel as Senior insisted that Alonso had known about the race fix. What's more, when he was asked to withdraw his remarks he did so very grudgingly, hinting very heavily 'he should have known what was going on with that strategy'.

As Andrew Davies said in Team-Mate Wars, even if Fernando had been in on the plan he probably would have expected Junior to crash it at Turn 13 on Lap 17.

And Alonso still had to work very hard for that win. Nelson's crash just gave Fernando a big advantage. As we saw from Sutil's later crash, another Safety Car could just as easily have wrecked it for Alonso and swung the advantage in someone else's favour.


7.Eddie Irvine and Derek Warwick are right to say that skullduggery has gone on in F1 since it began. There are not many team managers and drivers out their with a totally clear conscience. Alain Prost, who has been mooted as a potential new boss of Renault, condemned the Singapore racefix...but didn't he once crash into the side of Ayrton Senna deliberately at Suzuka? And what about when he asked the Ferrari mechanics to secretly transfer team-mate Nigel Mansell's chassis to him. He's not spotless.

Eddie Jordan has said the affair beggars belief, but then so does claiming you did a $150m deal with Vodafone via a mobile telephone from the back seat of a taxi. Scratch the surface...


8.Nelsinho won't be getting a Christmas card from Felipe Massa. Yet it's wrong to jump to the conclusion that had there been no accident in Singapore then Felipe would have been World Champion. In the following race, the Japanese GP at Mount Fuji, Massa made a desperate attempt to pass Lewis Hamilton on the opening lap with a wreckless move that was never going to work and which sent Lewis out of the points. Had Massa arrived at the GP with a Singapore win under his belt he would never have felt the need for such a rash move.

It's just another motor-racing 'what if'.


9.The words 'Nelson' and 'Piquet' will now form a verb, the meaning of which is to deliberately crash your car, i.e. "I thought, 'what the hell' and Nelson Piquet-ed it into her rear bumper."


10.The affair only reinforces the view that there needs to be a new broom at the FIA and that when Max Mosley retires, Ari Vatanen should take over. Most important is the consistent application of F1's rules. Had the Singapore race stewards enforced the rules that were so strictly adhered to in Belgium (about leaving the track) just two races previously, then Alonso would have been serving a drive-through not cheating his way to victory. Also, it was the poor framing of the Safety Car rules that led to Briatore and Symmonds being able to exploit a situation where cars couldn't pit for fuel when they needed to, without a penalty.


FH

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Postby JoKeR1980 » September 24th, 2009, 12:10 pm

also...it if was deemed that Renault cheated to win that race, does that mean that Alonso's win will be taken from him? if so..........Massa is the champ!

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Postby JoKeR1980 » September 24th, 2009, 12:14 pm

sorry, I know its another long, pasted article but its some good stuff!

The Unanswered Questions From Crashgate


They think it's all over. It isn't yet...


* Given what occurred in Singapore and the obvious potential for revenge it offered to Nelson Piquet Jr if he was axed, just what was Flavio Briatore thinking when he sacked him without so much as an assurance that the youngster could become the team's winter test driver? Was this the greatest miscalculation and misjudgement of Briatore's career?


* As the Singapore GP has essentially been declared a fix, should the result be declared void? Will Ferrari raise this matter with either the FIA or the courts in the knowledge that Felipe Massa will - albeit retrospectively - be crowned world champion if the race is wiped from the record books?


* Max Mosley said that Renault's punishment was "the harshest one we can, because Renault have demonstrated they have no moral responsibility for what took place". What happened to the principle of collective responsibility as laid out in the FIA International Sporting Code which states that 'the entrant shall be responsible for all acts or omissions on the part of their driver, mechanic and passengers, each equally responsible for any breach of this code'?


* What now for Briatore at Queens Park Rangers? How does his lifetime ban from F1 relate to the Football League's fit and proper persons test, if at all?


