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Ported or Sealed???

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§ephiroth
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Ported or Sealed???

Postby §ephiroth » March 6th, 2006, 11:53 pm

I have 2 audiobahn 12" speakers... Met a guy today at my mech. with some pretty good music in his car,(3 12's) Anyway he was telling me something about a sealed box works better for the speakers....And that the ported one we have kills the lifespan. Any good music people on the site can help me out....or advise. He also says the sealed box gives a lower base line etc.. We had a sealed box before and the pigtail wire buss out because of the pressure inside..Anyway all help and advice is greatly appreciated.

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Postby MBC Autotronix » March 7th, 2006, 8:44 am

^^^i feel he said that cause a sub in a sealed box handles more power than the same sub in a ported box.

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Chiney
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Postby Chiney » March 7th, 2006, 8:48 am

dude... ah sealed box give a faster tighter bass... the responce is also faster with ah sealed box and it need more power to actually run a sub in a sealed enclosure.. as for ported..they sumtimes call it the amplification enclosure.. i actually never found out y..but this requires less power to make a sub perform but it is very important u get the tuning of the port corect or u can mash up that sub..

i not to great on this topic but i guess thats my 2 cents..

guys here kno their stuff.. SR..nigel1977..monster power.
jus some of the guys u shud take info from seriously.. trust me :idea: :wink:

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SR
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Postby SR » March 7th, 2006, 8:53 am

i prefer sealed
as it is more accurate and givesa wider frequency response

downside wont be as loud as a ported box

if you are looking for loud then go ported
now dont get me wrong 2 12's sealed will be quite loud but not as loud as ported
downside
box size is going to be big

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crazybalhead
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Postby crazybalhead » March 7th, 2006, 8:57 am

Listen, the speakers were probably damaged because of uncontrolled excursion below the tuning frequency of the box. This probably happened due to a ratch design and improper tuning.

Educate yuhself hoss...

http://www.diysubwoofers.org/

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Chiney
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Postby Chiney » March 7th, 2006, 8:57 am

^^ wat he said..i forgot to tell u that port iz bigger dan sealed..wat models r de audiobahn and wat is de amt of power u goin to put on it?

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Postby VexXx Dogg » March 7th, 2006, 9:04 am

some speakers are built with specific applications in mind.
make sure the speaker is designed for a sealed enclosure if yuh want a sealed box for it.

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crazybalhead
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Postby crazybalhead » March 7th, 2006, 9:06 am

^^^
The power doesn't make much difference. What is important are the thiel small parameters.

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- Rovin's car audio -
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Postby - Rovin's car audio - » March 7th, 2006, 12:34 pm

Very simply put - check the QTS of a sub

below 0.5 - its rec that it be sealed
above 0.5 - ported is rec

this is general rule that d majority of subs (95%) follow

- however ppl do dey own damn thing & jess say "Yeh marn tha box size looking awright - tha go wk good so!" & when dey sub get 4cup dey scatching dey head wondrin y .............. :mrgreen:

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Postby whome » March 10th, 2006, 3:37 am

ROVIN... check your recommendations.

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Postby Cid » March 10th, 2006, 12:44 pm

i have 2 12" in 2 seperate sealed box and they work really great, i love the tight low bass, the air pressure inside the box acts like an air break for the cone that is why it can handle alot more pressure without ripping to shreads and also why it doesnt sound so good when u dont have enough power..

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Postby Tuner Imports » March 12th, 2006, 11:39 am

whome wrote:ROVIN... check your recommendations.

what ROVIN said is quite right so WHOME check yourself.....and read the exact things that rovin said over until u figure it out...

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Postby MonsterPower » March 12th, 2006, 12:21 pm

quite right , i have come across some models audiobahn that is recommended to work in sealed enclosures only and some that will work well both in sealed and ported so i think the model will make a diffrence as i have seen pple in trini use subs that were not designed for what they doin
take a little example, the juggernauth sub...it is an SLP subwoofer only and still pple in trini feel once dey drop it in a box and it playin it sound good...and when it burn dey ask demselves what dey do wrong ..simply put wrong sub wrong application

pored boxes generally take alot less power than the sealed boxes but u give up speaker handling as the ported enclosure u lose some control,worse yet if it is improperly designed

all in all i say decide what u want i.e sound q system or just a loud everyday playing system taking into account ur amp powr and design ur box around that as those factors will determine what box u have to use

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Postby Staggers » March 12th, 2006, 1:49 pm

MR. ROVIN wrote:Very simply put - check the QTS of a sub

below 0.5 - its rec that it be sealed
above 0.5 - ported is rec

this is general rule that d majority of subs (95%) follow



SOUNDGOD_MODSHOP_INC. wrote:
whome wrote:ROVIN... check your recommendations.

what ROVIN said is quite right so WHOME check yourself.....and read the exact things that rovin said over until u figure it out...


WHOME was on point with his comment... it's ROVIN who got his recommendations mixed up

From diysubwoofers.org
Almost any driver can be used in a ported enclosure system, however, only drivers which have a Qts value between 0.2 to 0.5 will generally give satisfactory results. If the driver has a Qts above 0.4, try using it in a sealed enclosure or single reflex bandpass system instead.

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Postby nigel1977 » March 12th, 2006, 3:49 pm

If you know your stuff, you'll know what program this is.


Image

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Postby whome » March 12th, 2006, 4:22 pm

Hey young fellas, I was reading the Thiele Small academic papers BEFORE most manufacturers even knew what it was all about and what the implications were. That was before some of you were even born.

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Chiney
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Postby Chiney » March 12th, 2006, 6:57 pm

^^^ wha allyuh feel it is? ah rankin game??

wayy

that program that nigel is usin.. it ah veryyy good one.. use it.. if u kno wat it is..

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kaotik
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Postby kaotik » March 12th, 2006, 9:42 pm

what is the version of the program (nigel1977)?

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nigel1977
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Postby nigel1977 » March 12th, 2006, 9:48 pm

muhahahahahahaha. im not telling....














































beta

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Postby 33 hertz » March 12th, 2006, 10:21 pm

well whome if you that experienced then u should know who nigel 1977 is and you really wont be questioning his knowledge or advice. I really cant understand why pple cant have a logical discussion on car audio without getting on like they know everything. The more you talk and discuss things is the more you learn. Practical knowledge is just as valueable as book knowledege and the best way to gain that is through talking bout your personal experiences thats why the forums here

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Postby whome » March 13th, 2006, 2:03 am

Efficiency Bandwidth Product =EBP (Fs/Qes) is indeed a good guide. However you can get drivers which can go either way depending on what transfer function you're looking for and your intended application.

For the newbie, woofers have different "behavior patterns" depending on a lot of factors when it was designed/made. These factors/specs describe the woofer in "action".

Qts which is called total Q combines an electrical factor as well as a mechanical factor. (magnets and suspension have major roles here)
In addition the woofer has a springiness. This spinginess is expressed as a function of something like a "compression ratio". If you take a piston and compress it in a long cylinder it will fell soft. Take that same piston and compress it in a short cylinder and it will fell hard. If the speaker soft, it will have a larger Vas than one that is hard.
The weight of thespeaker cone etc will then want to bounce up and down at a certain frequency that is the resonant frequency. That is called Fs. Put all of these things down and you get general Thiele Small parameters. Throw them into some math equations and you get speaker simulation at SMALL SIGNAL Levels. Generally this will give an idea of where you're going. At large power levels, things get a little more complicated because things get NON LINEAR and distortion start happening. Thisngs like the size of the port, the suspension travel etc.... come into play.

To get an idea of a sealed box, imagine your car and its suspension. The wheel, the coil and shock absorber. The spring is like the size of box you use on the speaker. So you have a car and you can't change the shocks but you can play with the springs. What happens when you put on real hard springs. The car bouncing around up and down like crazy - like some people with chopped springs. That fellas is a very small sealed box. The air spring in the box too hard for the shocks in the speaker. The car bounces a lot a high frequency ...... boomy bass. But the car could take a lot of licks without bottoming........high power handling.

Now put on some soft springs and keep the same shocks. the car is now tight and the shocks holding the car good. That is like a big sealed box. The spring is soft and the shocks keeping the bass tight. BUT the car spring so soft it keep bottoming......low power handling.

Now what is that ported box like on a car. Imagine you use TWO different springs in a line on the car AND you use TWO shocks in a line too. Like TWo short springs to make one long one and two shocks to make one long one. Now try to imagine what happens. It's not that simple to predict right? Well that is something like a ported box. it's a lot more complicated and if you don't get the spring and shocks right, the susepnsion does a lot of funny things.....like a badly tuned ported box. ( Actually this model is missing a weight at the joint of the springs and shocks.)

Now imagine how complicated a bandpass gets!!!!!!! Three springs in line!!!!!!

That is why sealed boxes is the friend of the builder who doesn't have instruments to tune the ported box. It's hard to go badly wrong and you have an idea of what type of change to expect when you reduce or increase the size of the box. Go smaller, get boomier bass higher infrequency and higher power handling. Go bigger, get tighter bass, lower notes but reduced power handling.

I highly recommend Brian Steele's site as someone else has indicated. Once you start modeling The graph of SPL, excursion and power is invaluable to see why some megawatt subs are destroyed in ported boxes with as little as 20 watts.

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crazybalhead
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Postby crazybalhead » March 13th, 2006, 7:18 am

^^^ That's the site I recommended, I have been reading his stuff for years now.

Good explanation on the resonances with the springs.

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nigel1977
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Postby nigel1977 » March 13th, 2006, 10:30 am

gr8 job whome. lol. excellent info.

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Postby Loprofile PC » March 13th, 2006, 1:25 pm

knowledgeable fella (whome):roll:

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33 hertz
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Postby 33 hertz » March 13th, 2006, 8:36 pm

excellent info whome nice analagies.

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nigel1977
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Postby nigel1977 » March 13th, 2006, 9:05 pm

yo 33 you coming ice meeting wed?

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Postby 33 hertz » March 13th, 2006, 9:42 pm

man i real wanna come but thats my birthday. I trying to go fridays for dinner so i could check youall though but i not too sure if that plan will work out. But count me in on the next event for sure

§ephiroth
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Postby §ephiroth » March 14th, 2006, 10:59 pm

iight fellas thx for the info will look into those stuff some more

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audioangel
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Postby audioangel » March 20th, 2006, 11:31 am

i does use dat same program .......its very helpful when yuh building speaker box.....das y i was wondering bout dat thing rovin was saying too....guess he get ah little mix up.....lol

§ephiroth
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Postby §ephiroth » March 20th, 2006, 12:39 pm

Ok fellas got the info

Box Vol. 3.5 cubic feet

2, 4/1/4" ports (13 inches long)

Sub Model AWC12Q

Amp A2800E

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