* Renault have been found guilty of deliberately crashing one of their cars at over 100mph, thereby putting driver, competitors, stewards and spectators at danger. As they issued their verdict, was anyone at the FIA aware of how uncomfortably Renault's non-punishment punishment sits alongside the governing body's crusade to improve road safety?


* Why is Renault's ban only suspended for two years? The World Motor Sport Council will only activate this disqualification if 'Renault F1 is found guilty of a comparable breach during that time'. So only if they fix another race before 2013? As this was a crime without precedent in the history of the sport, that's not much of a punishment or deterrent against general wrongdoing is it?


* The monetary difference in the punishments meted out to Renault and McLaren is approximately $98m (Renault have to pay the costs of the investigation and hearing). Has there ever been a more persuasive advertisement for confession?


* To what extent was Renault's 'lenient' punishment the result of their willingness to admit their guilt and to what extent was it caused by a fear that they would quit the sport if heavily punished?


* Why haven't we heard from Briatore? Was his silence agreed as part of his severance from Renault?


* Is Nelson Piquet Jr still being paid by Renault? He says he agreed to crash in order to keep his seat for 2009 so if he is to be paid up until the end of the season then he will have gained considerable financial reward for the subterfuge. Is that right? Is that even legal?


* Who is the mysterious 'Witness X' at Renault? And who at Renault knows his identity?


* Were Ferrari waiting for Fernando Alonso to be officially exonerated before making a definitive decision or announcement on their 2010 driver line-up? Or is the decision still to be made regardless of Alonso's innocence?


* Who will become the manager of Alonso, Romain Grosjean, Heikki Kovalainen and Mark Webber in the wake of Briatore's expulsion? In the wake of such a severe dent to the sport's credibility, should the FIA impose a 'one manager, one driver' directive?


* Was Fernando Alonso the first person to ever appear as a witness in front of the World Council dressed in a pair of jeans?

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Postby Maserati » September 24th, 2009, 4:03 pm

ING and Mutua Madrilena Drop Renault

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/78831

Renault title sponsor ING has terminated its deal with the French car manufacturer with immediate effect on the back of the team being found guilty of fixing last year's Singapore Grand Prix.

Just days after Renault was handed a two-year suspended ban for its involvement in causing a crash in Singapore 12 months ago to help Fernando Alonso win, ING dropped a bombshell in the early hours of Friday morning when it announced it was ending its involvement in the team immediately.

A statement issued by ING confirmed that it had chosen to pull its sponsorship deal because of the events of the last week.

"ING announced today that in light of the verdict of the World Motor Sport Council of 21 September 2009 concerning the events that occurred at the 2008 Singapore Grand Prix, ING will terminate the contract with Renault Formula 1 with immediate effect," said the statement.

"ING is deeply disappointed at this turn of events, especially in the context of an otherwise successful sponsorship. As announced on 16 February of this year, ING decided not to renew the three year sponsorship (2007-2009) contract with Renault F1 and to end its presence in Formula 1 after the 2009 season."

A spokesperson for the Dutch banking giants confirmed to AUTOSPORT that the decision will result in the ING logos being removed from the cars and other team areas.

However she stated that ING's commitment to trackside advertising would remain until the end of the year.

ING's decision comes hours after Spanish insurance company Mutua Madrilena announced that it was also ending its Renault sponsorship deal as it felt the team's involving in the race fixing scandal amounted to a breach of contract.

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Postby Monk BANzai » September 24th, 2009, 5:05 pm

Joker....good opinions...

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Postby JoKeR1980 » September 25th, 2009, 8:28 am

what I really want to find out is if Alonso's win would be taken from him, making Massa the WC!

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Postby Freelander » September 25th, 2009, 10:46 am

JoKeR1980 wrote:what I really want to find out is if Alonso's win would be taken from him, making Massa the WC!


dont say that!!!

rasta man will go on a rampage!! :shock:

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Postby noshownogo » September 25th, 2009, 11:01 am

rasta does go on rampage either way, all this talk already making him feel oppressed.

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Postby Maserati » September 25th, 2009, 3:19 pm

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/motorsp ... 274747.stm

Red Bull's Sebastian Vettel clocked the quickest lap of Friday practice for the Singapore Grand Prix as crashes interrupted each session at Marina Bay.

The German lapped in one minute 48.650 seconds in the second session to beat Renault's Fernando Alonso by 0.274secs.

Rubens Barrichello topped the first session ahead of his Brawn team-mate and championship leader Jenson Button.

Renault's Romain Grosjean and then Red Bull's Mark Webber crashed out on the dusty, slippery street circuit.

The first session was stopped for 10 minutes half-way through after Grosjean lost control of his Renault and crashed at Turn 17.

The Frenchman's mishap was laden with irony as it was at the same point where former Renault driver Nelson Piquet Jr was ordered to crash last year, the controversial race-fixing incident which saw Renault handed a suspended ban from F1 this week.


Webber, who was third fastest in the first session, was running aggressively at the top of the timesheets around the hour mark of the second when he crashed head on into a wall on the pit straight.

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Postby Maserati » September 25th, 2009, 3:24 pm


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Postby teems1 » September 25th, 2009, 3:25 pm

Red Bull looks to have the advantage here. They'll also have it in Suzuka and Interlagos.

Brawn should be on the upper hand in Abu Dhabi tho...

The WDC could be kinda close, it all depends on how the Renault engines hold up for them, esp Vettel...

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Postby Freelander » September 25th, 2009, 5:59 pm

^^ yeah i hope the cool night air doesnt affect the tires too bad for the brawns

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Postby Monk BANzai » September 25th, 2009, 7:53 pm

noshownogo wrote:rasta does go on rampage either way, all this talk already making him feel oppressed.


massa? WC? DE FORQUE!!!!!


:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

i just glad that Hammie aint the token black in all this commes...and that llayuh realise that Piquet cyar drive fuh sheit!! (well in dem circles....im sure he cud well drive cirlces around us!!)

memba dis?

</param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/FiLoANg6nNY&hl=en&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="560" height="340"></embed>

maybe Piquets Future?

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Postby JoKeR1980 » September 26th, 2009, 9:30 am

qualy in 30 mins

5.Nelson Piquet Senior has now had it exposed in the international press that he asked Flavio Briatore to move his son from London to Oxford to keep him away from a 51-year-old 'friend'. Nice one, Dad.



buh allyuh miss dis?^ dat alluding to Nelson being a egg layer? :shock: :shock:

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Postby JoKeR1980 » September 26th, 2009, 10:44 am

Button and Kimi out in Q2! :shock:

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Postby JoKeR1980 » September 26th, 2009, 11:15 am

Pos No Driver Team Q1 Q2 Q3 Laps
1 1 Lewis Hamilton McLaren-Mercedes 1:46.977 1:46.657 1:47.891
2 15 Sebastian Vettel RBR-Renault 1:47.541 1:46.362 1:48.204
3 16 Nico Rosberg Williams-Toyota 1:47.390 1:46.197 1:48.348
4 14 Mark Webber RBR-Renault 1:47.646 1:46.328 1:48.722
5 23 Rubens Barrichello Brawn-Mercedes 1:47.397 1:46.787 1:48.828
6 7 Fernando Alonso Renault 1:47.757 1:46.767 1:49.054
7 10 Timo Glock Toyota 1:47.770 1:46.707 1:49.180
8 6 Nick Heidfeld BMW Sauber 1:47.347 1:46.832 1:49.307
9 5 Robert Kubica BMW Sauber 1:47.615 1:46.813 1:49.514
10 2 Heikki Kovalainen McLaren-Mercedes 1:47.542 1:46.842 1:49.778

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Postby Maserati » September 27th, 2009, 10:58 am

congrats to hamilton.

got to see the nookie cat doll jump up again :lol: :lol:

Glock second
Alonso 3rd

*edit* WTF you can't say $ussy 2nr edits it :? *

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